FLIGHT OPTIONS (and only Flight Options) related PILOT discussion

[SilverSurfer]

So let me get this straight...
Now that our company has been run into the ground, we are going to be left high & dry by those who "wanted nothing more than to help us unionize with them"?
Well, the competition is taken care of, time to move on...I called that one WAY back. Still have the utmost faith in OUR OWN union leaders, but I saw the writing on the wall from the others early on.
Really, did anyone think they were "helping" out of the goodness of their hearts?
Keep your friends close, your enemies closer, destroy them, then move on with your segment of the industry now secured.
Priceless.

Sport you really need to get your head out of that dark smelly place.

These people that you are accusing of all kinds of dastardly intentions are leaving us millions in the bank to complete our negotiations. Instead of running you mouth about something you know nothing about you should be thanking these pilots.

Pull your head out dude.

 

[PigPile]

There are two points of view for everything, some more credible than others. I'll take the NY Times over a book written by a union advocate to quote.

Ah, yea, the NY Times has quite the reputation these days doesn't it??

 

[B19 Flyer]

Ah, yea, the NY Times has quite the reputation these days doesn't it??

The quote came from a judge appointed by the DOT and the NY times simply printed it.

I know, next you are going to say that the judge wasn't reputable.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Huh I flew with a man at Flops that started his career at eastern in the Connie, and stayed til the strike. He had a much different outlook than you on what happened there. All I can say he was a great man (JJ not Lorenzo), and would call you a liar.

Back to Eastern again. What about the guys from CAL? You never hear them complain about the airline being saved.

 

[B19 Flyer]

And yet, that's exactly the opposite of what's happened with Netjets and 1108. The most junior on the list got the biggest gains in the most recent contract.



And you need to look at the entire picture, not just what happens with ALPA.

I do look at the big picture. 1108 hasn't been faced with cutbacks yet. When that happens, and it will, that will be the true face of the union.

When they need to make the decision, cut back pay for all and save jobs or keep the upper pay high and let the furloughs happen, where to YOU think they will stand?

Bottom third? Put your walking shoes on...

 

[Diesel]

I do look at the big picture. 1108 hasn't been faced with cutbacks yet. When that happens, and it will, that will be the true face of the union.

When they need to make the decision, cut back pay for all and save jobs or keep the upper pay high and let the furloughs happen, where to YOU think they will stand?

Bottom third? Put your walking shoes on...

I'd like to point out to those that read B19's rambling that the same was said when we got our industry leading contract. Even by friends of mine that work upstairs at CMH said we would bankrupt the company. I knew as those of us that work the line that the contract would bring better efficiency, a happier workforce, and more productivity.

NJ then moved into record profits within the first year after the contract was signed. The company and the pilots union were so happy with the progress they moved forward with the IBB which also passed.

What bothers me is that someone will see B19's ramblings and take it to heart. Not realizing his hidden agenda or his goal. I don't have a goal other than to be throughly annoyed that B19 tries to shoehorn airline history into the fractional model. That he uses quotes, and an agenda to scare or intimidate for his own goals.

You can read his ramblings but take it with a grain of salt.

 

[realityman]

Diesel, from what I've read here, no one believes one word he utters.

If people would quit responding to him, he'd go away. If folks haven't figured out by now that he really doesn't know ONE SINGLE FACT about 1108, Netjets, FLOPS, or the fractional industry in general, then nothing you or I or anyone else can say will convince them.

But it seems like everyone gets it. Folks, ignore him. He really gets off on hijacking these threads.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Diesel, from what I've read here, no one believes one word he utters.

If people would quit responding to him, he'd go away. If folks haven't figured out by now that he really doesn't know ONE SINGLE FACT about 1108, Netjets, FLOPS, or the fractional industry in general, then nothing you or I or anyone else can say will convince them.

But it seems like everyone gets it. Folks, ignore him. He really gets off on hijacking these threads.

So, what you are saying is that you don't want an opposing point of view.

Have another glass of union koolaide and continue to keep the turmoil going..

 

[B19 Flyer]

I'd like to point out to those that read B19's rambling that the same was said when we got our industry leading contract. Even by friends of mine that work upstairs at CMH said we would bankrupt the company. I knew as those of us that work the line that the contract would bring better efficiency, a happier workforce, and more productivity.

NJ then moved into record profits within the first year after the contract was signed. The company and the pilots union were so happy with the progress they moved forward with the IBB which also passed.

What bothers me is that someone will see B19's ramblings and take it to heart. Not realizing his hidden agenda or his goal. I don't have a goal other than to be throughly annoyed that B19 tries to shoehorn airline history into the fractional model. That he uses quotes, and an agenda to scare or intimidate for his own goals.

You can read his ramblings but take it with a grain of salt.

All of this was said during the "Industry Leading Contracts" signed by major airlines in the late '90s.

None of those contracts exist today, and the industry was shredded by them when things got tight.

NJ profits are peanuts by comparison to what the industry was like in those days, and none of us could have envisioned the speed of the downfall.

All of us could envision how bad it would get if unions chose inaction, which is what they did.

Times are very simular to how they were in '99. The economy is slowing down after a long period of growth, but the burdon of fuel right now can be crippling.

Let's see if this same conversation with NJ profits exists 18 months from now. It will be curious.

 

[ProFracPilot]

All of us could envision how bad it would get if unions chose inaction, which is what they did.

Times are very simular to how they were in '99. The economy is slowing down after a long period of growth, but the burdon of fuel right now can be crippling.

Let's see if this same conversation with NJ profits exists 18 months from now. It will be curious.

At the risk of feeding the troll, I'll offer an opinion.

B19, you're attempting to compare apples to oranges. The airlines sell seats as a commodity. We sell a service product. The only comparison between the business models is that both utilize aircraft to provide one aspect of the product. Your arguments are not germaine to this debate, therefore serve only one purpose: to spread disinformation and FUD in an attempt to disrupt the negotiations and divide the workforce at FlOps. Speaking as someone who was vehemently anti-union pre MS, I can assure you, you will not succeed.