How to destroy your airline

[RJFlyer]

Caveman - you're certainly right, and I essentially said the same thing -

You can't train surly people to be shiny and happy. You have to hire them already that way. The only way to get those people is to pay them at least what AirTran is paying.

The point is, in ATL anyway, for what we are paying these people (those who are willing to hassle with coming to the airport to work for those wages), 95% of them will NOT have the requisite attitude. To get the shiny, happy people, they'd have to come from outside the immediate airport vicinity, and to get them to do that they have to be paid more.

If your premise is true how do we explain SWA/JB success? They both pay less than the going rate for pilots and mechanics and CSA's yet customer service is allegedly stellar.

What is the 'going rate?' They all make more than ASA's pilots and mechanics and CSAs. And they make less than DAL. I wouldn't say DAL has 'stellar' customer service, but it's pretty good overall from what I've seen, and WAY better than my experiences with UAL. This also comes back to the smaller, newer company mentality - they feel like they make a difference. If you read all of surplus' post, this is also a theme of his. When Comair was its own company, everybody had a better attitude. Once it became a small part of a much larger, long-established company, that feeling went away.

I probably wasn't clear enough before. There are 2 issues involved in ASA's atrocious customer service in ATL, and each tends to exacerbate the other. First, the general work ethic in the available workforce in the ATL airport area is pretty bad (that's why I referenced the local Mickey D's - same people). Second, ASA pay rates for customer service agents is pretty bad, so the only people we can attract are the local airport environ dwellers. Hence, crappy service. If ASA were to pay AirTran or SWA payscales for CSAs, we could attract their same caliber of people, who generally speaking would have to come from other parts of Atlanta. If we did this, we'd have better service.

But back the point you commented on: if Comair thinks the answer to the problem is to hire 'Comair' people to work in ATL, for essentially the same wages as ASA, they're in for a shock. They will be hiring exactly the same people, and the same problems.

 

[surfnole]

I forgot to mention the extra charge was for the board.

American wanted $440 plus $150 minimum for my board. So, $590 for a 2.5 hour pleasure flight from Miami to San Jose. Lacsa was $380 for everything. I can't imagine why anyone would take American with that fare discrepancy.

My one friend even has frequent flyer miles we could have used to take American, but the the board charges, taxes and security fees, we would have paid over $200 to use the miles... Believe it or not, he decided it was better to pay $380 and save the miles for later.

 

[surplus1]

This also comes back to the smaller, newer company mentality - they feel like they make a difference. If you read all of surplus' post, this is also a theme of his. When Comair was its own company, everybody had a better attitude. Once it became a small part of a much larger, long-established company, that feeling went away.

You are essentially correct in how you read my remarks. Before, we were doing something for ourselves, i.e., developing our own Company either to benefit or lose from our efforts. Today we are mere numbers in a quagmire. Whether we excel or fail miserably, little changes and no one notices. The entrepenurial spirit is DOA.

But back the point you commented on: if Comair thinks the answer to the problem is to hire 'Comair' people to work in ATL, for essentially the same wages as ASA, they're in for a shock. They will be hiring exactly the same people, and the same problems.

My apologies for failing to articulate correctly what I was trying to say. I meant that Comair would have replaced the ATL zoo, with Comair people imported from outside. I agree completely with the idea that we could not just hire the same people you have hired in the local area and expect a change.

Also, if Comair were ASA we would not be able to do what I was talking about. We could only do it because we do not hub in ATL. ASA's core business IS Atlanta and there is no way you can "pack up and leave". Two different problems really.

To solve the congestion and gate problems that you have in ATL (which we once had in CVG) Comair had to build and operate its own terminal building. That doesn't appear to be practical in Atlanta. About all you can do there is completely takeover Concourse C. I'm not an ATL expert, but I don't think that would be quite so easy to do as a similar action in CMR's main hub. There's no real comparison between the two airports.

Although much expanded, the CMR terminal in CVG is pretty much full and careful planning is required to control gates and avoid delays. That's one of the reasons delays out of ATL are such a problem for us. We don't serve ATL/CVG as you know, but the down line chain reaction still affects the whole system. Five minutes off schedule can create a 15 minute "no gate" problem. It just mushrooms. That's the technical component rather than the people component.

All of these things are a part of providing good customer service. In reality, airplane driving is but a small part of an airline's total operation. Pilots often forget to consider that fact.

Best regards.

 

[acaTerry]

AlbieF15,

You bring up an interesting point, however I think you missed the boat on one thing.....the "high dollar" customer is ALREADY lost. Your post addresses and makes good points. But I think the airlines' attempt to regain the business of high-end customers is a waste. The pleasure traveller, who is overlooked in this whole thing, is what may save the airlines. This is why SWA, JetBlue, Airtran, etc are thriving while the others go down.
Alot of people laugh and call these guys the "White Trash Express". But really, the joke is not to laugh at. Perhaps the example can be taken....My Junkstream is full----all except for one passenger. The plane is now over 10 minutes late because of this guy. He is a UAL Million Mile member, so we wait and wait. He finally shows up, with his Starbuck's coffee in hand (the cause of the delay) and thinks nothing of the inconvenience and missed connections he caused everyone else. If we do the math, this happens quite a bit, and UAL loses lots of would-be repeat customers. Some may even have become Million milers themselves. All because of one rich snob with no responsibility or courtesy.
These same people are now going frac, because it is not in their inconsiderate, selfish nature to go through the same motions as everyone else. Why court them? I say win back the masses. Just my 2 bits toward your very well thought post.