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HUGE loss for United
- Thread starter FreightNazi
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Are you guys retarded? How many times does this have to be said: UNITED HAD A PAPER LOSS, NOT A NEGATIVE CASHFLOW PROBLEM!!!!!
Before exiting BK, there are always going to be paper charges to the balance sheet that don't bear any resemblance to actual cashflow. Without these paper charges to the balance sheet, UAL would have made a profit. Things are actually looking up at UAL. I'm surprised.
Before exiting BK, there are always going to be paper charges to the balance sheet that don't bear any resemblance to actual cashflow. Without these paper charges to the balance sheet, UAL would have made a profit. Things are actually looking up at UAL. I'm surprised.
koko nw
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2005
- Posts
- 231
G4G5 thank you, I believe our exclusivity rights might have something to do with the feb 06 get out of jail date, I honestly am not sure. The $50b predication is troublesome.
It was hard to attract "good" talent to a sinking Titanic, the line applications were a bit slim
. Believe me there's no love lost between the employee's and Mr. Tilton....BUT he was handed a big plate of %&@* upon arriving. He has cut costs, yes on the back's of employees and and retiree's no doubt, but the non-labor costs have been drastically altered as well, remember the 1113C's and how long those took with our aircraft leasors? The fights with various city airport agencies and there fee's....ect.
I believe his primary purpose was to turn UAL back into a viable business entity....has he done it? Only time will tell.
By the way, I doubt he will be here much past Feb 06. Hopefully we'll get someone more engaged in running an airline vice turning it around.
cheers
It was hard to attract "good" talent to a sinking Titanic, the line applications were a bit slim
. Believe me there's no love lost between the employee's and Mr. Tilton....BUT he was handed a big plate of %&@* upon arriving. He has cut costs, yes on the back's of employees and and retiree's no doubt, but the non-labor costs have been drastically altered as well, remember the 1113C's and how long those took with our aircraft leasors? The fights with various city airport agencies and there fee's....ect.I believe his primary purpose was to turn UAL back into a viable business entity....has he done it? Only time will tell.
By the way, I doubt he will be here much past Feb 06. Hopefully we'll get someone more engaged in running an airline vice turning it around.
cheers
AA717driver
A simpler time...
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2003
- Posts
- 4,908
FutureTEDpilot said:
You're kidding, right? You expect UAL to recover from a huge Ch.11 process owing the NYC bankers billions and not owning an asset that isn't totally encumbered virtually overnight? (5 years is "overnight" in this business.)
You need to go back and look at how damaging Ch. 11 is to companies and how long it takes to recover (for the very few that do) to even a decent financial position, let alone one that will provide for raises for employees.
If you have 20 years to go in your career AND UAL is stunningly successful upon emergence AND the airline business recovers, you might see a decent contract.
If history is any indicator, you will be lucky to not continue taking concessions right up to the next filing.
Good luck.TC
FutureTEDpilot
Well-known member
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- Mar 7, 2004
- Posts
- 174
It's really not that impressive. AMR proves that it can be done outside of CH11 too. Tilton needs ch11 to get his 15%.
http://cdn.news.aol.com/a/aUpdated: 01:17 PM EDT
AMR Corp 3Q Loss Narrows On Cost Cuts, High Travel Volume
[URL="http://servedby.advertising.com/site=0000695074/mnum=0000303313/genr=1/logs=0/mdtm=1129759920/bins=1/optn=1"]http://servedby.advertising.com/site=0000695074/mnum=0000303313/genr=1/logs=0/mdtm=1129759920/bins=1/optn=1[/URL][URL="http://ar.atwola.com/image/93179290/2103160281/aoladp"]http://ar.atwola.com/image/93179290/2103160281/aoladp[/URL]
FORT WORTH, Texas -(Dow Jones)- AMR Corp. (AMR), the parent of American Airlines, reported a narrower third-quarter loss despite higher fuel costs and travel disruptions from the hurricanes, as the company recorded higher volume and focused on cutting non-fuel expenses.
The company expects to post a "significant loss" in the fourth quarter at the current level of fuel prices.
The third-quarter loss narrowed to $153 million, or 93 cents a share, from $ 214 million, or $1.33 a share, a year earlier, AMR said in a press release Wednesday.
The latest loss included a charge for contract termination and a credit for the reversal of an insurance reserve. Without these items, AMR posted a loss of $95 million, or 58 cents a share, which is worse than a / First Call average estimate of a loss of 55 cents a share.
