It now Official ASA will Shrink by 130 Jobs

[www.]

Right, 3 month FO's on the bandit, who all upgraded in 12-18 months.....opposed to a group of mostly 3-5 year FO's, many who worked at other Majors and were probably Regional Captains themselves years ago before coming to ASA. Not even close. That said, yeah, there are a handful of inexperienced low-timers around now, mainly because who in the h-e-l-1 would want to work here now?

The upgrade in the early 90s was not 3 months. Try 3 to 4 years. These pilots did not come from FSI or ER. They mostly came from MIL and frieght/cargo. And there is more than a handfull around here. In fact, a couple are CPs.

 

[79%N1]

Woa..........3 whole years!!!! My gosh, those must have been some outstanding First Officers. Maybe when I hit year six here, I can aspire to be that good, and not just some dumb FO, as you so eloquently put it!

 

[ASADriver]

We have many low time FOs here. These guys come here with only several hundred hours. Some do OK, and some are dangerous.

 

[79%N1]

OK, lets not talk about the newhires. As a group, ASA has a very senior FO list. There are many 3,4,5, and 6 year FO's here.........and that will only get higher now that Skywests Genius's have boned us, since you know, we are only a commodity.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

OK, lets not talk about the newhires. As a group, ASA has a very senior FO list. There are many 3,4,5, and 6 year FO's here.........and that will only get higher now that Skywests Genius's have boned us, since you know, we are only a commodity.

So what do you want?? I mean, really, what's the point to this whole "senior FO" thread?? Is it just because you're pissed because you haven't upgraded yet or what? Most of the First Officers I fly with here are more than competent. In fact, the majority of them could sit in the left seat tomorrow and do the job. I'm sure you're one of them. But, seriously, what is it you want from the Captains. No matter how experienced or competent you are, it's still my butt if metal gets bent or an MEL gets overflown or an OpSpec gets violated. I wasn't a 6 month wonder-FO either. In fact I was 4 years in the right seat. However, I still got one hell of an education in responsibility when I upgraded. Until you're sitting there, you won't understand.

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I just don't understand the point of the discussion. I've flown with some 6 year FOs who were worse than some 6 month FOs and vice versa. What is it that you're looking for to validate your 5 years in the right seat, exactly??

 

[asqmatt]

Anyone stop to think that if ASA gets rid of the 70s, they can furlough all the crew that fly that rating. And getting rid of the most highly paid pilots in that airline would be beneficial???

 

[sweptback]

Anyone stop to think that if ASA gets rid of the 70s, they can furlough all the crew that fly that rating. And getting rid of the most highly paid pilots in that airline would be beneficial???

Uh, no, they can't furlough out of senority.

Plus, it would cost them much more to downgrade everybody to the 50. They'd all have to go through the full CRJ course again.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Super pooter, why don't you make your views known face to face with your pilots if you feel so strongly. Take your case to the crew lounge, not hiding behind a keyboard! You will be in for a rude awakening...

 

[Stifler's Mom]

The only point that will be proven is that ASA and ALPO are a bunch of tards. Theyd rather compete in the special olympics than have a job

Hey D' Bag, next time you go in for your medical, ask the AME to write you a prescription for a pair of testicles, ok?

 

[SuperKooter]

Super pooter, why don't you make your views known face to face with your pilots if you feel so strongly. Take your case to the crew lounge, not hiding behind a keyboard! You will be in for a rude awakening...

Is that some kind of threat. Is that supposed to mean that if I make my views known in public I should fear for my saftey? Its been done before, unions are like the mafia. If you get in their way you going to get hurt.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Nobody is going to harm you...we're just planning on giving you a "swirly" in one of the men's room stalls.

 

[Sherpa]

Well, at least I wont be out of a job and 120-140 dumb FO's I dont have to put up with:beer:

Cheers!

120-140 dumd FO's? Granted, I takes a while to cozy up to the CRJ or ATR but isn't that a hasty generalization?
Many of those "dumb FO's" will vote to strike and stand up for all pilots making a living wage instead of leaving the industry full of bottom dwellers hoping they can scrape by on gov't cheese and get a quick upgrade. I'd rather take a furlough than sucumb to self preservation on a crap job.
Did you start in the left seat?

