Ibt files for single carrier . Flexjet/flightoptions

[Flex605]

This day is welcome . Let's get RH packing and get our families and life the stability and certainty we all desire. Thanks to the Flexjet organizing committee for having the fortitude to bring us to this day .
God bless the USA and all the people that fought to make our country great .

 

[gunfyter]

Go get 'em!

 

[ghostrider64]

About time the IBT for off their ass.

 

[SDCFI]

About time the IBT for off their ass.

Perhaps. This tells me they don't have enough cards to call for an election at Flex. I really didn't think they'd file, at least until it was a last resort. Otherwise why go through all the trouble of a card drive if they were going to file anyway? It's really tough to tell what will happen, there are certainly people who will vote pro union that didn't send in a card and vice versa.

What's funny is according to today's email KR thinks he has the union beat. He says he wants FO to reap the rewards of the current growth while operating under individual employment agreements. Anyone at Flexjet that doesn't see the implication there better wake up real quick!

 

[FR8DOG777]

Well hell, now that I know it's the nasty union that has been holding us back all these years uncle crackhead has for sure secured my vote. If only I could have negotiated my own personal employment agreement on those unwarranted visits to the cockpit enroute. What an arrogant ass. Salad bowl, c.h. , Sylvester. All swine, pilot exploiters. The pool is drying up fast ****************************************. This ain't the 80's with pilots killing themselves to fly your junk.

 

[doh]

I guess he means the individual employment agreement that Handschuch said wasn't worth the paper it's printed on? Gosh, how exciting...

 

[Imissmypilot]

Perhaps. This tells me they don't have enough cards to call for an election at Flex. I really didn't think they'd file, at least until it was a last resort. Otherwise why go through all the trouble of a card drive if they were going to file anyway? It's really tough to tell what will happen, there are certainly people who will vote pro union that didn't send in a card and vice versa.

Yeah, I don't think so... If you go to the other boards you'll see they needed 50% of the flex pilots just to go single carrier anyway. It's a total combined pilot group for Single Carrier and there's no way a simple majority at FLT-OPS would carry the day. The IBT doesn't lose these things because they are so careful to make sure their lead is more than comfortable. That means they had a majority from both groups.

All this announcement really means for Flex guys is they got somewhere between the 50% they needed and the 75% they wanted. The only reason they brought in the FLT-OPS guys was to speed up the process. Now we'll get SLI done this year versus not even voting until early next year if they had waited for more cards.

 

[993_Pilot]

July 7, 2015

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Union Asks for Single Carrier at Flight Options/Flexjet [FONT=&quot]International Brotherhood of Teamsters Local 1108, the pilot union at fractional-share operation Flight Options, submitted a petition to the National Mediation Board (NMB) on July 4 asking the NMB to determine whether Flight Options and sister company Flexjet constitute a single transportation system. Both fractional providers are owned by Directional Aviation.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]According to IBT 1008 executive board president Efrem Vojta, What happens now is the NMB will do an investigation to find out if Flight Options and Flexjet are running a parallel operation under [Directional Aviation]. If they are [determined to be a single carrier], we will then become a single carrier. And since 1108 represents Flight Options, there will be a vote among Flight Options and Flexjet pilots whether to have a representative agent.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Although Flexjet pilots are currently not represented by a union, they formed an organizing committee in January, Vojta said, and indications are that there is enough support among those pilots to vote for representation. We are confident that we have the numbers, he said. If the NMB determines that Flight Options and Flexjet are a single carrier and the pilots vote to join IBT 1108, then they will have to integrate both operations seniority lists and then negotiate a new joint collective-bargaining agreement with Directional Aviation.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Last year, Directional Aviation principal Kenn Ricci told AIN that the company wants a single operating system, the sooner the better. At the time, he wasn't sure whether the union would be able to gather enough votes.

