freedom 900 agreement terminated

[vprMatrix]

In many cases....ASA and CMR captains would make more flying them at ASA and CMR.....FOs would make more flying them at Delta....Now we know why there are two different perspectives on this issue.....

Perspective is everything.......

Whether or not these jobs would really pay more at the mainline depends on where you sit......

Joe,


I still wounder how random thoughts in your mind become facts.


Currently the 12 years pay rate at Delta = a 16 years pay rate at ASA. The only reason ASA's current pay rate exceed Delta's is that they have extended CA pay rates out to 20 years and worse they have taken these raises out of the FO rates which stop increasing after 8 years.


Your statement on perspective is also very telling. The probationary FO pay at Delta is greater than the 8 year FO pay scale at ASA. And, Delta's year 5 pay rate for FOs is just slightly more than CA pay at ASA for the same equipment. So for the few people (like you) who are very senior you make a few extra dollars per hour will collectively hosing the rest of the pilot group. (All for one, and more for me.)


Now to get on with the "facts." Lets look at just pay rates without taking into account workrules and th e 11% DC/401k contributions that are increasing to 14% over the next few years.
Pay rates are for 20 year CA and 8 years FOs at ASA and 12 year CAs and FOs at Delta.


January 09
ASA 104.65 / 45.60
Delta 103.57 / 70.71


January 10
ASA 105.70 / 46.05
Delta 107.67 / 73.54


January 11
ASA 106.76 / 46.51
Delta 111.98 / 76.48


January 12
ASA starts 5 more yrs neg. with pay frozen
Delta 116.46 / 79.54


In January 10 a 12 year M88 FO will make the same as an ASA 20 year 76 seat CA.


In January 11 a 12 year DC9 FO will make the same as an ASA 20 years 76 seat CA.

imp:

 

[erikgigem]

I believe it's common knowledge that they've sucked ever since J.O.'s been around...therefore, he must be the "source"!!!

CNN Money
http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/apwire/fbe4ef240e245cec7ee567ca101b6791.htm

 

[777forever]

I see there are several pilots on here who need to get their medicals revoked for insanity. You're going to vote for someone (McCain) who calls pilots morons and will contribute to the destruction of our unions and careers. Nice analytical thought process fellas...

OBAMA 2008!

 

[Jon Rivoli]

Don't forget that you give up "X" years of seniority and QOL for the privilege of starting all over again at the bottom of the list and why not throw in a few years on furlough. How does that affect the equation. Some UAL legacy "real airline pilots" are about to get furloughed for a second time.

 

[viper548]

Four pages and I am the first to mention SkyWest? I surely missed it somewhere....I mean they are still hiring pilots according to the job posting board,( doesnt make sense) they currently fly the CRJ 9. Dont count them out for a piece of the freedum pie!

Skywest stopped hiring last month and are offering early retirements as well as LOA's for up to a year

 

[Jon Rivoli]

Pilots are morons and I would rather sacrifice a union than the whole economy and a way of life. You need to ask your candidate what exactly he means by change. Would it be the kind of change Saul Alinsky advocated?

 

[erikgigem]

And why, if you were a major airline, would you ever want to do business with Mesa?

Good question to ask a lot of CEOs, managers, and board of directors of ...

America West
US Airways
United Airlines
Delta Airlines
Midwest Express
Shenzhen Airlines

 

[Cpt Oveur]

I see there are several pilots on here who need to get their medicals revoked for insanity. You're going to vote for someone (McCain) who calls pilots morons and will contribute to the destruction of our unions and careers. Nice analytical thought process fellas...

OBAMA 2008!

The irony is Mccain's son is an American Airlines Captain. Look on the bright side, at least..... oh yeah, nevermind.

 

[Big Foot]

I see there are several pilots on here who need to get their medicals revoked for insanity. You're going to vote for someone (McCain) who calls pilots morons and will contribute to the destruction of our unions and careers. Nice analytical thought process fellas...

OBAMA 2008!

OK I am NOT a McCain supporter. But when did he say that. I just want more fuel for the fire.

 

[Abernathy]

Who is the idiot that supports Obeama? See the airplanes parked after he causes the next great depression trying to fund his massive wealth redistribution.

Who's the idiot who is part of an airline pilot union and flies for the airline industry yet still supports a candidate who admittedly hates airlines pilots and will do what he can to undermine the profession?

Get an education. In a blue state. They're better.

 

[Abernathy]

OK I am NOT a McCain supporter. But when did he say that. I just want more fuel for the fire.

He didn't call pilots moron's, but he thinks we are. Here's the article that should be posted in every crew room:

Thursday, September 14, 2000

McCain Blasts Pilots for Adding to Air Delays


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Senate Commerce Committee Chairman John McCain
blasted airline pilots on Thursday for what he called their greed and role
in exacerbating gridlock in U.S. skies.

