Hardship

[FlyinBrian]

I've been on strike and been laid-off, have you?

Haven't been on strike, my company can't... But I have been laid off. I'm sitting in my cubicle right now actually. I don't differentiate much between ab-initio programs and PFT. You're selling out people with more experience because you can afford it. Selling others out to get ahead is the same to me all the way around. From flight instructors who work for free, to people can afford to buy their way into a job.

When there is an inflight emergency don't you went to be with someone who is knowledgeable about systems?

Yes, I also want that person to have experience dealing with inflight emergencies. A 1200 hr. CFI who gets through ground school will have both. An ab-initio probably will not.

I have a big problem with the 250 hr. CFI teaching people how to fly

So a 250 hour pilot isn't qualified to be PIC of a 172 and teach Private Pilot maneuvers, but a 500 hour pilot is qualified to PIC a CRJ to minimums if the captain is incapacitated?

I would much rather have a retired airline captain as my instructor rather than a 20something timebuilder.

And I would rather have an experienced pilot fly my family members to minimus with one engine than a 20something timebuilder

I have often though of being a DE as a retirement career. I think many pilots think of going back to instruction as retirees actually. Still, with the exception of 135 single pilot, flight instructing is about the best experience you can get prior to going to the airlines

 

[KingAirer]

Flying brian, i agree with you 100%

 

[mesajock]

All your points are noted. Like all things there are exceptions. Now enlighten me as to what I am (and my fellow ab-initios) are to do to be better pilots with our limited experience. I've got the attitude covered. I'm being serious here..........

 

[FlyinBrian]

Mesajock,

I am of the opinion that if you want to work in aviation, get a job commensurate with the level of experience that you have. Get a 135 job or an instructor job. Whatever you get, take it seriously and do it the best that you can. I think you should start your flying career and cut your teeth where only your life or maybe the life of one passenger (who very likely knows what he's getting into) are at stake.

To jump straight into lugging around 50 passengers when you haven't saved yourself and your airplane from a few near-catastrophes as an instructor, or flying it to mins all day at a 135 operation is asking for trouble.

An FO doesn't just fill a seat. He should be able to fly the plane with competence and confidence while the captain is doing other duties, or is incapacitated.

Ab-initio programs are profit driven, and not safety driven. To me, they are a shortcut that puts richer, less qualified folks in the cockpit. I try to get irritated with the programs instead of the pilots, but sometimes I mis-direct my frustration. Particularly when my instructing experience gets charactarizeds as "1200 hours in the pattern" by someone who is trying to take a shortcut to a job.

 

[mesajock]

Well if nothing else I appreciate your time. Of course you realize I'm not going to back track out of the 1900 to fly freight etc. As for rich... not here, my student loans would make a decent house payment! As for qaulified well thats a matter of opinion and we should probably agree to disagree but, I would put my systems knowlege against anyone (with my amount of time in type). About the only thing we have in common is weve been furloughed and are ready to get back to it.

 

[FlyinBrian]

Flychicaga,

You have a good point in that we've been focusing on time a little too much. It has been said on these boards a million times that experience counts more than time. That is true. My gripe about ab-initio problems really isn't the number of hours, but the lack of experience. 800 hours of solid instructing experience is better than 1200 hours of flying to lunch in severe clear VFR.

Unfortunately, it is difficulty for hiring departments to evaluate true experience, so time tends to sub in in the absense of a better indicator. Two people with 900 dual given could have vastly different experience if one of them took it as a serious job, and the other just sat in the seat while his students built his time for him. But how is a hirinig department to know this?

 

[VGerect]

So a 250 hour pilot isn't qualified to be PIC of a 172 and teach Private Pilot maneuvers, but a 500 hour pilot is qualified to PIC a CRJ to minimums if the captain is incapacitated?

And I would rather have an experienced pilot fly my family members to minimus with one engine than a 20something timebuilder

If I remember correctly, flying a single engine approach down to minimums was part of my FAR 121.441 SIC check ride.

I never said a 500 hr. pilot was qualified to be a CRJ PIC, that would be ridiculous. However, a 500 hr. pilot with the right training can be an effictive SIC, hence the term CREW. If someone can make it through the interview, company ground school, sim sessions, 121.441 ride and IOE than I think they have demonstrated the ability to handle emergencies and stressful situations.

 

[Rick1128]

Brian, I have found that my time as a CFI (CFI-AIME) and as a check airman have kept me sharp. Students and checkee's do the **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**est things. Like pulling the mixture instead of the throttle when turning downwind. Or pulling the the dragchute in flight in a Lear. Both have happened to me plus other interesting things. So a CFI, while he doesn't fly all too much, has to keep mentally flying the aircraft, to keep himself and his student out of trouble. And it is sharpness and being to think his/her way out of problems that will help him/her in their future career.

Of course instructors will get burned out after a point in time. My suggestion is to get more advanced ratings. MEI and II will give you a wider range of students and increase your range of experience.

As for flight time. I have flown with F/O's that had 400 hours and found them to be excellent pilots. I have also flown with Ad-Initio grads, some good, some bad. The good ones always seemed to be the ones that had some good experience but needed a little help out of a rut. The bad ones always seemed to be the ones that were cutting career corners. The bads ones generally either learned or didn't make past probation.

Experience is everything. UAL DC-10 accident at Sioux City, IA and the JAL 747 accident had basicly the same cause. But dramaticly different results. The reason was the experience of the crewmembers. Think about that.

 

[JOPILOT]

VGerect...

VG, look at Rick1128's post and try to realize that pilots are
just people! Some people suck and bitch all the time about
life, others are great at what they do and are humble...which
one would you like to be?

It does not matter how you get the job, just that when you get
it you do your best to be a proficient and safe pilot so everyone
gets home OK. Good Luck and please shut the hell up!

JP

 

[EX_CV580FR8Dawg]

Can't We All Just Get Along?!!!!!!!!