I wonder what he thinks now?
[/FONT]

 

[SDCFI]

Yeah, I don't think so... If you go to the other boards you'll see they needed 50% of the flex pilots just to go single carrier anyway. It's a total combined pilot group for Single Carrier and there's no way a simple majority at FLT-OPS would carry the day. The IBT doesn't lose these things because they are so careful to make sure their lead is more than comfortable. That means they had a majority from both groups.

All this announcement really means for Flex guys is they got somewhere between the 50% they needed and the 75% they wanted. The only reason they brought in the FLT-OPS guys was to speed up the process. Now we'll get SLI done this year versus not even voting until early next year if they had waited for more cards.

Not that it matters anymore but the way I understood it is IBT could have petitioned at any time, however assuming approval that would've triggered a vote for them, no union, or some other union. They definitely didn't have the support early on so their best option was to get us to vote them in, that's leaves nothing to chance. My point earlier is that by petitioning instead of continuing the card drive there is still a chance that enough people on both sides will vote no and send them packing. Now they only need more than 50% of the combined group to vote yes so they must feel they have at least that.

Is the end of this year a realistic estimate to get all this done? Somehow I don't think it is going to be easy!

 

[jetwash]

Is the end of this year a realistic estimate to get all this done? Somehow I don't think it is going to be easy!

The way I understand it is that you need 50% plus one of the votes cast.

So we will see who has a better get out the vote organization. There are probably lots of lazy pilots who don't care enough to vote so it will come down to who is more determined to vote.

My bet is that the union has stronger supportes who will cast a ballot.

 

[dashtrasher]

The way I understand it is that you need 50% plus one of the votes cast.

So we will see who has a better get out the vote organization. There are probably lots of lazy pilots who don't care enough to vote so it will come down to who is more determined to vote.

My bet is that the union has stronger supportes who will cast a ballot.

Question I have is a non vote counted as a no vote or is it just not counted?

 

[jetwash]

Question I have is a non vote counted as a no vote or is it just not counted?

Majority of the ballots cast wins.

Before it was a non vote counted as no but that changed a few years ago when some flight attendents had a vote. The NMB interpeted the rule as majority of ballots cast. That was a big change after 75 years and a win for labor.

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2011/12/appeals-court-upholds-union-fr.html/

 

[flexible]

Not that it matters anymore but the way I understood it is IBT could have petitioned at any time, however assuming approval that would've triggered a vote for them, no union, or some other union. They definitely didn't have the support early on so their best option was to get us to vote them in, that's leaves nothing to chance. My point earlier is that by petitioning instead of continuing the card drive there is still a chance that enough people on both sides will vote no and send them packing. Now they only need more than 50% of the combined group to vote yes so they must feel they have at least that.

Is the end of this year a realistic estimate to get all this done? Somehow I don't think it is going to be easy!

You idiot. Every time I see your name next to a post I know I'm prolly about to read some serious bull********************. I hate saying it since we are obviously on the same side of not wanting a union or at least not sure if we do. Evry time you open your stupid mouth you make the rest of us not on the union cheerleading team seem more confusing than caitlin jenner.

Both pilots groups are relatively equal rocket scientist. They would have to have outstanding support on both sides to make the risk worth it or else would be cancelling each other out

no way FLOPS has over 75% with their ********************ty contract so it would have to mean the union knows for a fact FJ is close to 60 by themselves. They have the cards, so you figure it out dumbass. I'm worried thos tjong is locked up and you giving an excuse for complacency irritates me. It ducking does matter.

The NMB is the one who decides the election schedule not the union so your opinion about what seems realistic doesn't amount to a hill of ********************. Once they say yes there is a deadline of 2 months. Ken seems to be all for it so I doubt it will take them long to decide. 2 months from now is September. Do you want to waste that time arguing against the obvious that both sides have the majority of support or do you want to get to work actually getting answers before we commit our lives to years of potential hell based on either ********************ty choice?

 

[slowtation capt]

with their ********************ty contract

You say it's sh@ty, however over the last year and half, nothing has changed for me and my working conditions at Options.

