Is Pinnacle a decent airline to work for?

[airludy]

I have a interview with Pinnacle and would like to hear some stuff from current employees there....Is this a good place to work for? Pros and cons? I would like to commute from cleveland also.. Any info would be great. Thanks

 

[Mtnjam]

deascent

I would say Pinnacle is just deascent. Not great, not poor, but deascent. Apparently they're paying their new hires in training now. Only 200per week, but it's better than nothing which is what I got and some "lifer's" here had to pay 10k for their training so I can't complain there. The training program isn't all that great, however the FEDS got their nose in things now so I'm sure it's on it's way for improvement. 1st year F.O. pay stinks. $20.73 an hour just isn't hardly enough to cut it unless you're still sucking on moma's nipple or married with a kind and understanding spouse, or like me, divorced with a hot sugar mama!
Our contract is under renegotiations right now and I truly hope for more money and a better quality of life and by that I mean a life where Crew Scheduling and Crew Planning don't run your life. Don't know about you and other's but I have more important things in my life than Airplanes and my job. Lot's of "Junior Manning" going on right now, which means those days off you planned on heading out of town for whatever reason isn't happening, or it means you won't be able to commute home for 6 or 7 days at a time, which is enough to make your hair grey after awhile. Pinnacle is very short pilots right now so somebody has to pick up the slack. Another problem is that they don't want to hire enough guys to keep on staff so other's don't get screwed over because paying a 75hr. guarantee to pilots that are "extra" or Reserve in other words is not the company's idea of spending money wisely. There's also something called Reduced Rest which is supposed to be used for Maint. issues, Wx delays, etc,etc. It's not designed to be scheduled like we do it here. This is supposed to be coming to a stop from what I hear.
This airline grew too quickly so they still treat it like it's a good ol' boys flying club in Memphis, however they are making progress to change it and it's coming along. I think in the near future it will be one of the best, if not the best regional to work for because they are really working on alot of things here and still working on company growth as well. Rumor is Pinnacle is or already has another 121 certificate approved for 6 EMB 170 or 190's and it can't be taken any furthur until the current contract is settled so hopefully we'll see it sooner than later.
Cleveland is an easy commute to DTW. I know a couple people that do it and it's easy. Driveable if you really need to. Goodluck......... Like I said, it's a deascent place, but one thing you have to keep in mind is that it's great flying time. All Glass Turbojet?? Can't go wrong really.......

 

[blackbox]

I hear pinnacle is even paying for hotel now during training, which is great news. I hear the MX is above average here. The company makes a lot of money so its about as stable as they get. and as Mtnjam mentioned we are in contract negotiations. I am pretty optimistic about it, but who knows how it will come out. But honestly I think if its not exactly what we want or close to it, people will walk. They have had to put up with a lot of crap here. mainly scheduling issues, junior manning, and getting extended.

I think in the near future it will be one of the best, if not the best regional to work for because they are really working on alot of things here and still working on company growth as well. .

While I like to think that we will be the best, its a bit of a reach to say that considering we are so far away from being the top regional right now.
We have a new VP of Flight ops and I have very high expectations of him. He seems to be doing a lot of good things for the company.

I havent been here long, but I do like it. The capt's that i have been flying with are great and so are the F/A.

But dont come here looking for a quick upgrade, because thats come to a screeching halt. good luck on the interview.

