Flying the Hajj

[Soverytired]

I knew one guy who flew chartered heavy jets for the Haj, and he swore up and down the dirt-ignorant "gentlemen" in the back of the plane cleansed their feet by washing them in the aircraft lavatory.

How could he tell? BLUE FEET.

(To be fair, if I were in their culture, I'd probalby do something equally ignorant, like insist on equal treatment under the law for women or some such nonsense)

 

[Dan Roman]

Generalizations are nice crj, they keep things simple don't they? Kind of like Fox News.

When actually interacting and meeting people from other countries and cultures one on one at a personal level, I rarely find I meet anyone that I truly dislike. That can be said even if I completely disagree with many things inside their countries.

The vast majority of people in any country worldwide, worry about feeding their families and ensuring a better life for their kids. It is the small vocal minority that try and push their religion and whacko views on people. It is politicians, rulers and nut jobs that start wars, not the guy working for a living to feed his family.

As for generalizations, some of the worst acting, rude and arrogant passengers I have ever met where ones that flew out of White Plains, NY. But, that is just what I have experienced.

Very well said.

Travel is one of the best forms of education you can get. It also really puts in perpective how ignorant some people who never leave the U.S. and think Fox news is the end all be all of information are.

 

[Dan Roman]

All depends on where you will be based for the duration.

Bring vitamin C, ehcinecea and anything else that helps stop a cold from coming on.Everyone usually ends up getting "Hajj Cough" which lasts for about 3-4 weeks.

Immodium is another safe item to bring, plan on some quality "reading time" in the john.

By the way, there is a product called Curing. It's a herb you can get at a health food store and works great for slowing down any negative effects of upset digestive track problems.

 

[414Flyer]

A few handy Arabic phrases translated to English --

AKBAR KHALI-KILI HAFTIR LOFTAN.= Thank you for showing me your marvelous gun.
...

Those look Farsi, not Arabic.

 

[DC10]

I have traveled to 72 countries, including every country in the Middle East with the exception of Yemen. I've never been robbed, mugged, threatened in any way or EVER felt in any danger.

The Middle East, along with the rest of the world is an extremely welcoming place for the average foreigner. Treat them with the same respect you'd expect and you can't go wrong. Take the same advice regardless of where you travel.

Travel is the best remedy for narrow-mindedness. Ignore what the mainstream US media, especially FOX News tells you about the rest of the world.

 

[PHXFLYR]

I could not agree more, i am always amazed how the media makes the rest of the world look like nut jobs. Then i walk around the street on the other side of the planet and everyone is warm and polite.

I wold also like to second the White Plains comment, what jerks!

Same here. Spent 10 years flying in and out of there in my commuter days during the quonset hut terminal era. They sure were impressed with themselves. I am thoroughly convinced beyond the shadow of a doubt that they must spend their vacations in Hilton Head,SC (HHH) and have relatives in Orange County, CA (SNA) ;two other cities I've flown in and out of over the years where the clientel thinks the world revolves around them and the rest of us are nothing more than lowly pieons.

PHXFLYR

 

[crj567]

Yep-

White Plains does blow, but go and fly the Hajj ad get back to me about these people......

You have no idea what complete scumbags you are defending. Go and meet a few of them-go and see how they will stone a woman to death after she is raped for "having _ex outside marriage." Maybe you should acquiant yourself with these people before saying they are like everyone else. They simply are not wired right-basic assumptions we all make about good vs. bad are not part of their culture.

-Perhaps you folks think stoning women to death for being raped is a good idea... I do not.

 

[Dan Roman]

There is a lot more misplaced arrogance in this country compared to some "foreign" countries I've been to. As is being well said here, the more time you spend on foreign soil the more you realize how much we all have in common despite our differences.
I find it interesting how much better informed many people outside of the U.S. are about world affairs compared to the average U.S. citizen.

 

[Dan Roman]

Yep-

White Plains does blow, but go and fly the Hajj ad get back to me about these people......

You have no idea what complete scumbags you are defending. Go and meet a few of them-go and see how they will stone a woman to death after she is raped for "having _ex outside marriage." Maybe you should acquiant yourself with these people before saying they are like everyone else. They simply are not wired right-basic assumptions we all make about good vs. bad are not part of their culture.