What has changed for? What promises did Ricci make you that he didn't keep? What about that bonus in your "Employment Agreement"? What about that 3% 401K? Etc....

Everything changes for you guys at a whim

Nothing changes for me, as you put it, because of my sh@ty contract.

 

[flexible]

You say it's sh@ty, however over the last year and half, nothing has changed for me and my working conditions at Options.

What has changed for? What promises did Ricci make you that he didn't keep? What about that bonus in your "Employment Agreement"? What about that 3% 401K? Etc....

Everything changes for you guys at a whim

Nothing changes for me, as you put it, because of my sh@ty contract.

Exactly nothing changes for you You stuck the same ********************ty pay for the last however many effing years?

You maybe right about the bonus 401 but I prolly make double what you're highest paid captain makes. If I get my spot on a red label make that triple. Now you're plan is to take away the only opportunity I have make up for my losses because red label points out what the crap sammwich your willing eat at FLOPS?


Can you guarantee me you're precious union won't cut my gravy train off and bring me down to the sub par salary you deal get?

Screw upgrades. Screw seniority. Im not one to be lured by a titles or extra work. I'll sit in a right seat of a POS beech for all I care. Show the money. Your ********************ty contract can't do that and now your trying to drag us down to your level. Now that you pulled this election shenanigans it's just 6 months sooner I end up on your payscale when we're forced into your contract. Thanks.

F@CK THAT. Why so many FJ pilots drank the union kool-aid is beyond me. For me the filing proves we're sealed to the union fats once and for all and 6 months quicker. I just hope we don't regret it now that we don't really have a choice.

 

[luckydog]

Nothing changes for me, as you put it, because of my sh@ty contract.

No offense intended but your contract is what every pilot at FJ wants to avoid. Some are willing to trust the DAC minions, others give away their seniority, and still others hold out for a different union. Denial of the situation won't make this any better

I know it's difficult for some to understand, but at FJ the pilots make more money and have a better QOL because of flexible schedules while the company was more successful more than FlightOptions. I'm positive that FJ under Kenn's leadership will reverse all 3 of those facts as the good 'ol days are long over.

The sad fact is, that with your sh!ty contract life at FJ is going to suck, but life without the contract will see KR changing the rules on a daily basis and everyone's life will be even worse off.

 

[jetwash]

Your ********************ty contract can't do that and now your trying to drag us down to your level. Now that you pulled this election shenanigans it's just 6 months sooner I end up on your payscale when we're forced into your contract. Thanks.

You will never be on the Flight Options pilots current CBA unless you quit Flex and get hired as a new FO pilot.

You might very well be on the new Joint CBA which will be negotiated in the future. If you are worried about a pay cut in the JCBA just vote NO. I don't know of any Flex pilot who would vote Yes for a pay cut in a new JCBA. Plus I can assure you that no Flight Options pilot will vote YES on a JCBA if the pay does not match your current pay.

So relax and enjoy the ride which is about to start.

 

[slowtation capt]

No offense intended but your contract is what every pilot at FJ wants to avoid.

The sad fact is, that with your sh!ty contract life at FJ is going to suck, but life without the contract will see KR changing the rules on a daily basis and everyone's life will be even worse off.

Can you guarantee me you're precious union won't cut my gravy train off and bring me down to the sub par salary you deal get?

Your ********************ty contract can't do that and now your trying to drag us down to your level. Now that you pulled this election shenanigans it's just 6 months sooner I end up on your payscale when we're forced into your contract. Thanks.

And this is the problem, you guys get on here and think that you know everything there is to know about everything.
You yell and curse and try to throw your muscle around thinking you are all mighty.
When in reality you guys are nothing but a bunch of uniformed cry babies.

How many times has it been said that, nobody from FJ will fall under our contract.
A new contract covering all employees will be negotiated.

If I get my spot on a red label make that triple.

Also I make $126,400 a year, last I saw a Red Label G pilot makes $140,000 a year. So you can't even do math either.