 

[John Pennekamp]

Is that some kind of threat. Is that supposed to mean that if I make my views known in public I should fear for my saftey? Its been done before, unions are like the mafia. If you get in their way you going to get hurt.

I made an exception to the ignor list for this one.

Nice try to pass me off as making a threat. The rude awakening would be 90% of the pilots you talk to telling you you're an idiot. Try it and see.

 

[ReverseSensing]

Hey D' Bag, next time you go in for your medical, ask the AME to write you a prescription for a pair of testicles, ok?

I think they're called neuticles.

"Neuticles allowing your pet to retain his natural look, self esteem and aids in the trauma associated with neutering."

 

[AuburnRedneck9]

You have to at least try to sound like a normal line pilot it's pretty apparent that you should go back to your job in the GO or chief pilots office. The only satisfaction that I'll take in striking and killing the airline is that people like you will be unemployed as well. I firmly believe that most of us are perfectly willing to watch ASA disappear rather than be the next group to cave to a pay cut during a period of record profits. Why don't you read your vision card to yourself a few times and then walk down to the hall to our dishonest CEO's office and ask him why we're losing airframes, etc. No one will be out of work either, their more than enough attrition to cover any reductions because this is such a miserable airline to work at. Just wait until Skywest inc. eliminates your position in the GO.


It's time to BURN THE HOUSE DOWN.

So now what do you ALPAites have to say for yourselves. You are going make ASA shrink. 120-140 people will be out of work because you can't take the ALPA blinders off your overinflated heads.

There WILL be a paycut on the 70 or ASA WILL lose all of them and even more jobs.

Think about your actions and how it will affect people. A large amount of people may find themselves on the street because of your Lack of Common Sense.

I just hope that strike vote will be a weak showing. I will vote NO and I know many other people will also vote NO. If you lemmings do decide to "Burn The MUTHA DOWN" then JA will shrink ASA into nothingness as it probably should at least ALPA will be gone. ASA days are numbered and its because of the selfish MEC.

Hey i've got an Idea maybe you clowns can walk around like fool in your uniforms (with hat on of course) infront of the ASA building. Thats worked so will in the past.

 

[anon]

That's true. I know that I can fly another job making about the same amount in a short time. No problem there.

I wonder if a couple of our CP's (CC & KR,in particular) will be able to find another CP job. I highly doubt it.

I also wonder if a lot of GO folks are going to be able to find a job similar to what they have somewhere else. I highly doubt it. Quite a few of the suckups are going to see their world go to crap in a hurry. Their coveted little jobs will go away and no one on the outside is going to hire them into similar positions.

Yes, a shutdown will hurt me in the short run, but I can recover quite quickly. A lot of GO and CP folks can't say the same thing.

We're all in this together.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Anon:

Don't bet on Kim Reed being out for the count. She is a woman. Every place I've started applying to asks the question. At Continental they asked it three times (once on air apps, once on the Continental supplement and they want to know if you belong to OBAP, or Women in Aviation.)

Yes there are flying jobs out there that pay the same. But, there are not many that will let a guy start in the left seat, have 16 days and weekends off every month, three weeks of vacation and close to home.

There are some, like xxxx, that it is hard to imagine having any opportunities outside of ASA, but he probably has a bead on being the biggest bada$$ at the FAA, or TSA. Rember the FAA even hired Scott Young, who I would not trust to take out the garbage for fear of the task getting screwed up.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Anon:

Don't bet on Kim Reed being out for the count. She is a woman. Every place I've started applying to asks the question. At Continental they asked it three times (once on air apps, once on the Continental supplement and they want to know if you belong to OBAP, or Women in Aviation.)

Yes there are flying jobs out there that pay the same. But, there are not many that will let a guy start in the left seat, have 16 days and weekends off every month, three weeks of vacation and close to home.

There are some, like xxxx, that it is hard to imagine having any opportunities outside of ASA, but he probably has a bead on being the biggest bada$$ at the FAA, or TSA. Rember the FAA even hired Scott Young, who I would not trust to take out the garbage for fear of the task getting screwed up.

Who is "xxxx"? Initials?

As for KR, the most useless CP to hit the lounge, "Mother Hen" only got that job because Chromer felt sorry for her after she lost her baby. She wanted to be closer to home so she could take care of the other kid and try again. Chromer threw her a bone with the CP job, and improved ASA's demographics at the same time.

