Free TYPEs for ATA

[apache]

Those of us left to pick up the tab for this nonsense would be better served by the 'gubment handing out blue smocks and pointing those former professionals towards the nearest Wallyworld.

This is not an insult to those unfortunate to be out of work. Handing out types just further undermines the job market for others as well as tanks reasonable spending in government.

Some are going to have to suck it up hard to stay in this business or face the cold reality that they are out of the game. Making the working public pay for needless type ratings is not a solution.

 

[Freight Dog]

Actually Apache... We all paid for it via taxes/unemployment insurance, etc.

Would you rather have a pilot collect 25k in unemployment picking his ass, or would you rather spend that money to get that pilot back to work so he can start paying taxes again?

 

[Lear70]

If true, that's not a bad deal at all.

I wonder if they'll extend the same program to the workers that all the other Majors are about to put on the street. Word is 177 furlough at airTran is VERY close at hand... would be great if those guys had some similar type of program...

 

[iwannaflyCAL]

IT'S ABOUT FRIGGIN' TIME......

Finally something worthwhile out of ALPA.

I couldn't believe this when I read it. Kudos to those that are responsible. Nice to read something positive in the airline industry again.

Good luck to all those involved.

 

[vclean]

Escalating fuel prices will force the smaller corporate operators to park their a/c. Travel is one of the first budgets to go.

 

[iwannaflyCAL]

This just in.....Apache is an asshloe...continue

 

[apache]

It would appear that there are quite a few people here that think that they are ENTITLED to a flying job. Perhaps these people would be happier in a more socialist society, where they can be taken care of from the cradle to the grave. The state could also provide them with a greater sense of self-esteem.

Anyone who wants the taxpayers to pay for an unnecessary type rating, probably doesn't possess competitive requirements to rightfully EARN a job otherwise. We all know this to be true, even if it hurts your feelings.

 

[Lear70]

Anyone who wants the taxpayers to pay for an unnecessary type rating, probably doesn't possess competitive requirements to rightfully EARN a job otherwise. We all know this to be true, even if it hurts your feelings.

Well, let's see here...

I have paid over $180,000 in Federal Taxes over the last 15 years in aviation.

I let the government pay my $6,000 type rating when I got laid off after 9/11. That was less than 4% of the total taxes I have paid. It's my fu*king money. No, I have NO problem getting some of it back when I needed it.

If that makes me someone who "doesn't possess competitive requirements to rightfully EARN a job otherwise", then I guess 9,000+ hours, 5 jet type ratings, and no failed training events or checkrides is uncompetitive these days...

I don't think the 4,000+ airline pilots who are about to be on the street by the end of the year fall under that category, either.

In other words, you're barking up the wrong tree, buddy.

 

[apache]

Well, let's see here...

I have paid over $180,000 in Federal Taxes over the last 15 years in aviation.

I let the government pay my $6,000 type rating when I got laid off after 9/11. That was less than 4% of the total taxes I have paid. It's my fu*king money. No, I have NO problem getting some of it back when I needed it.

If that makes me someone who "doesn't possess competitive requirements to rightfully EARN a job otherwise", then I guess 9,000+ hours, 5 jet type ratings, and no failed training events or checkrides is uncompetitive these days...

I don't think the 4,000+ airline pilots who are about to be on the street by the end of the year fall under that category, either.

In other words, you're barking up the wrong tree, buddy.

I see that you are a proponent of the entitlement society, comrade.

If you are angry about the amount of taxes you have paid, I agree with you. That is not the issue. Extrapolate out type ratings, or the equivalent cost, among the literally millions of other workers who have lost their jobs, you would see that the concept is untenable.

Of course, if you are just a crybaby that has to rely on the 'gubment to fix all of your personal shortcomings, then maybe six type ratings will do the trick. Your problem is that I, and millions of other taxpayers, oppose this abuse of public funds, Buddy.

 

[HalinTexas]

Eat my carcass.

I would like to get out of aviation, but I need to find a job as good as what I had to make that work.

 

[Lear70]

I see that you are a proponent of the entitlement society, comrade.

Nope. I'm a proponent of strict time limits on food stamps as well as unemployment benefits. They exist to hold people over until they can get a job, not to support people for life.

It's not about entitlement, it's about taking advantage of the programs that YOU need when YOU have paid into them for all your adult life.

I look at it as an insurance policy. I pay premiums (taxes) and when I have an event that requires a payout (unemployment), I expect a return on my premiums. Period.

That's not "entitlement"; that's receiving benefits that I ALREADY PAID FOR. It's not rocket science.

If you are angry about the amount of taxes you have paid, I agree with you. That is not the issue.

I didn't say it WAS the issue. I also didn't say I was mad about the amount of taxes I pay (I'm not crazy about it, but it's about the same as any proposed "flat tax" would be after my deductions).