Get informed or stop trying to act informed and yelling about false bs.

 

[BlueNose]

No offense intended but your contract is what every pilot at FJ wants to avoid. Some are willing to trust the DAC minions, others give away their seniority, and still others hold out for a different union. Denial of the situation won't make this any better

I know it's difficult for some to understand, but at FJ the pilots make more money and have a better QOL because of flexible schedules while the company was more successful more than FlightOptions. I'm positive that FJ under Kenn's leadership will reverse all 3 of those facts as the good 'ol days are long over.

The sad fact is, that with your sh!ty contract life at FJ is going to suck, but life without the contract will see KR changing the rules on a daily basis and everyone's life will be even worse off.

Sorry, but sometimes you don't get to choose between good and bad, only between bad and worse. The task you have is figuring out which is which. I think most Options guys already know. I also think, if you step back and look objectively at words vs actions, you already know, too. That one side smiles and talks smooth as butter doesn't change the facts of what's happening. To quote the best Western ever, "Don't p!ss down my back and tell me it's raining."

 

[dashtrasher]

Majority of the ballots cast wins.

Before it was a non vote counted as no but that changed a few years ago when some flight attendents had a vote. The NMB interpeted the rule as majority of ballots cast. That was a big change after 75 years and a win for labor.



Thanks Jet

 

[SDCFI]

You idiot. Every time I see your name next to a post I know I'm prolly about to read some serious bull********************. I hate saying it since we are obviously on the same side of not wanting a union or at least not sure if we do. Evry time you open your stupid mouth you make the rest of us not on the union cheerleading team seem more confusing than caitlin jenner.

Both pilots groups are relatively equal rocket scientist. They would have to have outstanding support on both sides to make the risk worth it or else would be cancelling each other out

no way FLOPS has over 75% with their ********************ty contract so it would have to mean the union knows for a fact FJ is close to 60 by themselves. They have the cards, so you figure it out dumbass. I'm worried thos tjong is locked up and you giving an excuse for complacency irritates me. It ducking does matter.

The NMB is the one who decides the election schedule not the union so your opinion about what seems realistic doesn't amount to a hill of ********************. Once they say yes there is a deadline of 2 months. Ken seems to be all for it so I doubt it will take them long to decide. 2 months from now is September. Do you want to waste that time arguing against the obvious that both sides have the majority of support or do you want to get to work actually getting answers before we commit our lives to years of potential hell based on either ********************ty choice?

Holy geez are you always this angry or is it just the internet persona? Someone said seniority integration will be done by the end of this year, looking at the recent airline mergers they haven't gone so well but I'm no expert just genuinely curious. And sorry to burst your bubble but I'm happily on the pro union side and while it may not be the smoothest ride I hardly think it will qualify as hell.

 

[Photoflight]

Last I heard it was over 60% of flex pilots.

IMO: Single carrier is coming, the union is
Coming.

Our fight is against the managemt team that's lied and manipulated us this last year and a half. I would suggest starting to prepare for that.

Hopefully NetJets can lead the way for us all with an industry leading contract and we can capitalize on that.

 

[luckydog]

And this is the problem, you guys get on here and think that you know everything there is to know about everything.
You yell and curse and try to throw your muscle around thinking you are all mighty.
When in reality you guys are nothing but a bunch of uniformed cry babies.

How many times has it been said that, nobody from FJ will fall under our contract.
A new contract covering all employees will be negotiated.



Also I make $126,400 a year, last I saw a Red Label G pilot makes $140,000 a year. So you can't even do math either.

Get informed or stop trying to act informed and yelling about false bs.

For God's sake, stop with the name calling already, you sound like just another internet idiot.

Triple is a bit of a stretch but adding in the never attainable bonus, Red Label has the potential for a nice payout. It's a fools errand.

More to the point, a 9 year Lear captain makes what you do, and I'd bet you've been working for DAC a lot longer than 9 years.

