Hand flying vs. Autopilot

[ground stop]

easier to check for traffic maybe?

 

[Willy21]

Maybe they are at MGTOW and their aircraft has a heavy footprint. Seeing as how in ATL short of 26L there isn't alot of room to get rolling before you make the turn they do this so they don't blast the guy behind them.

 

[shamrock]

I've had Delta guys on the jumpseat when the DL plane in front of us (usually an 88) does that and none of them have had an answer as to why it's done.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

With regard to "heavy turns", or rather judgmental oversteer, its not hurting anything and beside its good practice for getting to know where the aircraft's rear wheels really are. Very helpful if you ever have to maneuver on narrow taxiways to avoid dragging your wheels through the mud.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Can somebody explain to me the use of "heavy turns" when turning from a parallel taxiway to hold short at the end of the runway? Is being exactly perpendicular to the runway when holding short really that important? I don't really care if anybody does it, I'm just curious as to why. Kind of like the "how long is final" thing...

For larger aircraft it leaves more room for the other aircraft behind you and also reduces the power to get onto the runway.

It's good technique to get the airplane rolling before you begin to turn the nosewheel. I've seen a bunch of CRJ900 drivers make this mistake in ATL trying to turn out of the gate. Turning that nosewheel before you get her moving is only going to increase the final radius of the turn as well as requiring a rediculous amount of power...not to mention rubbing the tire.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

With regard to "heavy turns", or rather judgmental oversteer, its not hurting anything and beside its good practice for getting to know where the aircraft's rear wheels really are. Very helpful if you ever have to maneuver on narrow taxiways to avoid dragging your wheels through the mud.

Exactly!

 

[waka]

The only problem I have is why people actually give a rats a$$ what other people do, especially since it doesnt affect/concern them in the first place.

and why do you give a rat's ass about what people say about what people do? This could go on and on. What's your problem? Is your ego bruised when someone points out the futility of a "heavy turn" in an RJ to line up on a 10k ft runway?

 

[Dumb Pilot]

This entire thread is another fine example as to why you shouldn't post while drunk, jeeeez

 

[flyboyzii]

As far as the hand flying...I have flown with some who really need the practice. I generally hand fly on t-off till 10,000 and sometimes on the arrival all the way down (below 10,000) Depends on the wx and the workload.

As far as the "heavy" line up....I do it because in the event of an abort I will have that little extra to stomp the fire out. On a taxi way turning for the runway I do it so I won't blast the A/C behind me when I begin to move. (not that I jam the power levers fwd but when they give you the "no delay" Pos & hold I don't blast the folks behind me. Is that okay or do I need permission from others beforehand?? I figure it's common courtesy. Some may be practicing for the future when the Regionals will be flying 777's for $65 per hour.

 

[GINCHBLASTER]

Also remember that passengers notice. They are used to mainline flights, which are most often A/P on from flaps up to Vapp.

Used to mainline flights? Maybe if you flew in the 80's. Regionals operate half of the daily flights in the United States.

 

[Flybywire44]

I absolutely love it when the other guy kicks off the autopilot 40 miles out from landing, then proceeds to fly all over the friggin sky like a bat on a mosquito hunt. Hey all you RJ jockeys who can't hold altitude worth a crap, or constantly zig zag back and forth chasing the localizer (on a VFR approach no less): Leave the freakin AP on and quit embarrassing yourselves.
And when landing on a 10,000' runway, why must you slam on the brakes and go full reverse thrust just to make the first highspeed and perhaps save 10 seconds on the taxi? Why?
That's all.

Maybe you should instruct them? You're part of the problem for not handling this on a person by person basis.

 

[777forever]

I generally hand fly as much as possible my first leg of the day as PF. All other legs AP on ASAP. Im lazy plus I like to enjoy the view, especially flying out of outstations. Now some visual approaches, especially those in the NE, I handfly all the time since they are an absolute joy to fly and I'm looking outside anyway. Hope ASA returns to DCA soon!