AMR, which recorded a quarterly profit for the second quarter, said it was unable to sustain profitability despite robust customer volumes because of its inability to pass on fuel-price increases to consumers. AMR said this underscores the need to accelerate its cost-cutting initiatives across the board.
AMR share recently traded 2.7% lower at $11.68.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051204ET
AMR's total operating revenue grew 15% in the third quarter to $5.49 billion from $4.76 billion a year earlier. Results were slightly ahead of Wall Street's estimate of $5.46 billion.
The company attributed the revenue increase to "record high load factors and significantly improved yields." The mainline load factor, or percentage of total seats filled, was 81.2%, an increase of 3.3 points from a year ago. Yield, which represents average fares, was up 8%.
Despite higher revenue, AMR said there is still a disconnect between the price of fuel and the price of air travel. To cover the increase in fuel costs over the past two years, AMR said it would have had to raise fares nearly $75 per roundtrip ticket. But the company's actual average fare increased by only $15 during this time period.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051215ET
AMR ended its third quarter with $3.9 billion in cash and short-term investments, including a restricted balance of $499 million.
The airline, which earlier this week said it will extend a fuel-price-driven reduction in its schedule through January, had previously predicted that hurricanes and fuel prices would have a significant impact on its third-quarter results.
In a separate release, American Airlines said it has made a $22 million contribution to its defined-benefits pension plans, bringing total contributions in 2005 to $310 million. This will be the company's last contribution to the plans for this year.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051228ET
AMR Corp. - Fort Worth, Texas 3rd Quar Sept. 30: 2005 2004 Revenue $5,485,000,000 $4,762,000,000 Net income a (153,000,000) b (214,000,000) Avg shrs (diluted) 164,000,000 161,000,000 Shr earns Net income a (.93) b (1.33) Figures in parentheses are losses.
a. Excluding special items, the loss would've been $95 million, or 58 cents a share.
b. Excluding special items, the loss would've been $232 million, or $1.44 a share.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051247ET
http://cdn.news.aol.com/a/aUpdated: 01:17 PM EDT
AMR Corp 3Q Loss Narrows On Cost Cuts, High Travel Volume
[URL="http://servedby.advertising.com/site=0000695074/mnum=0000303313/genr=1/logs=0/mdtm=1129759920/bins=1/optn=1"]http://servedby.advertising.com/site=0000695074/mnum=0000303313/genr=1/logs=0/mdtm=1129759920/bins=1/optn=1[/URL][URL="http://ar.atwola.com/image/93179290/2103160281/aoladp"]http://ar.atwola.com/image/93179290/2103160281/aoladp[/URL]
FORT WORTH, Texas -(Dow Jones)- AMR Corp. (AMR), the parent of American Airlines, reported a narrower third-quarter loss despite higher fuel costs and travel disruptions from the hurricanes, as the company recorded higher volume and focused on cutting non-fuel expenses.
The company expects to post a "significant loss" in the fourth quarter at the current level of fuel prices.
The third-quarter loss narrowed to $153 million, or 93 cents a share, from $ 214 million, or $1.33 a share, a year earlier, AMR said in a press release Wednesday.
The latest loss included a charge for contract termination and a credit for the reversal of an insurance reserve. Without these items, AMR posted a loss of $95 million, or 58 cents a share, which is worse than a / First Call average estimate of a loss of 55 cents a share.
AMR, which recorded a quarterly profit for the second quarter, said it was unable to sustain profitability despite robust customer volumes because of its inability to pass on fuel-price increases to consumers. AMR said this underscores the need to accelerate its cost-cutting initiatives across the board.
AMR share recently traded 2.7% lower at $11.68.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051204ET
AMR's total operating revenue grew 15% in the third quarter to $5.49 billion from $4.76 billion a year earlier. Results were slightly ahead of Wall Street's estimate of $5.46 billion.
The company attributed the revenue increase to "record high load factors and significantly improved yields." The mainline load factor, or percentage of total seats filled, was 81.2%, an increase of 3.3 points from a year ago. Yield, which represents average fares, was up 8%.
Despite higher revenue, AMR said there is still a disconnect between the price of fuel and the price of air travel. To cover the increase in fuel costs over the past two years, AMR said it would have had to raise fares nearly $75 per roundtrip ticket. But the company's actual average fare increased by only $15 during this time period.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051215ET
AMR ended its third quarter with $3.9 billion in cash and short-term investments, including a restricted balance of $499 million.