In any case, a new contract will have to be settled, it remains to be seen how that works out. The trend lately is nothing but downward.

 

[dime line]

Exactly nothing changes for you You stuck the same ********************ty pay for the last however many effing years?

You maybe right about the bonus 401 but I prolly make double what you're highest paid captain makes. If I get my spot on a red label make that triple. Now you're plan is to take away the only opportunity I have make up for my losses because red label points out what the crap sammwich your willing eat at FLOPS?


Can you guarantee me you're precious union won't cut my gravy train off and bring me down to the sub par salary you deal get?

Screw upgrades. Screw seniority. Im not one to be lured by a titles or extra work. I'll sit in a right seat of a POS beech for all I care. Show the money. Your ********************ty contract can't do that and now your trying to drag us down to your level. Now that you pulled this election shenanigans it's just 6 months sooner I end up on your payscale when we're forced into your contract. Thanks.

F@CK THAT. Why so many FJ pilots drank the union kool-aid is beyond me. For me the filing proves we're sealed to the union fats once and for all and 6 months quicker. I just hope we don't regret it now that we don't really have a choice.

except with no union YOU wouldn't be going to the Red label program, your not one of Riccis boys, and your "double pay" thingy will go bye bye as well, Ricci has already said that your overpaid. So really the only thing I agree with you on is ... "F@CK THAT" and "Show the money", back to your ME speech, quite funny

 

[dime line]

You will never be on the Flight Options pilots current CBA unless you quit Flex and get hired as a new FO pilot.

You might very well be on the new Joint CBA which will be negotiated in the future. If you are worried about a pay cut in the JCBA just vote NO. I don't know of any Flex pilot who would vote Yes for a pay cut in a new JCBA. Plus I can assure you that no Flight Options pilot will vote YES on a JCBA if the pay does not match your current pay.

So relax and enjoy the ride which is about to start.

add about 30,000 to FJ's payscale that is what I want. Look at Wallmarts scale. And also look at American Airlines new contract +16% into the individual pilots 401k from the company

 

[Praetorian]

You idiot. Every time I see your name next to a post I know I'm prolly about to read some serious bull********************. I hate saying it since we are obviously on the same side of not wanting a union or at least not sure if we do. Evry time you open your stupid mouth you make the rest of us not on the union cheerleading team seem more confusing than caitlin jenner.

Both pilots groups are relatively equal rocket scientist. They would have to have outstanding support on both sides to make the risk worth it or else would be cancelling each other out

no way FLOPS has over 75% with their ********************ty contract so it would have to mean the union knows for a fact FJ is close to 60 by themselves. They have the cards, so you figure it out dumbass. I'm worried thos tjong is locked up and you giving an excuse for complacency irritates me. It ducking does matter.

The NMB is the one who decides the election schedule not the union so your opinion about what seems realistic doesn't amount to a hill of ********************. Once they say yes there is a deadline of 2 months. Ken seems to be all for it so I doubt it will take them long to decide. 2 months from now is September. Do you want to waste that time arguing against the obvious that both sides have the majority of support or do you want to get to work actually getting answers before we commit our lives to years of potential hell based on either ********************ty choice?

Ok here we go. It's the, "get them fighting among themselves that way they vote no" union busting gambit. ^^^

Don't fall for it guys. It's pure troll BS. But expect more of it.

 

[1folinepilot]

Ok here we go. It's the, "get them fighting among themselves that way they vote no" union busting gambit. ^^^

Don't fall for it guys. It's pure troll BS. But expect more of it.

Spoken from the flame baiting fight instigating thug himself.



I have my popcorn popped and ready for the sh!t show you idiots are going to put on.

 

[dime line]

Spoken from the flame baiting fight instigating thug himself.



I have my popcorn popped and ready for the sh!t show you idiots are going to put on.

And your different how?

 

[dime line]

Vvvvvvvv

 

[1folinepilot]

Vvvvvvvv

Wise of you to keep your mouth shut for once. It must be killing you LOL!!!!