 

[flagshipper]

. I think in the near future it will be one of the best, if not the best regional to work for because they are really working on alot of things here and still working on company growth as well. Rumor is Pinnacle is or already has another 121 certificate approved for 6 EMB 170 or 190's and it can't be taken any furthur until the current contract is settled so hopefully we'll see it sooner than later.
Cleveland is an easy commute to DTW. I know a couple people that do it and it's easy. Driveable if you really need to. Goodluck......... Like I said, it's a deascent place, but one thing you have to keep in mind is that it's great flying time. All Glass Turbojet?? Can't go wrong really.......[/QUOTE]


I always knew phil was on these boards now i know who it is. Come on guys don't drink this kool aid. Let's be realistic about things. Oh yeah and by the way the union does not give a rat's a$$ about about FO pay or the reserve system. all they care about is another 1 percent on the 401k because they are stuck at pinnacle for life. and this stuff about 9e being swa's first regional is ridiculous. If they ever do decide to fly emb 170/190s they will more than likely do it in house based on their business model

Oh and by the way if anybody around MEM wants a job making 35k base salary wokring 10-20 duty hours a week only 4 nights a week with weekend and holidays off pm me. This is no joke. It is the easiest flying job there is and it is turbine pic

 

[LDavid]

I have a interview with Pinnacle and would like to hear some stuff from current employees there....Is this a good place to work for? Pros and cons? I would like to commute from cleveland also.. Any info would be great. Thanks

If you living in cleveland then why not try ExpressJet?

 

[BeechCowboy48]

Qol

Can anyone comment as to how many days off an average lineholder has, how commutable the schedules are, and if it is easy to trip trade? Also, when will the contract issues be resolved?

 

[arthompson]

Trip trading is based off staffing. Contract is progressing well, bith sides have said that it may be done by the new year.

 

[another cfii]

Days off is average close to 14 days off this month. DTW is a bit above 14, and MEM and MSP is about mid 13. With that said, you will probably get about 11-12 after 5-6 mo. of seniority. Trip trade depends staffing, or more accurately, if someone in crew scheduling can get off their lazy butts and approve your request.

Anyway, welcome to 9E. I hope you'll like it here. It ain't paradise, and it ain't hell, but it sure it's our little corner. If you can't get your dream job right now, might as well enjoy the time spent smelling the rose, right?

 

[jackbo]

The company makes a lot of money so its about as stable as they get. and as Mtnjam mentioned we are in contract negotiations.

are you high? with growth coming to an end and negotiations not going anywhere, 9e is going to suck balls to be at for the next few years. if by stable you mean continuing to be a crappy place to work with tensions getting higher by the day and growth going nowhere, then it is stable.

i'm sure the 9e sim instructors keep quitting because it is such an awesome place to be. sounds "stable" to me.

Rumor is Pinnacle is or already has another 121 certificate approved for 6 EMB 170 or 190's and it can't be taken any furthur until the current contract is settled so hopefully we'll see it sooner than later

right. and just who is 9e going to fly them for? and if it "can't be taken until the contract is settled" then i guess they won't be flying for at least two years.

you guys need to get real. the long time 9e guys know how it is. start smelling reality, fellas.

 

[PCL_128]

Oh yeah and by the way the union does not give a rat's a$$ about about FO pay or the reserve system. all they care about is another 1 percent on the 401k because they are stuck at pinnacle for life

This kind of crap is just ridiculous. The union's contract goals are directly taken from the Wilson Polling data that has been collected for the past few years from the line pilots. I can assure you that FO pay and the draconian reserve system are 2 of our top priorities. You haven't seen the contract goals and you haven't been present at the MEC meetings, so how can you say that we don't care about these things? I know it's popular to bash the union at PCL, but the reality is far different from what the average line pilot thinks. I know you don't work here anymore, but if any of your friends still do and believe the same things you said, then please have them PM me.

 

[jackbo]

I know it's popular to bash the union at PCL

wow, that is really sad. after all, it is your union so if the pilots think the union sucks they only have themselves to blame. that is especially sad because it comes at a time when you 9e boys need to unite.

it sounds cheesy, however, your unity is your strength during the days ahead.

pcl_128, i'm happy at least you know how it is. too bad more of your boys don't think like you do. good luck, man.

