Jb fo pay

[Beechnut]

. However, to me, there's more to a job than just the pay and benefits.

My eyes are rolling around in my head so fast I can't see straight.

 

[johnsonrod]

Believe me, I understand that. Which is why, if hired, you won't see me complaining about pay and benefits. I know a lot of guys at my current carrier that came in kinda starry eyed only to start complaining about things less than 6 months later. Some have never stopped. However, to me, there's more to a job than just the pay and benefits. There's a lot of intangibles that make B6 a good fit for me and my family. Plus, it doesn't mean the pilots shouldn't stop working to raise those pay and benefits.

Don't tell Management!!!!!! They'll distribute free pizzas in lieu of pay raises just to make you feel better about yourself...

From what I have heard, if you fly the E-Jet and fly the "regional" schedule/routes that it flies day in and day out, the non-pay intangibles will become less important.

 

[Blue Dude]

However, to me, there's more to a job than just the pay and benefits. There's a lot of intangibles that make B6 a good fit for me and my family.

Which "intangibles" are those? Believe me, after 10 years of "intangibles" and excuses, not much matters *except* pay and benefits.

 

[Lake Alice]

Intangibles will not fund your retirement or put your children through college and the amount deducted from your pay check for health insurance is staggering. It is unlikely you will upgrade based on current aircraft orders and our retirements number in the low double digits at most. I'm not saying you shouldn't come here but understand this is purely a stepping stone. American, USair and United are poised to turn over 50% of their pilot groups within the next 10 years. Even under bankruptcy contracts their benefits and retirement are substantially better than Jetblue's. This is a very important decision. Do so with your eyes wide open.

 

[BeachBummer]

Which "intangibles" are those? Believe me, after 10 years of "intangibles" and excuses, not much matters *except* pay and benefits.

Have to agree!! Why the heck else do you go to work? The great satisfaction of transporting people from city A to city B? You go to work to get a pay check and have benefits!!

From what I have heard, if you fly the E-Jet and fly the "regional" schedule/routes that it flies day in and day out, the non-pay intangibles will become less important.

The only intangible I've gotten from the E190 is a numb back side. 4yrs baby!

 

[$$$4nothin]

So the phrase JetBlue is better than Mesa is not what any of us are striving for. Bet lets say he is from Mesa. Why would you not try to make your life better in every way. Sure JB might be a stepping stone. But getting stuck at JB for 7-10 yrs is better than being stuck at Mesa for 7-10 years and that is a fact.

For the 5 of you that do nothing but complain I have a question. Did you study anything about JB before you came here. Did you not know what medical and benefits you were getting before you chose to work here. Either you did, in that case stop complaining. Or you didn't and your an idiot. I have a feeling that all of you that complain non stop are actually makeing a lot more money than you did when you started here.

If JB is a just a stepping stone for you, that is great. Leave and get your better life at Delta/AA/United/wherever. Your constant complaining about sub par medical and retirement is getting old though. Everyone who is on FI and trying to get hired at JB know that the medical and retirement suck. They are improvements on there current lives though, and you can't fault a guy for improveing his life.

These guys didn't vote the union down so go complain to the next guy you fly with that did.

 

[BeachBummer]

Flying airplanes is not some philisophical magic. It is a job. It's what we do. Go to work get paid, make as much as you can before it all folds. That's all man. Yea, we knew what we were getting into. So did the guys at SWA afew years back. So did the guys at VA and Delta and UAL when the pay was suck. Did that stop them from improving or trying to improve what they had? yea i didnt' think so.

Look, I get your stoked to work for a bigger airline. I am too. Frankly I really love working here.

I had this conversation with my wife. It is better than XJT and Chicago express. WAY BETTER! It's supposed to be. That's why we all came here. The point is that it's not just complaining, these are the deficencies in your personal contract. We are working to make it better. What you call complaining i see as explaining. You havn't been here long enough to see what's been going on for the last 10 years. Not a shot at you man, just reality. Don't mistake my pointing out of our short commings as a sign of loathing for the company. We all want this gig to last for 33ish more years.

