FLOPS Impass?

[Galaxy]

B19,
FLOPS is so poor, yet they keep hiring VP's ever other week. What a joke! Maybe you should ask all those non-union employees how they feel about it! I am waiting for the VP of Bull$hit....oh wait thats your title!
INDUSTRY STANDARD CONTRACT or SHUT THE DOORS!

I sent in my application for the VP of Standby Operations to the higher plane address but it was replied with "Not Accepted".

 

[B19 Flyer]

The FLOPS remind me of used car salesmen. I think you guys will agree that the analogy fits. It's like this: Over at FLOPS, run by the infamous Shyster Sheeringa, they're trying to push a lemon off on the pilots because they've underestimated their will to push back and their determination to get a fair deal. The pilots are showing the salesmen that they have come to the lot as fully informed buyers and they aren't giving up their hard-earned experience and skill without a good exchange for its value. When the pilots keep standing there sternly pointing out the flaws in the lemon and quoting the going rate, the used car salesmen will wise up and show them the good cars in the back....or watch the pilots go off to another lot where they will be treated right and get a fair deal. After all, the pilots have to have reliable secure "transportation" for themselves and their families.

I think the "car salesmen" need to make the sell. Sure they lined up other buyers foolish enough to take their lemons, but word on the street is that the deal fell apart when the low-credit buyers couldn't get checked out. They also have the problem of a bad reputation to deal with. Too many pilots have been ripped off exchanging their professional skills for a lemon. Those pilots told their friends and neighbors and now potential buyers are going to the other car lots across town.

Reality is dawning and the message is beginning to sink in that ripping people off doesn't really save money. It just ruins a business. The FLOPS can't help but notice that across town business is booming where they're dealing with the pilots fairly and respectfully. It's up to the FLOPS to run their place according to established industry standards or watch it fall to pieces around them. That responsibility belongs to management. The pilots have their own financial obligations and many have families to support. They can't waste time and lose money on shysters like MS. If the FLOPS manager cares about the business he'll follow the lead of his successful peers in the industry.

Huh? You don't get it do you?

NJ didn't hire and was stagnant and losing money during negotiations, this is normal and you are trying to make it seem like it isn't.

How much is the union paying your husband for you to produce this careless and disrespectful drivel?

How many more embarrassing lines like the one below are you going to write?:

 

[B19 Flyer]

I sent in my application for the VP of Standby Operations to the higher plane address but it was replied with "Not Accepted".

Not qualified, eh? :laugh:

 

[WabiSabi]

This message is hidden because B19 Flyer is on your ignore list.

It's amazing how much better the intelligent dialogue flows on this forum without the disruptions of stupidity. Very nice

 

[SilverSurfer]

VP of hireing VP's

I sent in my application for the VP of Standby Operations to the higher plane address but it was replied with "Not Accepted".

I want to be apply for a new VP positions, VP of hiring VP's. That seems to be the only growing segment of Floptions. It looks that such a position might be the only one with at least short term security.:laugh:

 

[Galaxy]

Bob-soon you will be gone-your job will still be there but someone else will be doing it. I hear Boisture is looking for friends. Call him up then come back and post your boo hoo story of how another union made you lose your job.
Happy to be helping close the doors at FLOPS!

 

[Galaxy]

Not qualified, eh? :laugh:

Nope..Turns out I am too busy doing a long and thorough pre-flight on old broken FLOPS planes. Then I sit in a FBO waiting for MX.

 

[jetwash]

Isn't it funny that the number of pilots and aircraft shrunk almost 50% and the number of Vice Presidents at Flight Options grew by 50 %.

Maybe we should hire a VP to look into this?

 

[netjetwife]

Here's what happened, Jetwash.... The FLOPS tried to put their heads together to solve the problem and discovered they were lacking the required brainpower. Their answer to just add more VPs is not the right one, but considering the source, it comes as no surprise..... Those tempted to believe their FUD need to realize when companies are truly struggling financially they don't have the luxury of wasting money. Since the FLOPS are brainstorming ways to solve their self-induced crisis here are some suggestions to get them back on track. The biggest clue: INDUSTRY STANDARD

It has already been earned!
No more underpaying the pilots
Doing so much to build the business.
Unequivocally, their demands are justified.
Stop wielding the stick, bring out carrots.
Treat the Options pilots like professionals.
Realize that now is the time to settle it.
Your choice--pay right or lose pilots.

Start bargaining in good faith.
Try to see it from the pilots' side--
Admit that the going rate is only fair.
No more acting penny-wise, pound-foolish,
Dragging it out just makes matters worse.
Answers are out there--follow your rivals.
Racing to the bottom is only for losers.
Dare to be the best by paying right.

 

[Galaxy]

It is funny how the words of a pilots wife can upset the desk jockey, village idiot, Fud Spinner, Moron, FUD and Harrasment, Bob-whatever your name is...

I like ya NJW. I wish my wife was as involved as you are.
My family and I are ready for the final chaper.
Ending bad flying jobs one at a time.

A CONTRACT or CLOSING the DOORS!

 

[Whoosh!]

This message is hidden because B19 Flyer is on your ignore list.

Yeah, this is nice feature. Now, if only more people would do this and stop quoting him in their replies. There's only so much arguing you can do with an idiot before you start looking like one yourself...

