Is Colgan going to be IBT?

[GEORGE DUBYA]

Will I still get free lunch this time? Well this sucks sounds like Colgan is fd no matter what happens. Seems like keeping the two seperate is the way to go.

 

[BirdCatcher]

Will I still get free lunch this time? Well this sucks sounds like Colgan is fd no matter what happens. Seems like keeping the two seperate is the way to go.

Don't worry you will get everything you deserve. I just feel bad for those who work beside you who deserve better.

 

[better up here]

You know we had a union drive last year. Why didn't you take it seriously enough to learn what the ALPA merger policy was then? You grabbed your free lunch and that was that, doing yourself you and your fellow pilots a disservice.

one of four?

 

[cloudkicker1981]

This is funny mark my words.....there will be no merging of any list. Pinnicale corp fought it and won. Keep pulling eachothers monkeys over there and stop trying to bully us into ALPA. Most colgan peops dont even post because we know its all BS. Yes we need a union but not for concern of a merger...its not going to happen. Also why would there be? Keep flying those pretty crj's and we'll fly are hick turpo props!

 

[BirdCatcher]

This is funny mark my words.....there will be no merging of any list. Pinnicale corp fought it and won. Keep pulling eachothers monkeys over there and stop trying to bully us into ALPA. Most colgan peops dont even post because we know its all BS. Yes we need a union but not for concern of a merger...its not going to happen. Also why would there be? Keep flying those pretty crj's and we'll fly are hick turpo props!

Yes, we need a union, but why not ALPA? And your right there probably won't be a merger, then again last year all us colgan pilots said we are here to get our time and get out. How's that working out right now? If colgan keeps bleeding red ink as we are, a merger gets closer to reality. Last year we were told outstation basing won't go away, now look. Business models change don't you get it?

 

[DoinTime]

Yes, we need a union, but why not ALPA? And your right there probably won't be a merger, then again last year all us colgan pilots said we are here to get our time and get out. How's that working out right now? If colgan keeps bleeding red ink as we are, a merger gets closer to reality. Last year we were told outstation basing won't go away, now look. Business models change don't you get it?

With Colgan losing $20 million per year you'd better be careful on what you consider to be absolute certainty. With that kind of bleeding going on you can expect huge changes to the original business plan.

 

[PinnacleDude]

This is funny mark my words.....there will be no merging of any list.

Good luck. The small turboprops are going to slowly go away. If the Pinnacle guys negotiate to fly everything new over 40 seats your future is secured. And not in a good way.

I recommend voting in ALPA and work to get a reasonable integration. That is what the ALPA constitution and bylaws calls for. There are a lot of very fair minded Pinnacle Pilots that would work well with the Colgan counterparts make the integration go smoothly. It would be a win for both groups. Staying separate only plays into management's hands. Joining the groups would provide greater negotiating leverage sooner.

If you dont work to integrate, you will be limited to your existing flying as the Pinnacle pilots will scope you out in time.

 

[cloudkicker1981]

WHat LIst

Good luck. The small turboprops are going to slowly go away. If the Pinnacle guys negotiate to fly everything new over 40 seats your future is secured. And not in a good way.

I recommend voting in ALPA and work to get a reasonable integration. That is what the ALPA constitution and bylaws calls for. There are a lot of very fair minded Pinnacle Pilots that would work well with the Colgan counterparts make the integration go smoothly. It would be a win for both groups. Staying separate only plays into management's hands. Joining the groups would provide greater negotiating leverage sooner.

If you dont work to integrate, you will be limited to your existing flying as the Pinnacle pilots will scope you out in time.

Very simple....the ruling is its TWO different company's. Your scope doesn't effect us, why are you guys still trying to bring up a merger. I have no problems with pinnicale pilots but why do you insist that you guys have some kinda power of merging this so called list. We will vote in a union and colgan will start producing profits real soon....again mark my words. Yes we are redesigning our fleet to better meet todays market and we will continue to trim up. You can continue to try and intimidate the greenhorns on here but the roughneck colgan boyz really could give a crap about your LIST lmao!! I got your staple right here

 

[Flyer1015]

Alpa's merger policy calls for a fair and equitable seniority integration. It provides for both mediation and arbitration if the parties can't come to an agreement themselves.

Fair and equitable? I've always liked you DoinTime. But try and say fair and equitable to the most recent merger example of two ALPA carriers, US Airways and America West. As you said yourself, arbitration could be necessary if the parties can't come to an agreement.

And look what happened. US Airways East guys gave ALPA the finger, and walked out of ALPA to form their own union.

I digress.

Back to the staple thing. If not staple, at the least we need strong fences, in terms of who can jump to what seat/equipment/domicile.

We, actually "Pinnacle Airlines Corp" bought out Colgan, not the other way around. And as AWA did to US Airways (bought them out), the seniority result has to pretty much go in favor of the buying company.

And whatever came about that arbitrators decision regarding Corp buying Colgan, and how it was a shell holding company? Last I heard, the arbitrator reversed his decision. Or something like that. Bottom line, it stalled.