 

[papanovember]

Guys who do "heavy turns" onto the runway are dragging the inside tires in the turn. I've seen someone blow out a tire at high speed. It could have been due to the heavy turn it might not have.

I've seen someone turn the nose wheel beyond 90 degrees on 32L T 10 and get stuck. That was real popular with ORD tower.

I've flown with someone who while lining up doing a heavy turn said to me "you know how cool this looks." I just shook my head.

I've ridden around 500 Airbus and Boeing jumpseats and I'd say 25% of the pilots turn the auto pilot on below 10,000 feet and the other 75% turn it on above. From what I've seen, the bigger the airplane the higher they hand fly. Most 757/767/777 guys hand fly well into the 20s.

On landing I'd say 25% turn it off below 1000ft and that includes autolands. The majority turn it off when cleared for the visual but I have seen someone handfly the 777 from TNP when descending into LAX and I've seen many turn it off descending through 10,000.

 

[papanovember]

I absolutely love it when the other guy kicks off the autopilot 40 miles out from landing, then proceeds to fly all over the friggin sky like a bat on a mosquito hunt. Hey all you RJ jockeys who can't hold altitude worth a crap, or constantly zig zag back and forth chasing the localizer (on a VFR approach no less): Leave the freakin AP on and quit embarrassing yourselves.
And when landing on a 10,000' runway, why must you slam on the brakes and go full reverse thrust just to make the first highspeed and perhaps save 10 seconds on the taxi? Why?
That's all.

That first part sounds like an Embraer Autopilot trying to track a localizer. The second part sounds like Southwest, I've actually seen them use autobrake 2 in a 300 on 24R at LAX to make the reverse.

 

[CX880]

I absolutely love it when the other guy kicks off the autopilot 40 miles out from landing, then proceeds to fly all over the friggin sky like a bat on a mosquito hunt. Hey all you RJ jockeys who can't hold altitude worth a crap, or constantly zig zag back and forth chasing the localizer (on a VFR approach no less): Leave the freakin AP on and quit embarrassing yourselves.
And when landing on a 10,000' runway, why must you slam on the brakes and go full reverse thrust just to make the first highspeed and perhaps save 10 seconds on the taxi? Why?
That's all.

If it was an ERJ with distinctive zigzagging down low, it's the ********************ty embraer autopilot trying to track a vor or localizer. But yes I do agree with you, I hate it when RJ pilots disconnect the AP it's very uncomfortable. I love the sound of the AP disconnecting 200 feet above the ground, that meant we had less chance of crashing during the approach.

 

[Dubya]

If it was an ERJ with distinctive zigzagging down low, it's the ********************ty embraer autopilot trying to track a vor or localizer. But yes I do agree with you, I hate it when RJ pilots disconnect the AP it's very uncomfortable. I love the sound of the AP disconnecting 200 feet above the ground, that meant we had less chance of crashing during the approach.

.......said the Gojet hack.

 

[altimaklr]

The CRJ will overshoot the LOC every time and usually will swing back twice to line up correctly. This can be dangerous on simultaneous approaches, hence why people often dc the autopilot around that time.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

Originally Posted by Minimaniac
Also remember that passengers notice. They are used to mainline flights, which are most often A/P on from flaps up to Vapp.

Not true, a lot of guys hand fly the heavy Iron all the time.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Not true, a lot of guys hand fly the heavy Iron all the time.

Yep... it's typical over here to handfly up to at least 18.

On long ILS finals it'll typically come off around the marker. Visuals are always handflown the whole way through manytimes without the FD.

 

[AAsRedHeadedbro]

I hand fly every climbout until I'm pointed in the right direction and am at enroute climb speed above 10,000 feet. I also pretty much hand fly every approach - good weather or bad. I've done this for most of my career and because of that I'm smooth. Trust me, nobody in back knows the autopilot is off, and the reason for that is that BECAUSE I turn off the autopilot and hand fly frequently, I'm comfortable with it.

More guys should do it. They might be better stick and rudder pilots if they did.

As for the 90 degree turn onto the runway - who gives a $h1t? Does it affect you? Or are you just a typical know-it-all busy body?