 

[Mtnjam]

Good Faith

I can only hope that the union and company resolve these issue's soon. I hope to be making enough money to at least afford my rent and other bills I have piled up. We are considered to be "professional" and I hope they start treating us like professionals and paying us like professionals, but I have faith that it will happen.
Everyone needs to realize that a Regional Airline is not the place to hang your hat for retirement. It doesn't matter which one you work for. I know several people at several different one's and they all have their issue's. I was in the Hotel Van with a Mesa Crew last night. Bless their poor soul's. Make's you realize 9E isn't too bad after all, even with the old contract. I enjoy my job here at Pinnacle, I just hope that it get's better and I'm sure it will......... Apply everyone!!!! Good luck in the interview, I hear it's a 2 day process now.......

 

[blackbox]

are you high? with growth coming to an end and negotiations not going anywhere, 9e is going to suck balls to be at for the next few years. if by stable you mean continuing to be a crappy place to work with tensions getting higher by the day and growth going nowhere, then it is stable.

i'm sure the 9e sim instructors keep quitting because it is such an awesome place to be. sounds "stable" to me.

when i said stable,I meant financially. read the context. The company is making money so its as stable as you can get. As opposed to AWAC, SKyway, and I am sure there are others.

 

[RP170]

when i said stable,I meant financially. read the context. The company is making money so its as stable as you can get. As opposed to AWAC, SKyway, and I am sure there are others.

Can you name a regional that's not making money? I have heard many negative things about Pinnacle. A close friend of mine has been an FO there for a year and a half and can only get lines with 11-12 days off per month and is making $24/hr. Several furloughed Independence guys also went to Pinnacle and quit during the middle of training because the training department was so poor.

 

[BlackPilot628]

Deleted

 

[EMB170Pilot]

Can you name a regional that's not making money? I have heard many negative things about Pinnacle. A close friend of mine has been an FO there for a year and a half and can only get lines with 11-12 days off per month and is making $24/hr. Several furloughed Independence guys also went to Pinnacle and quit during the middle of training because the training department was so poor.

Man that sucks!

 

[blackbox]

Is getting only 11-12 days of per month in your second year really that bad? I am new to this airline thing so I really dont know. But i know at some airlines in year 2 you are still sitting reserve. the 24 dollars an hour is pathetic and hope the new contract is a lot better. It cant possibly get worse can it?

and about the Indy guys. I definitly think the training department could be a lot better. But i am pretty sure they left not because of poor training, but more because the came looking to get into the left seat right away. and when they found out they would be F/O's they left.

 

[RP170]

Is getting only 11-12 days of per month in your second year really that bad? I am new to this airline thing so I really dont know. But i know at some airlines in year 2 you are still sitting reserve. the 24 dollars an hour is pathetic and hope the new contract is a lot better. It cant possibly get worse can it?

and about the Indy guys. I definitly think the training department could be a lot better. But i am pretty sure they left not because of poor training, but more because the came looking to get into the left seat right out of training. and when they found out they wuold be F/O's they left.

Bad compared to what we are used to at CHQ. Average of 16 days off per month right out of training. Guys are getting up to 18 day off per month lines right out of IOE. Reserve is basically non-existant.

 

[arthompson]

The Indy Air guys left not because of an issue with out training department but because they didn't get CA right out of the box. 10 days off may not be the norm at CHQ, but it is at alot of airlines. The schedules at 9E also vary depending on the base. MSP/DTW guys have more flying available to them than MEM crews because of how NWA has the hub structures set up.

 

[blackbox]

Bad compared to what we are used to at CHQ. Average of 16 days off per month right out of training. Guys are getting up to 18 day off per month lines right out of IOE. Reserve is basically non-existant.

damn, where do i sign up!

 

[a-v-8er]

Your days off per month depends on your schedule (i.e. seniority in domicile, but also global) and have little to do with which airline you work for! Some people sit reserve for a long time when hired, others move up quickly and get good quality of life sooner. It's the same for every airline you'll work for... minor differences in schedules, but overall, seniority = better QOL!