The airline, which earlier this week said it will extend a fuel-price-driven reduction in its schedule through January, had previously predicted that hurricanes and fuel prices would have a significant impact on its third-quarter results.
In a separate release, American Airlines said it has made a $22 million contribution to its defined-benefits pension plans, bringing total contributions in 2005 to $310 million. This will be the company's last contribution to the plans for this year.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051228ET
AMR Corp. - Fort Worth, Texas 3rd Quar Sept. 30: 2005 2004 Revenue $5,485,000,000 $4,762,000,000 Net income a (153,000,000) b (214,000,000) Avg shrs (diluted) 164,000,000 161,000,000 Shr earns Net income a (.93) b (1.33) Figures in parentheses are losses.
a. Excluding special items, the loss would've been $95 million, or 58 cents a share.
b. Excluding special items, the loss would've been $232 million, or $1.44 a share.
(MORE TO FOLLOW) Dow Jones Newswires
10-19-051247ET
AnimalTale
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2004
- Posts
- 543
FutureTEDpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2004
- Posts
- 174
AnimalTale said:
Hey Animal tail.
I hear ya. But to be honest my class in 99' we had NO EEOC hires all of us had 6000+ with several types. Most of the EEOC gang was hired in the 88-89 time frame, yes I know of a few exceptions but the same applies to AA and DAL as well now. Your best bet is to worry about yourself because we will never control it anyway.
AnimalTale
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 22, 2004
- Posts
- 543
FutureTEDpilot said:
I agree bro,
I just wanted to know what "FlyUnited's" definition of a "real" pilot was. I am for any pilot who can get hired at any hour. I just hate arrogant statements and implications that Regional Pilots are not "REAL". In fact I think Regional Pilots are more REAL, than we are!
Any way, please dont misunderstand my statement. I just hate arrogance and stupidity.
Cya
FutureTEDpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2004
- Posts
- 174
No Problema Animal man...
I was a "Regional" guy myself, but I [Fly United] is probably just ventimg some fustration at the RJ wonder boys who were all saying that United will be down in flames soon.
I was an IOE Checkairman and was surprised to see some of the bad attitudes around my old airline ACA/Indy, most of the guys where professional but I did run into a few that wanted nothing more than to "gain career advancement" on the backs of furloughed UAL pilots.
Can't we all just get along?
I was a "Regional" guy myself, but I [Fly United] is probably just ventimg some fustration at the RJ wonder boys who were all saying that United will be down in flames soon.
I was an IOE Checkairman and was surprised to see some of the bad attitudes around my old airline ACA/Indy, most of the guys where professional but I did run into a few that wanted nothing more than to "gain career advancement" on the backs of furloughed UAL pilots.
Can't we all just get along?
GogglesPisano
Pawn, in game of life
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2003
- Posts
- 3,939
UAL had an operating profit in a quarter when the vast majority of other airlines -- including a few LCC's -- recorded a loss or barely broke even.I have a feeling UAL will rise again and will eventually kick some serious arse in the industry. Call the bankruptcy process what you want, it worked for UAL and will probably work for NWA and Delta as well. Interesting times.
FutureTEDpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2004
- Posts
- 174
FutureTEDpilot
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2004
- Posts
- 174
QOL you say?
Ha! Ha!
That is the sad part :{
Looking at 20 on 10 off (LCC TED Operation) and all the 320's and 737's are considered "LCC Operation" I have some other job offers so I am thinking hard about this. I know the reserve guys are flying 85-90 hard hours a month. Not the same United that I was hired at.
Ha! Ha!
That is the sad part :{
Looking at 20 on 10 off (LCC TED Operation) and all the 320's and 737's are considered "LCC Operation" I have some other job offers so I am thinking hard about this. I know the reserve guys are flying 85-90 hard hours a month. Not the same United that I was hired at.
GuppyPuppy
Living the Dream
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2001
- Posts
- 803
FutureTEDpilot said:
It's sad that UA and UAL ALPA can't figure out a better way. I'd like to go back to UA due to west coast bases (especially SEA), but sounds like my current job is much better. I'm getting 85-90 hours/month with about 16 days off, seven in a row plus a four day stint over Thanksgiving.
Is there still a 737 base in SEA? Are they still considering an A320 domicile in SEA?
Cheers!
GP....future bypasser
- Joined
- May 12, 2005
- Posts
- 510
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