Frontier is selling four aircraft after record lose

[CitationUltra]

How about DL/NW and Frontier?

Might make sense. Certainly not at any premium over asset value, though. It's hard to see exactly what the NW/DL combine gets out of it.

 

[FBN0223]

Might make sense. Certainly not at any premium over asset value, though. It's hard to see exactly what the NW/DL combine gets out of it.

More Airbus 318/319/320s to replace the Diesel 9s. Oh wait...that's where Compass comes in.

 

[billjohnson321]

loss not lose

 

[CitationUltra]

More Airbus 318/319/320s to replace the Diesel 9s. Oh wait...that's where Compass comes in.

Yeah, NW and DL already have wholly-owned regionals. It's hard to see why they would take on all the downside of F9 just to get the airplanes. And F9 is starting to sell off or roll equity in aircraft, so in a short time, they will have burned through all that money and won't own the airplanes either.

 

[USMC319]

And F9 is starting to sell off or roll equity in aircraft, so in a short time, they will have burned through all that money and won't own the airplanes either.

Really....Wow! Where do you get your inside info that F9 is selling all of their aircraft? I follow it pretty closely and I understand they are selling 4 of their oldest small ones and replacing them with 2 "owned" larger ones. You talk about the "downside" only and don't recognize the upsides. Remember the quarter before last they posted their best profit in history. You are obviously a Frontier hater, but give them a break man, they will survive just like they have all the other times.

I figured a guy with 20K hours would be a bit more respectful, informed, and humble in his opinions rather than trying to sh!t on a particular airline at every turn. That is a sure way to lose credibility. But at the end of the day, nobody knows where any airline might end up, so maybe you will get to do your dance afterall

 

[CitationUltra]

Really....Wow! Where do you get your inside info that F9 is selling all of their aircraft? I follow it pretty closely and I understand they are selling 4 of their oldest small ones and replacing them with 2 "owned" larger ones. You talk about the "downside" only and don't recognize the upsides. Remember the quarter before last they posted their best profit in history. You are obviously a Frontier hater, but give them a break man, they will survive just like they have all the other times.

I figured a guy with 20K hours would be a bit more respectful, informed, and humble in his opinions rather than trying to sh!t on a particular airline at every turn. That is a sure way to lose credibility. But at the end of the day, nobody knows where any airline might end up, so maybe you will get to do your dance afterall

Maybe if you'd take your head out of your ass you'd discover: 1. I didn't state they were selling "all of their aircraft", and 2. It's not exactly "inside information" as it has been published all over the internet.

If you want to ignore this company's death rattles, that's fine, but it is you, sir, who are uninformed and apparently uneducated as to the historical indications of financial trouble in this industry.

 

[USMC319]

Maybe if you'd take your head out of your ass...but it is you, sir, who are uninformed and apparently uneducated as to the historical indications of financial trouble in this industry.

Classy.... I assure you I have business background that is beyond your comprehension and my head is not in the sand in regard to the possible fates of Frontier and every other airline in the industry. I just think it shows poor taste for you to do what you do.

Q-400 eh. Who do you fly for Lynx or Horizon?

 

[FBN0223]

Sad to see a great little airline like Frontier struggling and on it's way out.

 

[Cardinal]

One bad, transitional quarter and they start writing the dirges.....Lord.

 

[CitationUltra]

One bad, transitional quarter and they start writing the dirges.....Lord.

One bad quarter? You mean "bad" in the sense that they just lost a lot more than they lose in a normal quarter?

And what is a "transitional" quarter, anyway?

After all--this thread is all about "The Record Lose".

 

[Cardinal]

F9 usually struggles along just shy of breakeven, and then all of a sudden sees a $30 million loss, -9% operating margin. Something happened, and it wasn't just fuel, else the pack would also be reporting steep losses, but most everybody's just been kicked back to near breakeven.

That something was unrestrained capacity growth/mismanagement, and a total abortion, absolute clusterfuqeria on the regional side. Today the CEO presented an excellent state of the airline address. Mainline CASM was down significantly, the bleeding lie elsewhere.

2/3s of the quarterly loss was in the regional operations column. In early December we were paying FOUR different regional operators for lift, QX, RP, XE, and L4 to serve the same handful of cities out of one hub. All were at sub-optimal numbers, and one was positively hemhorraging cash for zero return. 70 seat RJ's were flying markets meant for turboprops. Next quarter will see only two regional operations, both with optimized fleets, doing what they're supposed to do. The "transition" on the regional side is complete, and by next quarter mainline capacity will be fully adjusted in line with the new management's wishes.

Menke has hacked away all the flying that resulted in obviously empty flights, kicked some ass at the corporate offices, and fired some people. All good signs. At this point I see no need to get on the davits and lower the lifeboats.

 

[CitationUltra]

F9 usually struggles along just shy of breakeven, and then all of a sudden sees a $30 million loss, -9% operating margin. Something happened, and it wasn't just fuel, else the pack would also be reporting steep losses, but most everybody's just been kicked back to near breakeven.

That something was unrestrained capacity growth/mismanagement, and a total abortion, absolute clusterfuqeria on the regional side. Today the CEO presented an excellent state of the airline address. Mainline CASM was down significantly, the bleeding lie elsewhere.

2/3s of the quarterly loss was in the regional operations column. In early December we were paying FOUR different regional operators for lift, QX, RP, XE, and L4 to serve the same handful of cities out of one hub. All were at sub-optimal numbers, and one was positively hemhorraging cash for zero return. 70 seat RJ's were flying markets meant for turboprops. Next quarter will see only two regional operations, both with optimized fleets, doing what they're supposed to do. The "transition" on the regional side is complete, and by next quarter mainline capacity will be fully adjusted in line with the new management's wishes.

Menke has hacked away all the flying that resulted in obviously empty flights, kicked some ass at the corporate offices, and fired some people. All good signs. At this point I see no need to get on the davits and lower the lifeboats.

All good points. You did forget to mention the $25 million pissed away on the Lynx Aviation start-up.

 

[Frap]

I believe that's what he implied by the absolute Charlie Foxtrot adjective.

 

[FBN0223]

Menke has hacked away all the flying that resulted in obviously empty flights, kicked some ass at the corporate offices, and fired some people. All good signs. At this point I see no need to get on the davits and lower the lifeboats.

Good to hear the positive. Hang in there Frontier!!!

 

[Shrek]

Just heard about the partnership with Clear Security VIP line at DIA.

That is definitely thinking out of the box.......the stuff that helps airlines survive....bravo F9.