What I DID say was that, as a taxpayer, I have every right to take advantage of any programs that will benefit me should I become unemployed. I've already paid for that right. What about this is difficult to understand?

Extrapolate out type ratings, or the equivalent cost, among the literally millions of other workers who have lost their jobs, you would see that the concept is untenable.

First, it's not "millions" of pilots out of jobs, which is what this thread is about: retraining of unemployed pilots by paying for type ratings.

Second, like I said, if those pilots have paid taxes, they have paid for these benefits. End of story. By YOUR reasoning, it was unfair to tax those pilots in the first place, as you would cut them all off without a dime the day the company shut down? Because unemployment benefits are just a "government handout" and those are bad, right? What about food stamps while you're on unemployment looking for a job? Bad again?

Where's the cutoff between "bad" acceptance of government aid, and "good" acceptance of government aid, if you've been a taxpayer for all of your adult life?

Please inform us, oh sanctimonious one, because YOUR ideas of right and wrong MUST be the correct ones...

Of course, if you are just a crybaby that has to rely on the 'gubment to fix all of your personal shortcomings, then maybe six type ratings will do the trick. Your problem is that I, and millions of other taxpayers, oppose this abuse of public funds, Buddy.

I don't know, "Buddy"... I'm hearing crickets on your side of the fence. Where are those other "millions"?

Here's a hint: it's not an "abuse" of public funds if you are the one who gave them those funds in the first place; I think you're the only one here saying it is.

When you are the only one screaming your "message", maybe something is wrong with the way YOU think...?

Just a thought.

Good luck to everyone who is job seeking or will be soon...

 

[Whine Lover]

"Would you rather have a pilot collect 25k in unemployment picking his ass, or would you rather spend that money to get that pilot back to work so he can start paying taxes again?"

I would rather "pick my ass", collect Unemployment, get a free Type Rating....and then, Retire and collect more kraP that you people pay for. (!)

But, that's just me.....A Hardcore Conservative Learning To Accept Liberal Ways / Hippocrite.

God Bless Amerika....and, ME.

Love,

YKMKR

 

[Jetjockey]

I see that you are a proponent of the entitlement society, comrade.

I see your part of the elitist, "I've got mine so screw you " society.

Typical far right Rush Limbaugh lovin' Ultra-Conservative. Can't wait until November.

 

[apache]

Well, here goes.

Lear70, your description of 'gubment is nothing more than self rationalizations. I didn't know that our government was created solely to insure the prosperity of Lear70. Why don't you pick up a book sometime and read about the original purpose of unemployment insurance. It was never meant to bail out any individual worker, but rather to prevent a regional economic collapse resulting from a large number of layoffs in a small region. The program has suffered from mission creep. Also, you do not get to cherry-pick what the government does with your money once you've made your "voluntary contribution" to the IRS. They have alot of legitimate, necessary, silly, or evil things to do with that money before they worry about you, Lear70. As far as food stamps and the rest, if you are in need, by all means use it. I suspect you don't need it, however. Back on topic, when there are going to be, say, 30% fewer "major" airline type jobs as well as fewer corporate flying jobs in the present or near future, how does a taxpayer funded type rating realistically improve the chances of gaining employment when there are few or no viable jobs to be had? You have the right to pursue any career that you wish. You are not entitled to career success. You, I, and everyone else needs to face the fact that there is an excess of labor for this industry and that the excess labor will have to move to lower rungs of aviation or leave the industry.

Hal, thank you for your invitation, but I'll decline. I don't think that you would need a whatever type rating working for that certain company out of ORD. You are better than that, I think. Also, see above.

Jetjockey, you amuse me, but there is evidence available to you to prove that your statement is not correct. You just need to look for it. What I have, I've earned. It could be gone tomorrow. It is not the taxpayers' fault or responsibility to ensure that I can forever fly a Boeing.

Whine Lover. Rams, is that you? You are the one that best explains the situation with such brevity and honesty. If anyone gets a free, unnecessary type rating, I hope it is you. You, more than most people, will appreciate the sticking it to the Man. How about a useless type, like a L188, L1011, or B727. Oh yea, you already have one of those. Take care Rams!

 

[Freight Dog]

The government would rather you get a job making the same or better money than you were with the job you lost. That way, you pay more taxes, you spend more money, you contribute more to the economy, etc... As such, they'd rather pay for a type rating for you to be able to get a job like that, than not contribute at all.

See, here's the thing... at least in our program (Aloha), we don't just pick a type rating out of a hat, and have the government fork over the cash. We actually have to reason why we want a specific type rating, prove that it would help us get a job, or if it's a more expensive type rating, you need to provide a letter from an employer flying that equipment stating they'll hire you with that type rating. It's not just a blanket handout.

$25k+ collecting unemployment and no guarantee of a job or have the gubmint give that up right away in type rating money in exchange for me start paying taxes again...

Well, I'm no math major, but if I were running this show, I'd still opt for the latter...