 

[Flyer1015]

roughneck colgan boyz really could give a crap about your LIST lmao!! I got your staple right here

Do you really think Colgan will be able to staple Pinnacle?

 

[cloudkicker1981]

Do you really think Colgan will be able to staple Pinnacle?

No clown....and the ruling was over turn in the companys favor. Whatever the case I would have loved to have been fairly intergrated but its not going to happen. So what if YOUR company bought us. We are all employees of a company. DO you think your better becuase you belong to the bigger group or that your employeer bought our company. Give me a break your at pinnicale becuase they were the first who hired you just like Im at colgan for the same reason. You wanted to fly the shinny jet and have the title of AIRLINE PILOT. Whatever it took you did it just like very one else. Now your better then me because you got lucky....just that luck! What dues did you pay besides ALPA's...your in your 20s thinking your at US AIRWAYS with that BS. REGIONAL PILOT CLOWN

 

[BirdCatcher]

Very simple....the ruling is its TWO different company's. Your scope doesn't effect us, why are you guys still trying to bring up a merger. I have no problems with pinnicale pilots but why do you insist that you guys have some kinda power of merging this so called list. We will vote in a union and colgan will start producing profits real soon....again mark my words. Yes we are redesigning our fleet to better meet todays market and we will continue to trim up. You can continue to try and intimidate the greenhorns on here but the roughneck colgan boyz really could give a crap about your LIST lmao!! I got your staple right here

So there's the greenhorns, the roughneck boyz, and you must be representing the cool aid drinkers. Redesigning our fleet = get rid of planes and furloughing. Gees, sounds great Cloud.

How is Colgan going to be making profits? There is nothing in our future to suggest that unless more Qs come and we keep reducing Saabs. What happened to those 10 Q options next year? See ya, bye, no more.

You and a lot of other "Colgan boys" need to put your egos aside. You refuse to listen to others who are for the most part (a few exeptions) trying to help us. They know PNCL better then you, a lot of what they warned us about has come true. They are not threatning a merger, management does the merger. The ALPA arbitration is about discussing adequate scope clause. If PNCL corp isn't willing to even discuss a scope clause to legally keep PNCL and 9L seperate red flags should be going off.

Why would PNCL corp not want to legally agree to what they have been saying about keeping PNCL and 9L seperate since day one?

The fact is Colgan is bleeding red. Shareholders who initially liked the Colgan aquisition aren't happy. Colgan is shrinking, the best (in terms of $$) Saab operation (IAH) is just breaking even at current gas prices. Reality is right in front of you, it is absolutely possible PNCL could decide combining companies or selling the Q operation and dismantling the rest.

 

[cloudkicker1981]

trader

So there's the greenhorns, the roughneck boyz, and you must be representing the cool aid drinkers. Redesigning our fleet = get rid of planes and furloughing. Gees, sounds great Cloud.

How is Colgan going to be making profits? There is nothing in our future to suggest that unless more Qs come and we keep reducing Saabs. What happened to those 10 Q options next year? See ya, bye, no more.

You and a lot of other "Colgan boys" need to put your egos aside. You refuse to listen to others who are for the most part (a few exeptions) trying to help us. They know PNCL better then you, a lot of what they warned us about has come true. They are not threatning a merger, management does the merger. The ALPA arbitration is about discussing adequate scope clause. If PNCL corp isn't willing to even discuss a scope clause to legally keep PNCL and 9L seperate red flags should be going off.

Why would PNCL corp not want to legally agree to what they have been saying about keeping PNCL and 9L seperate since day one?

The fact is Colgan is bleeding red. Shareholders who initially liked the Colgan aquisition aren't happy. Colgan is shrinking, the best (in terms of $$) Saab operation (IAH) is just breaking even at current gas prices. Reality is right in front of you, it is absolutely possible PNCL could decide combining companies or selling the Q operation and dismantling the rest.

Go change your panties and fill out an app for Flagship becausse i heard their hiring street captains. I cant believe you work here because i dont know to many guys who would listen to your cry baby a$$...if i ran across you i would surley tell you to grow a pair!
You must have been one of the big dorks with alpa knee pads in LGA last year. Cooled hell yeah i carry my own along with a good attitude and not listening to all the whinning going on from a few guys like yourself. Listen a union would be great but its guys like you that want it for the wrong reason. You've been on flight info to long and soon you will be talking about retarted cats.....seeeeeeeeeeeeeeyaaaa

 

[Flyer1015]

No clown....and the ruling was over turn in the companys favor. Whatever the case I would have loved to have been fairly intergrated but its not going to happen. So what if YOUR company bought us. We are all employees of a company. DO you think your better becuase you belong to the bigger group or that your employeer bought our company.

First off, the "your" usage is stupid, it should be you're.

Next, yes, it does make a difference in terms of who the buyer is and who the bought is. Pinnacle Corp was the buyer, and the bought was Colgan. Seniority integration is based on set language with the pilot contract, and ALPA's merger policy, of a "fair equitable" integration.