 

[Lear70]

An F/O with any more than 6 months seniority should EASILY be able to hold 14 days off. If he is holding less than that, it's his own choice (probably because of a difficult commute).

I detest MEM and dislike being there much at all, but I'm staying in that domicile because the trips are built commutable for the most part. I can hold an extra day or two off in DTW or even MSP but half the trips are uncommutable so I'm back down to 12, 11, or 10 days off... no thanks.

Additionally, as someone mentioned, more flying in DTW and MSP that needs covered so as a MEM pilot I can routinely trip improve into a DTW trip, thereby flying more hours over the same number of days and being in less of a "Greater Northern Mississippi Flying Club" mentality.

The Association (union) isn't fantastic, but there is a SLOW changing of the guard taking place to get rid of much of the "senior guy's mentality"... but as proven by recent LOA's, the progress is VERY slow.

Don't count on a lot of things they may tell you, such as:

1.) Quick contract resolution. Not bloody fu*king likely.
2.) More Aircraft. Again, not a likelihood when you do ANY research on the NWA family of regionals and the "whiplashing" that goes on every few years.
3.) New aircraft on a new certificate. Sure, it's possible, but we won't be flying them and will spend a year or more in grievance against it a' la' Mesa / Freedom - TSA / G0 Jets.
4.) 14-day off lineholder. You're coming in at the end of a LOT of growth, which means you could get stuck on reserve for a VERY long time in what is considered the WORST airline reserve system in the world.

Upsides: good crews, good coworkers, decent aircraft, good maintenance, and good pass / medical benefits (as compared to many other regionals or charter/corporate alternatives).

Good luck!

 

[pilotpayne]

when i said stable,I meant financially. read the context. The company is making money so its as stable as you can get. As opposed to AWAC, SKyway, and I am sure there are others.

since when is awac not making money....we have more than most.

 

[pilotpayne]

Bad compared to what we are used to at CHQ. Average of 16 days off per month right out of training. Guys are getting up to 18 day off per month lines right out of IOE. Reserve is basically non-existant.

I guess everything is perfect at chautauqua.....Don't want to hijack this thread but what is it with you guys. I was on the bus the other day to the g gates in dulles when this female chq fo asked me where I was off to. I said I have a standup she had no clue what it was so I explained and she said, we don't have those your company kind of sucks huh......and than she says she needs to get a new hat but she will just wait the six months till she upgrades to get a new capt hat. Look I know life is great with your Ejets but really, and if I have one more chq guy tell me to leave awac and apply there I think I am going to scream.....ok rant over sorry

 

[RP170]

I guess everything is perfect at chautauqua.....Don't want to hijack this thread but what is it with you guys. I was on the bus the other day to the g gates in dulles when this female chq fo asked me where I was off to. I said I have a standup she had no clue what it was so I explained and she said, we don't have those your company kind of sucks huh......and than she says she needs to get a new hat but she will just wait the six months till she upgrades to get a new capt hat. Look I know life is great with your Ejets but really, and if I have one more chq guy tell me to leave awac and apply there I think I am going to scream.....ok rant over sorry

I guess we are just proud of where we work and happy we chose to work here. It seems to be a very content group of employees. By the way, we had an AWAC guy in our class. Figured you'd appreciate that.

 

[Spinplate]

I guess everything is perfect at chautauqua.....Don't want to hijack this thread but what is it with you guys. I was on the bus the other day to the g gates in dulles when this female chq fo asked me where I was off to. I said I have a standup she had no clue what it was so I explained and she said, we don't have those your company kind of sucks huh......and than she says she needs to get a new hat but she will just wait the six months till she upgrades to get a new capt hat. Look I know life is great with your Ejets but really, and if I have one more chq guy tell me to leave awac and apply there I think I am going to scream.....ok rant over sorry

What a snotty little biatch! Uh Oh my god, my daddy will buy me a new one!

Shes a biatch no matter who she flies for!

