Hawaiian to aquire another 767

[Erndogg]

Sorry to interupt but I was curious what the retirement numbers are for the next ten years or so?

2007: 17
2008: 15
2009: 16
2010: 10 2 on furlough
2011: 16 1 SLOA sick
2012: 20
2013: 17 1 SLOA sick

after that about an average of 18-20 yr. if the age 60 law upholds?

 

[HAL]

I know you probably have heard this time and time again, but it is the company's stance and I dont see them changing it. What has to happen is that they have to start paying out so much money in recall (could happen soon) or have chronic delay problems due to lack of crews to change their stance. And with the way they are working the pilots right now-I can see that being a problem in the near future.

Yes, I know it is the company's right to do that, but it is so f$(*!ng frustrating to look at the DFS day after day and see 'None, None, None' on the reserve availability while so many are still out on furlough. When the DFS is printed the day before, and it comes out that they already know they don't have anyone available, it's just plain wrong. That staffing formula is the first thing that should be overhauled with the next contract.

HAL

 

[mdanno808]

ALPA should never have approved that formula in the first place.

 

[Jim]

Yes, I know it is the company's right to do that, but it is so f$(*!ng frustrating to look at the DFS day after day and see 'None, None, None' on the reserve availability while so many are still out on furlough. When the DFS is printed the day before, and it comes out that they already know they don't have anyone available, it's just plain wrong. That staffing formula is the first thing that should be overhauled with the next contract.

HAL

In addition to the staffing formula, the contract requires a specific number of reserves each day. It's not a "or" situation, it's an "and". In other words, the minimum number in accordance with the staffing formula AND a minimum number of reserves. If the staff formula does not provide the reserves, than they have to have more pilots than the staffing formula requires.

One pilot on Hangar Talk also said that pilots are giving up more days off and accepting more recall days than the contract allows for. I hope this is not true. I have no problem with them maximizing their time within the contract, but going above that is unsat.

 

[Whale Rider]

Hey Guys, Its rained for 40 DAYS STRAIGHT in Hawaii, When is it going to end Brah???

 

[Dan Roman]

I'm up in Pupukea and the guy next store is building a frigging ark and there are all kinds of pairs of animals walking around. Making me very nervous!

 

[Dan Roman]

and just as I hit post on that last message their was a bolt of lighting!

 

[HAL]

Is Hawaiian going to get the optional Amphibian conversion on the new 767's? Another few inches of rain and I think HNL Intl. is going to require it.

HAL

 

[Hold West]

Go HAL!

Interesting thread. Just a couple of comments:

1. Yay for more planes! Keep me employed....

2. Your staffing discussion was enlightening. Sounds just like working for the FAA these days.

3. East coast route? Yippee! I have beaucoup HAL FF miles, great for going to Arizona to see mom, but I'd like to get back east more often, and that would be pretty cool.

Hang in there!

 

[mdanno808]

A fellow furloughee spoke to Kirk a few days ago, and said that he seemed almost disinterested in the whole staffing thing. He also mentioned the fact that some guys may be refurloughed due to the fact that the Ansett planes leases have not been settled. My dad's neighbor was called and offered above 75 hours to fly on his day off (he's reserve). Is that legal or not? No reserves on numerous days, guys flying max time, plus volunteering days off for extra pay, and the MEC standing idly by: Where's the Ohana that I keep reading about at Hawaiian Airlines?
​

 

[Hansoma]

I think they gave Ohana away with the new contract......

 

[HAL]

A fellow furloughee spoke to Kirk a few days ago, and said that he seemed almost disinterested in the whole staffing thing. He also mentioned the fact that some guys may be refurloughed due to the fact that the Ansett planes leases have not been settled.

You've got to be F'ing kidding me! If that news gets out there will be zero people accepting recall. How serious are they about dumping the Ansett planes, and how many planes is that?

HAL

 

[dash8driver]

this is off topic a bit, but i know all you hal guys are already paying attention to this thread.

rumor is (emphasis on rumor) that hal will be getting sole use of gate 55 and will be giving up 2 gates at the other end of the terminal for go. have you guys heard anything about this?


.

 

[Erndogg]

rumor is (emphasis on rumor) that hal will be getting sole use of gate 55 and will be giving up 2 gates at the other end of the terminal for go. have you guys heard anything about this?

Where are they going to put thier check in counter?? They say that they are going to be in the inter-island terminal, but I dont see any counter space being given up by HAL or AQ.

