"Frontier guys" Don't get Greedy!

[Tristar]

Option1 may be in the plans, but by the press releases saying "hiring Fontier employees" says no.

That leaves Option 2. Slowly bleed Frontier to death till it is nothing by a shrunken corpes with no assets, planes, gates and only a bunch of furloughed employees and Certifcate/name that SWA can sell to some upstart/new airline can buy and operate cheap.

This whole thing is great for SWA and most likely very very bad for Frontier pilots and employees. But I guess a preferential interview at SWA is better than nothing.

Just my opinion.......

FNG

If you like odds of 6/1000, sure.

Option 3: WN buys F9, operates it as a separate company. WN management falls in step with every other airline, explains to WN pilots how they are costing too much and need to take pay cuts to match the cost of F9. The whipsaw begins.

 

[bvt1151]

What does Southwest buying some slots from an airline that had already shut down (ATA) have to do with a bid for an airline that is currently flying with 60 aircraft and profitable (F9)?

The last thing you can do is draw comparisons from that. Morris Air is the closest comparison you can make in terms of pilots.

 

[airlinepilot]

Anyone that tries to draw a comparison between ATA is TOTALLY clueless!!!! Any aircraft owned by SWA will be flown by SWAPA pilots. It's in the contract and the pilots at SW are not going along with anything short of that!!! We will not allow GARY to operate two (or more) companies like that.

 

[slaquer5]

If you're unclear on the culture, rent a few episodes of Star Trek featuring the Borg. WN is a lot like that, only more devious and not as likable.

LMO I just spit my coffee out.

 

[HA25]

I hate to say it, but WN is doing nothing more than buying gate slots and routes.. They'll run F9 as an airline with in an airline as long as they can, not encroaching on the WN contract (or not much at least..).. then downsize the one and grow the other.. Their model is rock solid built on 1 type... so at a minimum, they'll need to find a new home for all those buses.. Wish the best, expecting the worse..

 

[dlzav8tr]

the best way to integrate the list keeping both pilot groups relatively happy in my opinion would be the following. Fence off f9 for five years and staple them to the bottom. With pilots from f9 coming over in senoirity order. In five years the most senior f9 capt would be at WN with 700 pilots jr. In that five years there would be several hundred retirements at WN and I would hope some hiring as well.

 

[greenbayfan]

What does Southwest buying some slots from an airline that had already shut down (ATA) have to do with a bid for an airline that is currently flying with 60 aircraft and profitable (F9)?

The last thing you can do is draw comparisons from that. Morris Air is the closest comparison you can make in terms of pilots.

Um, please stop posting until you you what you are talking about. If you think SWA buying slots is all that happened, you must have missed the previous 3 years of history between ATA and SWA, (probably when you were still popping zits and telling any woman who would listen about being a flight instructor). This scenario mirrors the planned demise of ATA. F9 guys better prepare for the worst because that WILL be how this goes down. SWA does not want Airbuses, more employees, or anything having to do with Frontier, all they want is to go head to head with UAL in Denver which would help snuff out even more competition.

SWA is all about eliminating competition. While SWA touted the investment in ATA as a "code share" they eliminated ATA from competing routes out of MDW and IND and increased their yield on those routes by eliminating competition. The same thing will happen in DEN and will allow them to go heads up against a VERY financially wounded UAL. When SWA smells blood, they take advantage of it. Why merge and have all the mess that has been shown to happen with the likes of AA and TWA, when you can increase market share and yield by just dismantling the competition.

F9 guys, do not get your hopes up, because your airline is about to be devoured and you will be collateral damage.....

 

[sshrae]

Um, please stop posting until you you what you are talking about. If you think SWA buying slots is all that happened, you must have missed the previous 3 years of history between ATA and SWA, (probably when you were still popping zits and telling any woman who would listen about being a flight instructor). This scenario mirrors the planned demise of ATA. F9 guys better prepare for the worst because that WILL be how this goes down. SWA does not want Airbuses, more employees, or anything having to do with Frontier, all they want is to go head to head with UAL in Denver which would help snuff out even more competition.

SWA is all about eliminating competition. While SWA touted the investment in ATA as a "code share" they eliminated ATA from competing routes out of MDW and IND and increased their yield on those routes by eliminating competition. The same thing will happen in DEN and will allow them to go heads up against a VERY financially wounded UAL. When SWA smells blood, they take advantage of it. Why merge and have all the mess that has been shown to happen with the likes of AA and TWA, when you can increase market share and yield by just dismantling the competition.

F9 guys, do not get your hopes up, because your airline is about to be devoured and you will be collateral damage.....

OK sunshine. Thats is your opinion. I'm hearing a lot different from people who actually work for SWA, maybe you should read some of their posts. I don't think anybody is getting their hopes up too much, but I honestly think your opinion is not that valuable, no offense.

 

[greenbayfan]

OK sunshine. Thats is your opinion. I'm hearing a lot different from people who actually work for SWA, maybe you should read some of their posts. I don't think anybody is getting their hopes up too much, but I honestly think your opinion is not that valuable, no offense.

What do you think SWA and the people you have heard from that work there are going to say...."we are going to buy you and shut you down"? Of course not, they will tell you what they told us at ATA which is, this will be beneficial for both SWA and Frontier and will help F9 exit BK, but that is NOT what will happen. Right now, SWA has to say the right things if they want this to get through the BK courts, and the right thing is NOT saying it will be "ATA, the Denver Edition".

You can believe what you read in posts and from your "inside sources" at SWA, but SWA and their employees do not want you guys there, they want the valuable parts of your company and to get rid of F9 as competition, period. SWA HAS PROVEN HOW THEY HANDLE THESE SITUATIONS, WHY DO YOU THINK YOUR COMPANY WILL BE DIFFERENT? Frontier will continue to operate as a seperate company even after the sale, just as ATA did, and then the slow death will occur. SWA has figured out that the best way to increase revenue is by eliminating the competitor which increases ticket prices. Buying and operating F9 does nothing to increase their bottom line.

 

[sshrae]

What do you think SWA and the people you have heard from that work there are going to say...."we are going to buy you and shut you down"? Of course not, they will tell you what they told us at ATA which is, this will be beneficial for both SWA and Frontier and will help F9 exit BK, but that is NOT what will happen. Right now, SWA has to say the right things if they want this to get through the BK courts, and the right thing is NOT saying it will be "ATA, the Denver Edition".

You can believe what you read in posts and from your "inside sources" at SWA, but SWA and their employees do not want you guys there, they want the valuable parts of your company and to get rid of F9 as competition, period. Frontier will continue to operate as a seperate company even after the sale, just as ATA did, and then the slow death will occur. SWA has figured out that the best way to increase revenue is by eliminating the competitor which increases ticket prices. Buying and operating F9 does nothing to increase their bottom line.

Again, I suggest you read some of the posts on here by SWA employees. Do you work for SWA? My guess is no. F9 no doubt will cease to exist if this deal goes through, GK has made that clear. However, that does nt mean doom for all the employees, that is where I think you are very mistaken. Your comparison to ATA is inaccurate. SWA did not own ATA, they bought the operating certificate after ATA went out of business. They did give them some money while they were operating but never owned them, in return they had a codeshare and received stakes on the gates at MDW. I feel silly telling you this as I am sure you knew this already. It is a completely different deal than ATA. BTW, I left F9 for arguably the best job in aviation NJA, so MY company has nothing to do with this.