McCain, a Navy pilot shot down over Vietnam, accused pilots at UAL Corp.'s
(UAL.N) United Airlines of carrying out ``work stoppages to satisfy their
personal greed'' and noted a sick-out by pilots at AMR. Corp.'s (AMR.N)
American Airlines last year.

He said many parties, including the Federal Aviation Administration and
Congress, needed to shoulder the blame for aviation congestion. But he
singled out airline pilots for his toughest criticism, going so far as to
question their patriotism.

``This year, more than ever, airline employees have caused enormous
delays,'' said McCain, opening a hearing on air travel delays.

``And you know what saddens me the most? A large number of these pilots are
former military whose code is supposed to be 'duty, honor, country,''' said
McCain, who was held prisoner in Vietnam for 5-1/2 years.

``Now they take action without a thought for the Americans that rely on them
to ferry their families across the country for a family vacation, attend a
wedding or be at the side of a sick relative.''

Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA) President Duane Woerth quickly voiced
outrage at McCain's comments. ``We don't take a patriotic backseat to
anybody,'' Worth told Reuters at the hearing.

During difficult contract talks this summer, United pilots often refused
overtime, causing the airline to cancel thousands of flights and leaving
passengers scrambling to make alternative arrangements.

The problems at United, the world's largest airline, combined with severe
thunderstorms in major U.S. flight lanes led to record delays this summer,
final numbers are expected to show.

Fewer flights have been canceled since a tentative contract deal was reached
late last month. ALPA has denied there was any orchestrated pilot action.

McCain also contrasted pilots' salaries with those of other Americans,
comparing the 1998 per capita income of $20,120 with the $342,000 per year
that top pilots at United would make by 2004 under the tentative contract.

The plain-speaking McCain said Congress had probably contributed to delays
by passing pork barrel legislation that gave money to smaller airports in
lawmakers' districts at the expense of the largest airports that carry the
most passengers.

He said the FAA's air traffic control modernization program had failed to
keep up with the sharp rise in passengers, with 635 million people flying
last year compared with 278 million in 1978, when the airline system was
deregulated.---

The as shole thinks we're unpatriotic? How's this for patriotic: I didn't lose 5 airplanes yet still get to stay in the Navy because daddy was an admiral. It's like Bush all over again.

Also see:
(It's been posted on many websites, I've confirmed the part where he did support the the new arbitration tactics).
Sen. John McCain may have the Republican party nomination wrapped up, but he still has some convincing to do with one group of traditionally Republican voters. No, I'm not talking about evangelical Christians - I'm talking about commercial airline pilots. McCain co-sponsored legislation in 2003 that would have changed the Railway Labor Act to include mandatory "baseball-style" arbitration in airline contract negotiations. That's a method whereby a mediator makes the final decision on disputed issues, and there is no appeal. Unions have long opposed any attempts to force that type of arbitration, because it removes their greatest form of leverage - the ability to strike.
McCain's 2003 effort failed, but lots of pilots still remember it. One told me recently that he will never vote for the Arizona senator, and he believes many of his colleagues feel the same way.
"Look, most pilots are ex-military, they're professionals, most of them vote Republican and have all their lives," the pilot said. "But when it comes to McCain, most of us all remember how he backed airline management and tried to screw the pilots. That's going to cost him some votes."

 

[Big Foot]

thanks I remember seeing it but just wanted to save it for myself.

 

[ParrotheadGTI]

McCain sucks, but I don't see Obama making things any better.

 

[JECKEL]

"Freedom currently operates seven CRJ-900 regional jets for Delta Connection, with a further seven aircraft scheduled to enter service by May 2009. "



TO: Comair Team
FROM: President John Selvaggio
RE: Delta Connection Opportunity Modifies Plan
Our flight schedule for the remainder of the year continues to shift dramatically. Most recently,
Delta Connection requested that we operate additional CRJ900 aircraft beginning in October. In
order to be successful, we must make the following adjustments:
- Fleet: Our maintenance team will begin receiving additional CRJ900s in September. We
will start flying up to three of these aircraft in October, and operate a total of seven by the end of November. The addition of the CRJ900s may not incrementally change our longterm
fleet outlook, and we still anticipate reducing our complement of 50-seat aircraft by
the end of year. Eight CRJ100/200 aircraft will be returned to lessors when their leases
expire, and the remaining 50-seat planes will be utilized less.

 

[mesaserf]

You know a lot of us were saying a few years ago that the bidding wars for regional flying would get nasty.

What's funny from my stand point is the story told about how we got the Dash-8 flying out of JFK. I was told it goes something like this. Delta needed somebody to man some gates out of JFK or otherwise they would end up back in the hands of the Airport Authority and put up for bid. Because Big D needed those gates for future widebody flying they were desperate.