 

[dash8driver]

yea i dont either. prior to this i had heard that they were getting counter space down by WP.

i just couldnt imagine HAL giving up those two gates. which is why i classify this as a rumor. one of those "believe it when i see it" things.




.

 

[mushroom]

Approx. how many people are on furlough altogether right now? I don't think I saw that anywhere in this thread. Someone I know is friends with a woman who is best friends with a "pilot manager" there (whatever that is...her name is Judy Uding...maybe she is just a secretary or something) and supposedly this "pilot manager" said HAL would be hiring. That gave me encouragement, but reading this thread it is obvious that any new hires are not on the immediate horizon. Too bad..as a Pacific NW resident I would love to fly for Hawaiian.

 

[Jim]

There are 98 on furlough with 22 being recalled in May and June.

 

[mdanno808]

Here's something to think about. Kirk has told two people that I know of that a refurlough is a definite possibility to those accepting recall due to the fact that we may lose the three Ansett Airplanes. This makes the staffing look fairly accurate given that scenario. If we lose three aircraft, and gain 3 (plus an un staffed operational spare), plus the rumored fifth aircraft this summer, then 26 recalls are plenty to staff the flights through Feb 2007. A net gain of 1 aircraft, with a net gain of 13 pilots as of Feb of next year. Makes you wonder....

 

[BORAT]

Anybody know how senior the guys are being called back? Whats the senority range of the remaining guys on furlough?

BORAT

 

[BORAT]

Whats the range of seniority among the guys on furlough?

 

[BORAT]

Sorry, I'm somehow picking up a weak but welcome wireless signal at the gate! Didn't see my first post come up and yeah well...Door closing! I'm off to burn $$$ and hurry up and wait for the final numbers!

 

[HAL]

The most senior person (pre-recall) that hasn't been offered recall on previous bids was hired November '99, and furloughed June '03. The 22 recalls will probably take the active list down to pilots hired in January '00. There will still be 76 on the furlough list, the most junior of which was hired July '01, and was put on furlough in early '03.

mdanno, I had a long phone conversation with Dunkerley yesterday who confirmed that it's actually all seven of the Ansett planes whose leases are up in '07 and '08. It's mostly business as usual during the negotiations to renew those leases - posturing on both sides to get the best deal they can. HA has a little more leverage by buying the ex-Delta planes, but M.D. said the plan is still for growth, unless Ansett won't budge on the lease negotiations, in which case some of the Ansett planes may go away and HA looks for more replacements. Kirk is just being Kirk (glass always half-empty), but in reality nobody in the business has a sure bet. You just have to go with whatever looks best for you in the near-term because there is no way you can control what happens to your airline several years down the road. And that means that yes, I did accept recall. Hope to see many of you over in HNL soon.

HAL

 

[Jim]

And that means that yes, I did accept recall. Hope to see many of you over in HNL soon.

HAL

Gutsy move. I would have bypassed a time or two and watched how things shook out at both airlines (AWA & HAL). Don't get me wrong, I think HAL is the better choice. But after 3+ years of furlough including being recalled and refurloughed once already, I would have been more cautious and kept all my options open for a while longer if I was in your situation.

 

[mdanno808]

Is ground school gonna be in HNL?

 

[HAL]

Is ground school gonna be in HNL?

I don't know, although I'm sure at least part of it will be. The recall paperwork I got said that once the bid is done and they know who is coming back, they will get the formal recall letter stating the class date - which must be at least 30 days out. In my initial letter they gave me a 'rough' date of May 8th, but that may change. Other guys further down the list got a date in early June, so it looks like they'll be running two classes. If they decide to do all the systems training in HNL as opposed to SEA then we'll be there for several weeks before going to the sim.

HAL

 

[mdanno808]

Congratulations. Hope to see you on the line in the next decade or so.

 

[HAL]

Anyone seen a preliminary bid result yet? Nothing posted on the websites so far.

HAL

 

[mdanno808]

Vacancy bid is out. 1 Bypass.

 

[Whale Rider]

Vacancy bid is out. 1 Bypass.

Anyone leaving AWA..errrr....U.S. Air to go back to HAL????

 

[Erndogg]

Whale: only one at HP/US and he's coming back

HAL: Interesting comments by DK. Was told the same thing by other people. I think the reason we went with short term leases is at the time the used LTU airplanes were the issue. They wanted to dump them and get replacements (the two exes. that put the deal together were fired).
Do I think they will return them? NO it's just a negotiation ploy to get the leases down.
If there are better later model 767's on the market next year, then the better it will be for HA as far as getting reasonable leases. Then I can see them dumping those early model A/C.
Welcome back and see you soon!