If you want to have fun with Kim, stand right outside her office and start bashing ASA management. Watch her run out to see who it is. The CPs have been instructed to take notes in the crew lounges and pass them to the GO with names for a couple of years now. I bet our union reps would love to get their hands on that target list in the GO.

 

[blueridge71]

Uh, no, they can't furlough out of senority.

Plus, it would cost them much more to downgrade everybody to the 50. They'd all have to go through the full CRJ course again.

Going from the 50 to the 70 is only two weeks of differences training. Are you saying that it is different to go from the 70 to the 50?

 

[Blucher]

Who is "xxxx"? Initials?

As for KR, the most useless CP to hit the lounge, "Mother Hen" only got that job because Chromer felt sorry for her after she lost her baby. She wanted to be closer to home so she could take care of the other kid and try again. Chromer threw her a bone with the CP job, and improved ASA's demographics at the same time.

JP, this post is extremely disappointing and disturbing to me. I don't care how mad you may be, this is completely uncalled for. Please do not insult yourself and everyone else on here again by posting such personal attacks that have little or nothing to do with the issue. If she's wronged you at work somehow, fine, bash her for that. But for losing a child???? Not cool.

-Blucher

 

[Pogue Mahone]

JP, this post is extremely disappointing and disturbing to me. I don't care how mad you may be, this is completely uncalled for. Please do not insult yourself and everyone else on here again by posting such personal attacks that have little or nothing to do with the issue. If she's wronged you at work somehow, fine, bash her for that. But for losing a child???? Not cool.

-Blucher

I didn't see any bash there. It sounded like a simple statement of fact as to the circumstances by which a chief pilot got her positon.

Bashing would be " Hey that guy Joseph Smith got a brain tumor and a now he is going to die a slow, debilitating and painful death, isn't that good news?"

See, thats bashing and for the record I would agree that would be in poor taste.

 

[Beergut]

JP, this post is extremely disappointing and disturbing to me. I don't care how mad you may be, this is completely uncalled for. Please do not insult yourself and everyone else on here again by posting such personal attacks that have little or nothing to do with the issue. If she's wronged you at work somehow, fine, bash her for that. But for losing a child???? Not cool.

-Blucher

Ditto

 

[Beergut]

I didn't see any bash there. It sounded like a simple statement of fact as to the circumstances by which a chief pilot got her positon.

Bashing would be " Hey that guy Joseph Smith got a brain tumor and a now he is going to die a slow, debilitating and painful death, isn't that good news?"

See, thats bashing and for the record I would agree that would be in poor taste.

KR has around 10 years experience at ASA. What else do you need?

 

[sweptback]

Going from the 50 to the 70 is only two weeks of differences training. Are you saying that it is different to go from the 70 to the 50?

I have heard that while we have a 50-70 transition program, we do not have one to go the opposite direction. I could be wrong though.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

KR has around 10 years experience at ASA. What else do you need?

At ASA you have to have a sincere desire to do the company's bidding. Even when they are wrong. By wrong I don't mean a mistake, I mean wrong.

Like, we know what the contract says but if you don't do what we say you can greive it wrong.

You have to a have a lack of dignity. Just look back over the last 10 years at all the boobs who have filtered thru the CPO. They come, they go. The company cares no more about the CPs than they do the line pilots. In order to be a yes-man (or woman as the case may be) for an organization like this, you really need to sell out 100%.

You must be willing to rarely, if ever, advocate for a line pilot. Even when the company is forcing someone to do the wrong thing that may end up in the FAA's lap. Further, once it gets to that point, you have to be willing to lie cheat and steal to place the blame on the pilot.

You have to be willing to be complicit in a corrupt greivance process. Whereby members of senior management, who hold positions of responsibility as required by the regulations, will place their hand on stack of bibles and swear to god almighty to tell the truth. And then lie through their friggin teeth to curry favor with the retards who run the asylum.

Need I go on?

We have one good Chief Pilot at ASA and I bet he gets hosed in the SLC deal. The rest aren't worth a bucket of piss.

 

[Blucher]

At ASA you have to have a sincere desire to do the company's bidding. Even when they are wrong. By wrong I don't mean a mistake, I mean wrong.

Like, we know what the contract says but if you don't do what we say you can greive it wrong.

