How do you then explain Great Lakes and GoJets?
A union is only as strong as its members. PAY ATTENTION.
If they are so great why did NetJets leave then?
They got greedy and did not want to pay for IBT National's part of their dues. They were Teamsters when they got their contract, which is way better than ANY ALPA regional and have language that even the major pilots wish they had. FO's make over $70k/year 1st year if they want at Net Jets. Thanks to their Teamsters contract.
In case you weren't paying attention again, a union is only as strong as its members. Horizon - Strong Union. Good contract. ComAir - Strong Union. Good contract. Great Lakes - Weak union. Mesa - Weak union.
The strength of the pilots in the group is everything. For a strong union you need strong leadership who communicates thoroughly and the pilots trust. Once you have it, the bond is strong and the company can only close the doors or capitulate. History repeats itself EVERY single time and the outcome is solely dependent upon the strength of their members, NOT who they were paying dues to.
The pilot group will either achieve or fail to maximize on their potential. The national structure defines what that potential is.
Yeah? Tell that to the Net Jets or Horizon pilots.
The Net Jets pilots had an adversarial relationship with the Teamsters since day 1, because Net Jets had no other choice. ALPA wouldn't take them, even though they fall under the RLA and are pilots (bet they regret that in Herndon, now). The Teamsters only have an airline division and fractional aviation is VERY different than airline flying. Their local 234 included plumbers, electricians, etc. who were not pilots in the leadership and the leadership controlled the money. Their contract negotiations were crap, as was their pilot solidarity. They formed a new leadership, got out from under Treichler and formed their own local and had a contract in a year - THE contract. A damn nice contract that has already been amended once and is even better now than it was in November of '05. However, they still had to deal with IBT National, whos constitution and by-laws did not mesh well with their fractional pilots, and they are a big enough pilot group that they decided to leave the nest and do it on their own, as many other organizations did with ALPA. I certainly don't think a pilot group of less than 1500 pilots could consider going on their own vs. going with EITHER ALPA or the Teamsters, they couldn't afford negotiations alone, let alone all the other resources headquarters offers at both of these organizations.
I certainly am not overly pro teamsters. I know you may think I am based on what I'm saying, just giving you a teamsters' perspective. I most certainly think they have their problems as well, but I do not think that they have the same problems a regional has at ALPA. ALPA cares about its dues just as addictively (is that a word?) as the teamsters. (Hello, 401K - we're ALPA and we want our share!) - Also, ALPA has consistently shown the conflict of interest that exists between regional and major carriers competing for the same flying, and ALPA has a HABIT of throwing regional carriers under the bus (US Air Express Jets for Jobs, Freedom, etc.) as well as having no problem in basically FORGETTING about long-time and HUGE dues contributors during mergers (TWA and US Air). I do not see ALPA being "better" than the Teamsters for any regional based on history.
There are pro's and con's for going teamsters I think for these guys, just like there are pro's and con's for going ALPA. It should take some serious thought. Anyone thinking that a "decent" merger should happen if they were ALPA vs. Teamsters should talk to the folks at US Air and see how that went for them. We'll see what happens with Delta and Northwest (and Compass). Conversely, we all saw what happened to the TWA guys when AA bought them. One thing's for sure - if they do NOT have a union and merge, they are REALLY screwed. If they have ANY union, WITH a contract, they will have SOME protection. They don't have anything right now. BAD situation. MUST change.
Also, so you know, Don Treichler, who ran not only the 747 but the teamsters airline division (and was a crook if you ask me) for decades is GONE. When he and like his 4 or 5 staff he had for his entire DIVISION left they replaced him with over 20 people. He was hording all the jobs to himself. That's changed over there and I've HEARD (not seen) good things regarding that change. Treichler is why Net Jets formed 1108 and the reason flight options went with the 1108, they wanted NOTHING to do with that guy. It was the right move.
Having said that, I am a current teamster illegally fired by Flight Options for being a union supporter (me and 70 others). I have yet to see what the Teamsters will do for me about that, although this week things are supposed to be happening (IE, the company's on its knees and the flight options pilots will not sign a TA without those pilots getting their jobs back, and they know it, so now they want to get them back).
Believe me, I think the teamsters have their problems. If things don't happen the way *I* want them to happen, they'll definitely be hearing from me, AND from my lawyer, as will the company. Net Jets left because they want to do their own thing and they don't like the constraints of being a sub-unit of IBT National, they want to call their own shots (and with that, take all the responsibility a union's national headquarters takes on). Personally, I think it was the wrong call, a greedy call, and one they may some day regret - especially since it was with the help of Wilder & Wilder, the IBT's law firm, that got them their contract. Now that they got it, they are leaving them. Whatever - that's their choice, that's what their pilots voted for. I wish them the best with it.
ALPA also has a very ugly history with how they treat regionals and ALPA-ALPA and ALPA-NON-ALPA mergers. It's all about the money for them, NOTHING else matters.
Either one is better than nothing. ALPA has the strength of the majority of the industry under its belt and airlines are not the IBT's main bread and butter. Those are definitely valid points. They both have their drawbacks and the pilots should think and discuss it long and hard, their future is at stake. I don't know which way I'd vote if i had to vote on that, today, and I'm a former ALPA and Teamster Union member and leadership member for both of them. Tough call. It would take some hard thinking and research. It's a sucky decision to be forced to make, but they need to make it.
Good luck, guys.