-Perhaps you folks think stoning women to death for being raped is a good idea... I do not.

Yep and there are Americans that will drag a black man behind a pick up truck in Texas. But I've also met some really nice people from Texas.
There are good people and bad people in every country in the world.

 

[CKJET]

I have done it twice... 97 and 98

The guys on the board have covered just about everything:

1. I have seen a fire lit for cooking. You have to rememer that some of these people may have never seen a car prior to this trip much less an airplane.

2. When ATC gets busy it something that you should tape record and post on this board when you get back. You may find that your English will worsen trying to understand what some of these guys are saying.

Good luck!

 

[zman]

Yep-

White Plains does blow, but go and fly the Hajj ad get back to me about these people......

You have no idea what complete scumbags you are defending. Go and meet a few of them-go and see how they will stone a woman to death after she is raped for "having _ex outside marriage." Maybe you should acquiant yourself with these people before saying they are like everyone else. They simply are not wired right-basic assumptions we all make about good vs. bad are not part of their culture.

-Perhaps you folks think stoning women to death for being raped is a good idea... I do not.

Just a question, are you stupid??

 

[tyuwerty]

I have done it twice... 97 and 98

The guys on the board have covered just about everything:

1. I have seen a fire lit for cooking. You have to rememer that some of these people may have never seen a car prior to this trip much less an airplane.

Good luck!

My favorite, is after some get off the planes and into the terminal at RUH, many have never seen an escalator before. It always results in a backed up line while people are trying to individually hop onto the first moving stair.

Yep-

White Plains does blow, but go and fly the Hajj ad get back to me about these people......

You have no idea what complete scumbags you are defending. Go and meet a few of them-go and see how they will stone a woman to death after she is raped for "having _ex outside marriage." Maybe you should acquiant yourself with these people before saying they are like everyone else. They simply are not wired right-basic assumptions we all make about good vs. bad are not part of their culture.

-Perhaps you folks think stoning women to death for being raped is a good idea... I do not.

That was in Afghanistan, I seem to remember a regime change there in 2001

I was going to write a long response but then I decided that you must be just a tool.

Extremism from any religion or person is reprehensible and there is plenty of that in every country including the USA.

To paraphrase a Nazi's on trial at Nuremberg:

"True evil is a lack of empathy for your fellow human beings".

 

[Cobra17]

If you hand out earplugs...make sure to explain and demonstrate. Experience from two occasions.

-Jordanian Soldiers returning from Afghanistan
-Iraqi voters being shuttled to voting sites

Both thought earplugs looked like(and apparently tasted-since they didn't spit them right out) CHEWING GUM!

I hand the green ones out to kids for Halloween. Never too soon to protect their hearing.

 

[Dan Roman]

Just a question, are you stupid??

I think to be fair, it's not stupid, it's ignorant. I don't mean that as an insult, but in the spirit of "I never was exposed to ......... fill in the blank of whatever learning experience you want to name. People who have limited international experience are in fact ignorant to the ways of the world. If they saw more of the world they would have a broader perspective.

 

[scoreboardII]

OK, I only lived in KSA for five years, so I know a little about their act. Your right, they are just like everyone else; Friendly, family oriented, deeply religious, right up until one of them drives a van full of explosives into your front door and sets it off. Yep, just like us, except for the that blowing up a van thing...

 

[crj567]

I think to be fair, it's not stupid, it's ignorant. I don't mean that as an insult, but in the spirit of "I never was exposed to ......... fill in the blank of whatever learning experience you want to name. People who have limited international experience are in fact ignorant to the ways of the world. If they saw more of the world they would have a broader perspective.

To be fair, I have seen a good bit of the world. There are many wonderful people who reside in many wonderful places, and most of them are honorable and decent. The Islamic culture is different. These guys practice a religion which has no absolute distinction between "right" and "wrong"-which only matter as far as "believers" are concerned. If you are a "non-believer," a whole different set of rules applies. Go ask a Muslim if you don't believe me.