BUT

Thank the majority of idiots at your airline that turned down ALPA (voted NO).

As an ALPA carrier merging with a non-union carrier, you could technically be stapled, and have NO recourse or other say in it.

Give me a break your at pinnicale becuase they were the first who hired you just like Im at colgan for the same reason. You wanted to fly the shinny jet and have the title of AIRLINE PILOT. Whatever it took you did it just like very one else. Now your better then me because you got lucky....just that luck! What dues did you pay besides ALPA's...your in your 20s thinking your at US AIRWAYS with that BS. REGIONAL PILOT CLOWN

Don't pretend like you know me; you don't. You have no idea about the reasons I chose Pinnacle, but believe me, it's more than just 'the first carrier that hired you.'

About that 'shiny jet' crap, grow up. A plane is a plane.

I'm not thinking I'm at US Airways, but I used them as an example. Seniority list integration is a very touchy issue.

So to all those guys at your airline that voted NO, tell them to grow a pair of bAlls, and get ALPA on property ASAP.

You boys gonna need 'em.

 

[SmitteyB]

This is funny mark my words.....there will be no merging of any list. Pinnicale corp fought it and won. Keep pulling eachothers monkeys over there and stop trying to bully us into ALPA. Most colgan peops dont even post because we know its all BS. Yes we need a union but not for concern of a merger...its not going to happen. Also why would there be? Keep flying those pretty crj's and we'll fly are hick turpo props!

OMG, are you serious with that grammar?

Why are you so ignorant? Are you in IAH? Must be considering you're calling yourself a hick.

No one is trying to bully us into ALPA. ALPA is our best choice. I'm glad you recognize the need for a union, and you're right it's not for a potential seniority list integration (which CAN NOT be ruled out).

You REALLY trust PNCL Corp? Get a clue, bro!

Now please, explain to me the benefits of Teamsters.

If you would like to call me an discuss this, please PM me. I would be more than happy to discuss the benefits of ALPA to our airline with you.

Brett Smithling
Ithaca FO

 

[PCL_128]

Very simple....the ruling is its TWO different company's. Your scope doesn't effect us, why are you guys still trying to bring up a merger.

You are incorrect. The ruling was clear that Pinnacle Corp is operating as an alter-ego of Pinnacle Inc. The only question remaining is whether the arbitrator will force Corp to comply with the scope language that Inc is in violation of.

But that isn't the only thing that can force a merger. The Pinnacle pilots are in Section 6 negotiations and can use their negotiating capital to demand a single list if they so choose. This is what the MAG MEC did to require a merger of Freedumb-A and what the CHQ IBT unit did to eliminate the threat of what was then the new Republic certificate.

the roughneck colgan boyz really could give a crap about your LIST lmao!! I got your staple right here

I suggest you get educated and stop pounding your chest like an infantile little brat. Everything that we warned the CJC pilots about last year has come to pass. The CPG dissolved and accomplished nothing, the operations between PCL and CJC are continuing to integrate, the Colgans are disappearing and no longer have any control over their airline, etc... All of you anti-union guys claimed that none of these things would happen. The union organizers predicted all of them perfectly. Perhaps you should listen to those who have a track record of accuracy.

 

[Yodafly]

I think you will see teamsters at Colgan.

Most people at Colgan are concerned with getting a fair deal with the company as well as being represtened by an impartial organization if a merger of the senority list is to take place. Alpa has shown that it favors the group that gives it the most money. Mainline Vs Regionl issues or just pilot group size. Most believe the Colgan pilots will not get a fair deal.

As far as future profits with Colgan turboprops Vs Pinnicle 50 seat Rjs, my money would be with the props. much cheeper to run and the majors are looking to cut costs. Still lots of rumors about more Q's coming.

Most of us find it funny all the ALPA representitives on this board pushing there agenda. I voted for alpa last time and probably will vote teamsters this time. either union is better then none at all.

 

[suupah]

I think you will see teamsters at Colgan.

Most people at Colgan are concerned with getting a fair deal with the company as well as being represtened by an impartial organization if a merger of the senority list is to take place. Alpa has shown that it favors the group that gives it the most money. Mainline Vs Regionl issues or just pilot group size. Most believe the Colgan pilots will not get a fair deal.

As far as future profits with Colgan turboprops Vs Pinnicle 50 seat Rjs, my money would be with the props. much cheeper to run and the majors are looking to cut costs. Still lots of rumors about more Q's coming.

Most of us find it funny all the ALPA representitives on this board pushing there agenda. I voted for alpa last time and probably will vote teamsters this time. either union is better then none at all.

the 1,000,000 dollar question is this

If pncl decides to integrate the pilots to streamline ops and make nw routes available for bid on the Q, Would teamsters stick around and spend 100's of thousands of dollars to make sure we get a fair integration when they know that after it is all said and done the list will be ALPA?

 

[PCL_128]

I think you know the answer to that question.

 

[suupah]

I think you know the answer to that question.

i want to hear from an IBT supporter