They went to all the code shares and asked the same question. Could you have this thing up and running by X date? All of them said no, except JO. He said hell yes we could make it happen, no sweat. He then goes out and leases all the Dash-8 airframes he can get his hands on and spends a fortune on getting them airworthy. But to his credit in the end he was able to pull it off. In my opinion all this effort was so he could have a favor owed to him by Delta. Lo and behold along comes the 900 flying that JO begines bragging about on company e-mails.

Fast forward to today while we continue to fight in court to save the EMB145 flying. Then the other shoe drops with the announcment about the CX'ing of the JFK 900 flying. Talk about no loyalty...

Man I hope my overseas gig pans out.

Mesaserf

 

[777forever]

OK I am NOT a McCain supporter. But when did he say that. I just want more fuel for the fire.

Source: Fort Worth Star-Telegram

Sen. John McCain may have the Republican party nomination wrapped up, but he still has some convincing to do with one group of traditionally Republican voters. No, I'm not talking about evangelical Christians - I'm talking about commercial airline pilots.

McCain co-sponsored legislation in 2003 that would have changed the Railway Labor Act to include mandatory "baseball-style" arbitration in airline contract negotiations. That's a method whereby a mediator makes the final decision on disputed issues, and there is no appeal. Unions have long opposed any attempts to force that type of arbitration, because it removes their greatest form of leverage - the ability to strike.

McCain's 2003 effort failed, but lots of pilots still remember it. One told me recently that he will never vote for the Arizona senator, and he believes many of his colleagues feel the same way.

"Look, most pilots are ex-military, they're professionals, most of them vote Republican and have all their lives," the pilot said. "But when it comes to McCain, most of us all remember how he backed airline management and tried to screw the pilots. That's going to cost him some votes."

http://startelegram.typepad.com/sky_talk/2008/02/john-mccain-and.html

For the love of your career and future aspirations for your family, do not vote McCain!

 

[777forever]

Pilots are morons and I would rather sacrifice a union than the whole economy and a way of life. You need to ask your candidate what exactly he means by change. Would it be the kind of change Saul Alinsky advocated?

Vote McCain and you'll sacrifice ALL three. I guarantee it.

 

[samballs]

You know a lot of us were saying a few years ago that the bidding wars for regional flying would get nasty.

What's funny from my stand point is the story told about how we got the Dash-8 flying out of JFK. I was told it goes something like this. Delta needed somebody to man some gates out of JFK or otherwise they would end up back in the hands of the Airport Authority and put up for bid. Because Big D needed those gates for future widebody flying they were desperate.

They went to all the code shares and asked the same question. Could you have this thing up and running by X date? All of them said no, except JO. He said hell yes we could make it happen, no sweat. He then goes out and leases all the Dash-8 airframes he can get his hands on and spends a fortune on getting them airworthy. But to his credit in the end he was able to pull it off. In my opinion all this effort was so he could have a favor owed to him by Delta. Lo and behold along comes the 900 flying that JO begines bragging about on company e-mails.

Fast forward to today while we continue to fight in court to save the EMB145 flying. Then the other shoe drops with the announcment about the CX'ing of the JFK 900 flying. Talk about no loyalty...

Man I hope my overseas gig pans out.

Mesaserf

I would say they gave you guys a chance, they gave Mesa 900's. Unfortunately your company happens to be the worst of the terrible regional products. customer service at Mesa is horrible, pilots look like pigs, Flight atts are more ghetto then most, and suck, planes are always broke, etc...

 

[Jon Rivoli]

Vote McCain and you'll sacrifice ALL three. I guarantee it.

Clear enough evidence that giving the vote to 18 year olds was a mistake. Should have gone the other way and pushed it back to 30, maybe 40.

 

[Speedtape]

Two words....windfall profits. You simply cannot tax profits and redistribute them. That equals socailism. Look at the expenditures for oil companys, billions of dollars, R&D costs are through the roof. The percentage of profits based on expenditures to the best of my knowledge are around 15-20 percent last I looked at my portfolio. Pretty much in line with most everything else out there.......wait....jewelery, 40% profits, clothing 30-40%, college textbooks, 25%.

Socialism? What do you think our taxing system is? Look at the tax rates across the board. The middle class is taxed the heaviest and the money is used by the government--to redistribute to the poor and the rich. It's nothing more than a transfer of wealth!

On another note, because of mutiple reasons, the Oil Companies, investors, and distribution network (middle men), are doing nothing more than TRANSFERRING WEALTH, Legal Robbery, by exploiting the middle class by driving the cost of a barrel of oil up. They are transferring money from your pocket to theirs--legally. Then they blame it on the ARABS.