These people are truly not like others. Yes, I have worked closely with Saudis for an extended period, and yes, I do find them to be the most horrible people I have ever come across.

These people are the very definition of evil. They will run onto a school bus full of Jewish school children and detonate themselves, they will throw school girls back into a burning building because these poor girls are trying to get out without wearing their head-dress. They will kill kids in a Russian elementary school to get attention. There are no limits on what can happen to "non-believers," and women-even children.

If you think everyone, everywhere is the same, you are a fool. If you think I am wrong, go and work with these clowns yourself-you will see I am not.

I know a bit more about their culture than you assume. I have discovered an important distinction..... Everyone who has not experiened these people personally thinks: "Everyone, everywhere, is the same-people are all basically good." Anyone who has experienced this culture knows better.

 

[timmay]

To be fair, I have seen a good bit of the world. There are many wonderful people who reside in many wonderful places, and most of them are honorable and decent. The Islamic culture is different. These guys practice a religion which has no absolute distinction between "right" and "wrong"-which only matter as far as "believers" are concerned. If you are a "non-believer," a whole different set of rules applies. Go ask a Muslim if you don't believe me.

These people are truly not like others. Yes, I have worked closely with Saudis for an extended period, and yes, I do find them to be the most horrible people I have ever come across.

These people are the very definition of evil. They will run onto a school bus full of Jewish school children and detonate themselves, they will throw school girls back into a burning building because these poor girls are trying to get out without wearing their head-dress. They will kill kids in a Russian elementary school to get attention. There are no limits on what can happen to "non-believers," and women-even children.

If you think everyone, everywhere is the same, you are a fool. If you think I am wrong, go and work with these clowns yourself-you will see I am not.

I know a bit more about their culture than you assume. I have discovered an important distinction..... Everyone who has not experiened these people personally thinks: "Everyone, everywhere, is the same-people are all basically good." Anyone who has experienced this culture knows better.

Nah you are wrong, those muslims are just misunderstood. I mean whats wrong with a little jihad among friends.

 

[Dan Roman]

Using that logic you could also say all Catholics are pedophiles. Look at some of the extreme behavior in any religion. As far as Muslims thinking "non-believers" are under "a different set of rules", what about Christians that think if you are not a Christian you are going to Hell? Some how I don't think God is up there saying "come on up Rev Falwell, you Dalai Lama are going to Hell. True, the thinking is not as violent as the Muslim fundementalists, but still similar in nature. I.E my religion is right yours is wrong.
I agree that the level of fundamentalist extremism is higher in the middle east than most, but it's a very volatile part of the world.
I guess if you can't stand people that are different one would be better of living in a gated community in the U.S.

 

[Dizel8]

Yep, just like us, except for the that blowing up a van thing...

I seem to remember a certain McVeigh blowing up a truck filled with fertilizer and diesel, plenty of innocent people were killed or injured.

Plenty of countries believe the death penalty is abhorrent, the US still uses it.

 

[Tweaker]

Wait a just a muslim minute! A more redonkoulous example of moral equivilence I have not seen in all my days!

The true fact that one singular event in Texas, in which some criminal-level racists dragged a negro to his death somehow is on the level with many Muslim countries centuries, nee millenia old tradition of subjugating women?!?!?

Van Damme! This is incredibly and obviously offensive and incomparable! Does this country/culture/religion (America) codify (make implicit in our legal tenets) the punishment for crimes is to drag a negro behind a pick up until death?
Hellz to the Nigative!

Sharia law, the Koran, and many muslim countries, on the contrary, have made the LAW of the land such things as cutting off of one's appendages, beheading, and stoning to death. This law is applied in a way that is obvious to all (with the exception of those afraid to call a spade a spade such as NOW (NAGs), duh UN, American and Eurotrash liberals) to be biased against women.

I am continually dumbfounded, but refuse to be surprised by some ignoranus' attempt to equate statistically rare, morally unacceptable, anti-social behavior with gubmints, religions and cultures who make no credible attempts to hide their true beliefs.

Suggested reading for the recovering sheeple and those who enjoy "truthiness" served cold, The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam and the Crusades, by Regnery Press.