If/When Spirit Strikes

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Okay then comment on Mike or Lear's post. Do you think your fellow union workers are just a bunch unskilled rubes and meaningless to the airline compared to us Supermen pilots?

I am still waiting for you to discuss the leverage and coercion created from a labor alliance within a company verses a job action. Also, I am waiting for you to discuss radical change at ALPA. What that is and how it gets done.

 

[PCL_128]

Do you think your fellow union workers are just a bunch unskilled rubes and meaningless to the airline compared to us Supermen pilots?

I think the truth is somewhere in between. They are far from "highly skilled," as anyone can be trained to do that work in a relatively short period of time, unlike a position such as a pilot or mechanic, which require a great deal of training and experience. However, to say that they are "just a bunch of unskilled rubes" is also absurd, as they are obviously skilled and valuable to the business. But to compare them to pilots is asinine.

Also, your assertion that they make more than the pilots is just plain wrong. Does a ramper at the top of the longevity scale a legacy carrier make more than a regional FO? In some limited cases, yes. But does a regional ramper make more than a regional FO, or does a legacy ramper make more than a legacy FO? Of course not. You're comparing apples to donuts. As always with the radical right and the union haters, you're throwing out a bunch of red herrings.

 

[PCL_128]

I am still waiting for you to discuss the leverage and coercion created from a labor alliance within a company verses a job action. Also, I am waiting for you to discuss radical change at ALPA. What that is and how it gets done.

I think you'll be waiting a very long time. He has nothing constructive to contribute.

 

[AirCobra]

I am still waiting for you to discuss the leverage and coercion created from a labor alliance within a company verses a job action. Also, I am waiting for you to discuss radical change at ALPA. What that is and how it gets done.

Since my opinion is meaningless then focus on why Air Wisconsin's MEC is doing at least partly what I suggested.

Give me your analysis of the last three strikes (United, Northwest, Comair), where are those airlines now?

Why are you saying job actions are effective and then saying its all meaningless because someone will always come along and undercut you? You are schizophrenic.

 

[pilotyip]

missed the point

I strongly disagree with this assertion, also. I've flown with WAY too many F/O's who will NEVER upgrade and have NO business being in this industry, but got here because it's their second career or mommy and daddy had enough money to get them through the flight schools that were, arguably, PAID to get them to a passing level.O.

Remember I said skill and desire. Maybe they don't have both, did not have had the skill to be good, they should not be in the business. BTW Who gets hires also has little to do with skill and desire, it about the "luck" of being in the right place at the right time.

 

[AirCobra]

I think the truth is somewhere in between. They are far from "highly skilled," as anyone can be trained to do that work in a relatively short period of time, unlike a position such as a pilot or mechanic, which require a great deal of training and experience. However, to say that they are "just a bunch of unskilled rubes" is also absurd, as they are obviously skilled and valuable to the business. But to compare them to pilots is asinine.

Also, your assertion that they make more than the pilots is just plain wrong. Does a ramper at the top of the longevity scale a legacy carrier make more than a regional FO? In some limited cases, yes. But does a regional ramper make more than a regional FO, or does a legacy ramper make more than a legacy FO? Of course not. You're comparing apples to donuts. As always with the radical right and the union haters, you're throwing out a bunch of red herrings.

Yes a senior legacy ramper makes more than a junior legacy FO. Not to mention there are plenty of legacy FO's on furlough so they are making less than everybody who is actually working.

Please explain how asking somone not to diminsh the contributions and skill of other labor groups makes me a union hater? I did not throw out the red herring, re-read Mikes post. Do-nothing CSR's, unskilled $6.50 an hour rampers. Those are not my words.

 

[pilotyip]

Why?

This is typical management propaganda that only the slow and dimwitted will believe. There isn't a union in existence that makes its arguments for pay raises based on what some other craft and class is getting paid. Arguments are always made based on what peers are making at other carriers.

Why did ramp workers at UAL make $60K, why did reservations agents make $50K?

 

[AirCobra]

I think you'll be waiting a very long time. He has nothing constructive to contribute.

I asked you to comment on Air Wisconsin, since what they are doing was what i was suggesting . All I got was ALPA's been doing it a long time. Well why does it work or why doesn't it? Why will Air Wisconsin be different or not?

Watching you an Rez flailing around is sad. I have asked you twice and Rez three times about Air Wisconsin, neither of you will discuss it and then you ask me what are my suggestions. Well HELLO! My suggestion is what Air Wisconsin did. If you don't want to talk about my suggestion, why then do you keep asking me?

I think I know exactly what it is now. It's all personal. If you say what Air Wisconsin did was wrong or won't work, you are going against ALPA and AW's MEC, if you say Air Wisconsin is right and its a good plan, then that demonstrates there is merit in what I said and you would be agreeing with me, well we can't have that can we? It would make the two of you look bad.

So my points remain and they are the same for the last 20 posts: Unity in labor groups may be an avenue we want to explore further, the last three strikes weakened the airlines involved with them so I don't think we should continue down that road with Spirit, and the radical change is coming up with something other than more strikes. You have yet to provide any opinion on Air Wisconsin or evidence that the last three strikes made ALPA stronger. That is what I am waiting for. Stick your personal opinions about me up your @rse and just discuss the F'in topic if you want, but if you want to discuss Republicans, monkeys, bowling, and baseball, then who really has nothing constructive to offer?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Since my opinion is meaningless

I don't know if it is meaningless... you've refused to offer it.

then focus on why Air Wisconsin's MEC is doing at least partly what I suggested.

Got it... you refuse to back up your assertions and then tell me to opine on something you brought up. I am asking you to back up what you've said, not what I said.

Give me your analysis of the last three strikes (United, Northwest, Comair), where are those airlines now?

Again. I didn't bring up these strikes. You did.

Why are you saying job actions are effective and then saying its all meaningless because someone will always come along and undercut you? You are schizophrenic.

Back to the personal attacks. The undercutting is limited by a CBA. Something that you are fundamentally against as a free marketeer.

So again... you brought up that labor coalitions in house are more effective that a job action. I ask you to expand. You cannot. Strike 1.

I ask you to expand on what you brought up as needed.... a radical shift at ALPA and how. You cannot. Strike 2.

Then you proceed to bait me into engaging in topics that you bring up so you don't have to actually justify your misguided thoughts. Strike 3. You're out.

But again... you can't let go of the banana in the jar...... meaning.. you'll be back.... keep lofting in those underhand pitches and I'll keep hitting them out of the park.... your ego won't let you stop.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Why did ramp workers at UAL make $60K, why did reservations agents make $50K?

Why did managment make millions when they should have 'stolen' 100,000s?