Don't just blindly follow because it's "what you signed up for" this game is dynamic and you better know how to read the cards. If you don't maybe listen to all sides before you are so happy to just take what you get because that's what's there.

Be happy your here, you should be. Don't settle for sub par wages and benni's. Especially when you'r managers tell you that you have industry average.

 

[oldxfr8dog]

Forget it. I give up.

 

[pal]

Intangibles will not fund your retirement or put your children through college and the amount deducted from your pay check for health insurance is staggering. It is unlikely you will upgrade based on current aircraft orders and our retirements number in the low double digits at most. I'm not saying you shouldn't come here but understand this is purely a stepping stone. American, USair and United are poised to turn over 50% of their pilot groups within the next 10 years. Even under bankruptcy contracts their benefits and retirement are substantially better than Jetblue's. This is a very important decision. Do so with your eyes wide open.

While we are treated very well in the jumpseats and I can understand the pain many have suffered, I have met very few American, USAir or United pilots who don't despise their company and pretty much hate going to work. Who wouldn't like better pay and benefits, regardless of what you currently have??? JB is a good place to work and I have met few here who don't like their job. The hard core whiners are a bit exhausting at times, but I bet most will remain at JB even after the upcoming hiring at all of these "destination airlines" kicks in...

While I share some objectives with the whiners, their approach could use some adjustment. Most have no real world private sector business experience outside of the cockpit, so their views are a bit distorted. I'm onboard with the goal of improving our lot in life, but I refuse to be miserable and jump on the liberal anti-corporate anti-profit train just because you think I should... I am objective and not a "juicer," but in this case, the middle ground is where the sanity resides.

 

[kellwolf]

While we are treated very well in the jumpseats and I can understand the pain many have suffered, I have met very few American, USAir or United pilots who don't despise their company and pretty much hate going to work. Who wouldn't like better pay and benefits, regardless of what you currently have??? JB is a good place to work and I have met few here who don't like their job. The hard core whiners are a bit exhausting at times, but I bet most will remain at JB even after the upcoming hiring at all of these "destination airlines" kicks in...

While I share some objectives with the whiners, their approach could use some adjustment. Most have no real world private sector business experience outside of the cockpit, so their views are a bit distorted. I'm onboard with the goal of improving our lot in life, but I refuse to be miserable and jump on the liberal anti-corporate anti-profit train just because you think I should... I am objective and not a "juicer," but in this case, the middle ground is where the sanity resides.

This pretty much sums up what I meant. I've spent the past 5 years being surrounded by people that hate their lives, their jobs and management that would rather lie to your face while dancing with local investors than even send out a communication saying you're being furloghed or displaced out of common courtesy. Why would I want to go to American/Delta/United and do that the rest of my career? I know jetBlue isn't perfect, but like has already been mentioned, it doesn't mean the status quo needs to stay....well, quo.

 

[1678]

Ask those you claim from USair, AA, DL/NWA, UA/CO, etc., if they hated their company prior to 9/11. After that date MGMT has taken a hard ball approach towards any improvements to employee benefits. They have slashed pay, retirements, benefits, etc. on the back of the line pilots, MX, FA's, etc.; all the while, while taking out big bonuses for themselves for meeting self regulated goals and gateways, and cutting employee expenses.

After you get "hit" on the head so many times by your MGMT team, who needs more and more concessions to meet THEIR goal for bonuses, yes you will most likely get bitter also. But, the bitterness is towards the MGMT of the company and not the company itself. I can almost guarantee you that any one of the ones you referred to as hating their company, really hate the way the company is run and the people who run it, and not the company itself.

Also ask any one of the pilots you claim hate their company if they would trade their position of having a CBA and a seat at the table when concessions are asked for; whether it is ALPA-APA-SWAPA etc., and no-matter how much they disagree with their Union, for a position of "Direct Relationship" without a seat at the table.

Just something to think about..........

 

[Smarta$$]

Ask those you claim from USair, AA, DL/NWA, UA/CO, etc., if they hated their company prior to 9/11. After that date MGMT has taken a hard ball approach towards any improvements to employee benefits. They have slashed pay, retirements, benefits, etc. on the back of the line pilots, MX, FA's, etc.; all the while, while taking out big bonuses for themselves for meeting self regulated goals and gateways, and cutting employee expenses.