 

[netjetwife]

Thanks Galaxy! The feeling is mutual... I consider you guys my virtual neighbors. My actual neighbors are nice people but they can't identify with frac issues like y'all do. I'm surprised more of the wives aren't as involved. I guess it's just my personality; I was a very involved AF wife, too, and I volunteer at my children's school.

Regarding ready for it to end, it's definitely time to finish hammering out the contract. The Options pilots and families have been quite patient. Enough already! The FLOPS won't be breaking new ground (which takes longer) all they have to do is follow the industry standard. They are doing that with all the other costs of doing business so they can just add professional pilot wages to the list.

On a related topic, (the analogy fits) stucco is popular in our area; we like the look and the fact it's low maintenance. I started checking it out last summer. Sure I wish it cost less, but I've talked to enough neighbors and done enough research to realize there's a going rate for getting a house stuccoed, especially by an experienced crew. The paint job is failing; I have to make a decision. Invest in stucco--or keep repainting. We're going to follow the lead of our neighbors and have our house done this summer. We decided that the value justifies the expense.

Likewise, the FLOPS have "neighbors" and enough available data to realize that there's a going rate for frac pilots. By now they should have reached the decision I have. When the structure is failing you have to make the investment that ensures its viability. You can go for lasting quality with curb appeal, or spend more over time as you keep replacing a worn out system that looks uninspired. You get what you pay for.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Thanks Galaxy! The feeling is mutual... I consider you guys my virtual neighbors. My actual neighbors are nice people but they can't identify with frac issues like y'all do. I'm surprised more of the wives aren't as involved. I guess it's just my personality; I was a very involved AF wife, too, and I volunteer at my children's school.

Regarding ready for it to end, it's definitely time to finish hammering out the contract. The Options pilots and families have been quite patient. Enough already! The FLOPS won't be breaking new ground (which takes longer) all they have to do is follow the industry standard. They are doing that with all the other costs of doing business so they can just add professional pilot wages to the list.

On a related topic, (the analogy fits) stucco is popular in our area; we like the look and the fact it's low maintenance. I started checking it out last summer. Sure I wish it cost less, but I've talked to enough neighbors and done enough research to realize there's a going rate for getting a house stuccoed, especially by an experienced crew. The paint job is failing; I have to make a decision. Invest in stucco--or keep repainting. We're going to follow the lead of our neighbors and have our house done this summer. We decided that the value justifies the expense.

Likewise, the FLOPS have "neighbors" and enough available data to realize that there's a going rate for frac pilots. By now they should have reached the decision I have. When the structure is failing you have to make the investment that ensures its viability. You can go for lasting quality with curb appeal, or spend more over time as you keep replacing a worn out system that looks uninspired. You get what you pay for.

And I'm sure the going rate for my local brain surgeon is slightly higher than it is for the local general practitioner. I wouldn't expect my local practitioner to charge the higher price simply because he's a doctor.

Flight Options and NJ are two different operations and you seem to think the value is the same. It's not the same. Two different companies, two different balance sheets and two different mixes of fleets.

I'm certain when you get your estimate to fix your stucco, you will get different prices. It's not all one price.

Hamburgers are not the same price everywhere, cars are not the same price everywhere, as a matter of fact, nothing is the same price anywhere, yet by your thinking all pilots should be paid the same.

Go to your local car dealership and see if all is priced the same. Wrong.

You have no respect for the working people.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Here's what happened, Jetwash.... The FLOPS tried to put their heads together to solve the problem and discovered they were lacking the required brainpower. Their answer to just add more VPs is not the right one, but considering the source, it comes as no surprise..... Those tempted to believe their FUD need to realize when companies are truly struggling financially they don't have the luxury of wasting money. Since the FLOPS are brainstorming ways to solve their self-induced crisis here are some suggestions to get them back on track. The biggest clue: INDUSTRY STANDARD

It has already been earned!
No more underpaying the pilots
Doing so much to build the business.
Unequivocally, their demands are justified.
Stop wielding the stick, bring out carrots.
Treat the Options pilots like professionals.
Realize that now is the time to settle it.
Your choice--pay right or lose pilots.

Start bargaining in good faith.
Try to see it from the pilots' side--
Admit that the going rate is only fair.
No more acting penny-wise, pound-foolish,
Dragging it out just makes matters worse.
Answers are out there--follow your rivals.
Racing to the bottom is only for losers.
Dare to be the best by paying right.

The value of anything is what somebody is willing to pay for it. It's clear that FLOPS doesn't want to match NJ wages, thus the best thing to do will be for all those pilots to flock over to NJ. (I'll bet NJ won't take all that want to go though!)

There is a fool born every minute (PT Barnum) and the FLOPS union supporters such as you are a fools to think that the union is going to help the company.

 

[shanes123]

Just thinking out loud here...Wonder if theres a way Flops pilots could market themselves to all the Fractionals? Citation Shares,NJ,Flex,XO Jet..And Cause enough of a mass exodos to FLOPS that we actually shut the doors!! At least we would go on our terms and put Flops three Goons out of commission for good..I for one already have a emergency back up job. Just for the reason that I dont think this company is gonna survive anyway..To bad Flops pilots couldnt all set a date when there last day is and all quit on that day..It would solve Sh*tfingers problem of having to pay the pilots a industry standard wage...I am not talking a strike here..I am talking walking out and not coming back..And watch Flops crumble to the ground