You have to a have a lack of dignity. Just look back over the last 10 years at all the boobs who have filtered thru the CPO. They come, they go. The company cares no more about the CPs than they do the line pilots. In order to be a yes-man (or woman as the case may be) for an organization like this, you really need to sell out 100%.

You must be willing to rarely, if ever, advocate for a line pilot. Even when the company is forcing someone to do the wrong thing that may end up in the FAA's lap. Further, once it gets to that point, you have to be willing to lie cheat and steal to place the blame on the pilot.

You have to be willing to be complicit in a corrupt greivance process. Whereby members of senior management, who hold positions of responsibility as required by the regulations, will place their hand on stack of bibles and swear to god almighty to tell the truth. And then lie through their friggin teeth to curry favor with the retards who run the asylum.

Need I go on?

We have one good Chief Pilot at ASA and I bet he gets hosed in the SLC deal. The rest aren't worth a bucket of piss.

Gotta disagree with you there. We do have one in ATL who could very well be keeping the entire place from blowing up. I'd rather not use his name, because if the idiots in management figure out he's good to us, he'll probably be fired. When he does finally decide to leave the office we will all see just how terrible the others are (even more so than we already do).

-Blucher

 

[Turkey Shoot]

120-140 dumd FO's? Granted, I takes a while to cozy up to the CRJ or ATR but isn't that a hasty generalization?
Many of those "dumb FO's" will vote to strike and stand up for all pilots making a living wage instead of leaving the industry full of bottom dwellers hoping they can scrape by on gov't cheese and get a quick upgrade. I'd rather take a furlough than sucumb to self preservation on a crap job.
Did you start in the left seat?

Exercise in futility there my friend. Look at the GJ scumbags or Freedom or what the SkyWest pilot pilots accepted. Everybody talks the good talk but there are too many of these kids who, "FLY FOR NOTHING FOR TWIN/ TURBINE TIME!" We at TSA stood firm in our hopes to slow the race to the bottom. What happened? We caught all sorts of crap from everybody about how we needed to quit complaining because we had a chance to vote and turned it down.

I want to $200,000 a year and fly 13 days a month but until the government quits bailing out these larger airlines, the "False Market" glass ceiling will remain in place and the whipsaw will continue to buzz. I've got pick my battles and right now ain't such a good time with the current political climate or state or fuel prices which will probably continue through the end of next year.

So if you guys with ASA think it's so bad, look at TSA and BS happening to that pilot group and be thankful it hasn't come to that yet.

 

[ASARJMan]

Is that some kind of threat. Is that supposed to mean that if I make my views known in public I should fear for my saftey? Its been done before, unions are like the mafia. If you get in their way you going to get hurt.

Kooter, now boy, I've told you 3-4 times to go back to watching your cartoons on the tube. A little dramatic aren't we mommy boy. Unions like the mafia. That's rich. ALPA is more like an association, unfortunately, than a hard core union like the Teamsters perhaps. And, no one is gonna get hurt you little mgt puke. Now, if someone finds out where you really work (it's the GO), you may get hurt. So, Koot, keep your pathetic identity secret and you won't get hurt. C'mon, get real Koot!

 

[MESA=WALMART]

ALPA really screwed the dog on this one. If only ALPA would of made a RJ UNION when the first RJ's came onto the sence and said no one will fly a jet for less than jet pay. This whole industry would be a lot better off. Thanks ALPA and all the non-union guys that are driving us all into this black abyss!

 

[BigLebowski]

Exercise in futility there my friend. Look at the GJ scumbags or Freedom or what the SkyWest pilot pilots accepted. Everybody talks the good talk but there are too many of these kids who, "FLY FOR NOTHING FOR TWIN/ TURBINE TIME!" We at TSA stood firm in our hopes to slow the race to the bottom. What happened? We caught all sorts of crap from everybody about how we needed to quit complaining because we had a chance to vote and turned it down.

I want to $200,000 a year and fly 13 days a month but until the government quits bailing out these larger airlines, the "False Market" glass ceiling will remain in place and the whipsaw will continue to buzz. I've got pick my battles and right now ain't such a good time with the current political climate or state or fuel prices which will probably continue through the end of next year.


So if you guys with ASA think it's so bad, look at TSA and BS happening to that pilot group and be thankful it hasn't come to that yet.

Just out of curiosity what did we accept that was so bad? Last I checked we were about the highest paid next to Horizon, our upgrade is just a lot shorter.