After you get "hit" on the head so many times by your MGMT team, who needs more and more concessions to meet THEIR goal for bonuses, yes you will most likely get bitter also. But, the bitterness is towards the MGMT of the company and not the company itself. I can almost guarantee you that any one of the ones you referred to as hating their company, really hate the way the company is run and the people who run it, and not the company itself.

Also ask any one of the pilots you claim hate their company if they would trade their position of having a CBA and a seat at the table when concessions are asked for; whether it is ALPA-APA-SWAPA etc., and no-matter how much they disagree with their Union, for a position of "Direct Relationship" without a seat at the table.

Just something to think about..........

Agree...

 

[kellwolf]

Ask those you claim from USair, AA, DL/NWA, UA/CO, etc., if they hated their company prior to 9/11. After that date MGMT has taken a hard ball approach towards any improvements to employee benefits. They have slashed pay, retirements, benefits, etc. on the back of the line pilots, MX, FA's, etc.; all the while, while taking out big bonuses for themselves for meeting self regulated goals and gateways, and cutting employee expenses.

After you get "hit" on the head so many times by your MGMT team, who needs more and more concessions to meet THEIR goal for bonuses, yes you will most likely get bitter also. But, the bitterness is towards the MGMT of the company and not the company itself. I can almost guarantee you that any one of the ones you referred to as hating their company, really hate the way the company is run and the people who run it, and not the company itself.

Also ask any one of the pilots you claim hate their company if they would trade their position of having a CBA and a seat at the table when concessions are asked for; whether it is ALPA-APA-SWAPA etc., and no-matter how much they disagree with their Union, for a position of "Direct Relationship" without a seat at the table.

Just something to think about..........

Sorry, maybe I'm just incredibly dense, but I don't see a very large distinction between "hating your company" and "hating the way management runs the company." I haven't heard anyone at American say "Yeah, American is great. I just wish management wouldn't treat us like crap." It wouldn't make much sense to say that. Now, if you're talking about working with a good pilot group or something akin to that, I could see that. However, I wouldn't categorize that as "the company."

As for the CBA, I absolutely agree something legally enforceable is preferable.

 

[fifty30retard]

aewannabe, he has it all figured out. Let him make his decision, and live with the results....

There are PLENTY of guys and gals that really want to be here, and would be a better choice.

Yes, PLENTY of guys and gals. 1/3 of the seniority list gets you junior lineholder status as a 320CA in JFK, so when B6 has 6600 pilots, you too can be a junior A320CA in JFK flying all weekends, holidays, and redeyes.

When will B6 have 6600 pilots?

Answer: NEVER.

Come to B6 and you will enjoy poor medical benefits and limited retirement with a lifetime in the right seat.

Find greener pastures.

 

[say again]

Yes, PLENTY of guys and gals. 1/3 of the seniority list gets you junior lineholder status as a 320CA in JFK, so when B6 has 6600 pilots, you too can be a junior A320CA in JFK flying all weekends, holidays, and redeyes.

When will B6 have 6600 pilots?

Answer: NEVER.

Come to B6 and you will enjoy poor medical benefits and limited retirement with a lifetime in the right seat.

Find greener pastures.

But they get to fly the A320!! I've heard some friends bragging on how they fly the "big" equipment, and that I need to upgrade from the "small" corporate jets. Must be compensating for something!! I tell them that they need to get over themselves. I get paid more, awesome benefits, more time off, don't have to commute, more enjoyable trips....BUT, it is a small jet. Hmmm, let me give that up to fly something bigger?? No way.
:beer:

 

[fifty30retard]

Dang, my third year as FO at Allegiant I would have made about $106,000, but then I got called for upgrade and make even more. JetBlue's FO's are making less than that with a much longer upgrade and they still voted no for the union? Why would any mainline pilot ever vote down a union if you aren't even making six figures? There are way too many cowards in this business now days.

Scared people is right. Some of them are military pilots and scared out of their minds. Must have been some kind of military officers, right? Scared scared scared, and uneducated as well.