 

[dondk]

The scary part to the thread are the comments on who is better....

I remember threads on this 5 years ago... Back then Piedmont, Allegheny, AWAC, and Horizon were the "chosen" few you WANTED to be with. A few years later they have attrition to carriers like Pinnacle, CHQ (republic), TSA and COEX.

The point.. each of those are a regional... They may be good now, but lets ask the same question in a few years. If you talk to PDT guys/gals they will tell you 5 years ago it was a great place to work at/for. CHQ 5 years ago guys/gals were bailing there to get on with the PDT, AWAC and the top tier regionals.

We are all regionals, and maybe (god I hope not) MESA may even be considered a top tier regional. Look at the industry, it is very possible. Who else would have figured majors to become LCC's.

Back to Pinnacle as that was the orginal question. Lear 70 is quite knowledgable. He is on the money with everything other than holding 14 days as an FO within 6 months. With upgrades stagnating the movement amongst the FO's is slowing. MOst of the FO's I fly with have a year or more on the property and they are holding 12 days on average. It all depends on planning and staffing. If we evere get this airline staffed properly, then maybe 14 days or better.

For the RP170 comment about great days off. When Pinnacle first got the "new" jets on the property everyone was enjoying 16+ days off with 90 hour lines, there was no concept of reserve. Once staffing exceeded equipment the lines went down it took about 2 - 2 1/2 years for the lines to become crap. Companies don't start new equipment with crappy lines, they start with good lines until they can figure out a way to make them crappy and more profitable for them and less QOL of for you. That is everywhere at every company, regardless of regional or major.

 

[RP170]

That doesn't make much sense with the whole new fleet thing means more days off. Our EMB 145 guys also have 15-18 days off per month as line holders. Even the junior ones. Doesn't seem to matter what you fly or how junior you are. With our pref bidding system everyone seems to have about the same amount of days off when it all shakes out. Sure, if you a very senior you are going to have 18 but everyone else seems to be at a min of about 15 all the way up to 18 off.

 

[sweptback]

That doesn't make much sense with the whole new fleet thing means more days off. Our EMB 145 guys also have 15-18 days off per month as line holders. Even the junior ones. Doesn't seem to matter what you fly or how junior you are. With our pref bidding system everyone seems to have about the same amount of days off when it all shakes out. Sure, if you a very senior you are going to have 18 but everyone else seems to be at a min of about 15 all the way up to 18 off.

I really don't understand PBS, as I've never used it, but I just don't see how this is possible.

I just have a couple questions though. Where does reserve coverage come from? At my airline we try to have the number of reserve pilots equal 10%-ish of the lines (try being the key word because we are horribly understaffed). Since CHQ has no junior manning/extentions you figure that they would probably want to be fat on reserves. How then can guys only be on reserve for 2 days? Do people intentionally bid reserve to not fly, artifically inflating the relative position of new hires? Or does CHQ just not staff reserve and hope they never have to use it?

 

[RP170]

I really don't understand PBS, as I've never used it, but I just don't see how this is possible.

I just have a couple questions though. Where does reserve coverage come from? At my airline we try to have the number of reserve pilots equal 10%-ish of the lines (try being the key word because we are horribly understaffed). Since CHQ has no junior manning/extentions you figure that they would probably want to be fat on reserves. How then can guys only be on reserve for 2 days? Do people intentionally bid reserve to not fly, artifically inflating the relative position of new hires? Or does CHQ just not staff reserve and hope they never have to use it?

Using PBS everyone has certain preferences that they select before bidding, ie weekends off, max hours, commutable lines, max days off, etc. Works pretty well in rewarding what you request. Of course if you are more senior you will most likely get what you request. As far as I've seen though most guys end up with about the same amount of days off. That's just how our PBS works. There isn't much in the way of reserve right now because we are understaffed due to the amount of growth. Hence, most guys are given a line right out of IOE to cover all of the flying.