Fedex Disputed Pairings

[USNFDX]

By now everyone should know that mem-ewr-fra sequence is disputed. Yet we still have people picking them up!

I Have an RFO pairing(not disputed) next month that links up with a disputed pairing on their last leg to mem. I looked to see who these guys were and realize that f/o who is junior to me is not working Christmass.

As it turns out, this f/o was orignaly awarded a line with a nice long carryover trip over Christmas.

It appears to me, that the company allowed him to trade off of christmas to this disputed pairing!

 

[VaB]

It's Christmas, dude. All bets are off. Not saying it's right, but...

 

[FedExFlyer]

Bah.....Humbug!!!!

 

[sandman2122]

You're right - it's NOT RIGHT.

 

[Goose17]

trading off holidays

You cannot drop the eve and day of holidays per the contract, but you can trade off of the holidays - I have done it before, but you have to get it in right away and your seat must be sufficiently manned for the day.

The fact that he now has a disputed pairing has nothing to do with trading off the holiday.

Goose17

 

[USNFDX]

You cannot drop the eve and day of holidays per the contract, but you can trade off of the holidays - I have done it before, but you have to get it in right away and your seat must be sufficiently manned for the day.

The fact that he now has a disputed pairing has nothing to do with trading off the holiday.

Goose17

It has everything to do with it! With the way the madog is manned, there is now way CRS would allow you trade off of xmass unless they had somthing to gain! IE a hard fill disputed pairing! Also, his orignal pairing was a carryover which per the contract can only be traded for another carryover trip.


So what some of you guys are telling me is it's okay... 'screw your buds it's Christmass'

Maybe I should change my way of thinking

 

[semperfido]

probably....BFD :smash:

 

[Goose17]

hmm,

I am not promoting screwing your buds, I am simply saying you can trade off of holidays. I am not aware of the MD current manning.

As for carryover, you cannot do anything with it as far as drop or trade until you are in that month (i.e. open time is released and trip trading begins for the subsequent month).

You might be right on the conspiracy, but I still want to make the point you can trade off of holidays.

Goose17

 

[FoxHunter]

So what some of you guys are telling me is it's okay... 'screw your buds it's Christmass'

Maybe I should change my way of thinking

Yep, forget about your family, your kids, your buds come first.

 

[USNFDX]

Yep, forget about your family, your kids, your buds come first.

My guess is that you forget about your family and your kids and have NO Buds!

You selfish SOB

 

[PastV1]

You can trade off on a holiday trip but you can not trade a carryover trip. The reason for this is that there is no "Max Open" (FWIW) for the carryover days until the following months open time is released. If someone did I'd be making a few phone calls.

Past....

 

[fox3]

Who Cares!

Good for him if he managed to find a way out of working Christmas, but . . . he's truly a $hitbird for picking up a disputed pairing! When it comes down to the short hairs (negotiations) guys like this worry me -- I would bet he'll cave.

 

[VaB]

Since all I saw was this:

FoxHunterThis user is on your Ignore List.

But you quoted him thusly:

My guess is that you forget about your family and your kids and have NO Buds!

You selfish SOB

I had to read what it wrote.

I'm not agreeing with the cheap, useless wank, however, like I said before, all bets are off on Christmas and if you think guys are going to consult the disputed pairing list when trying to get off on Christmas, you're nuttier than my Aunt Arletta's fruitcake. I do like the conspiracy angle though. I say run with it and if you can prove it on paper, let the union see it.

 

[FedEx1]

I just flew with a guy who was so surprised that this famous disputed pairing was still around.

DUH! It's because people keep flying it!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[FoxHunter]

My guess is that you forget about your family and your kids and have NO Buds!

You selfish SOB

You've got it wrong again in so many ways. Hope you had a nice weekend with your buds.

 

[Echopapa]

Good for him if he managed to find a way out of working Christmas, but . . . he's truly a $hitbird for picking up a disputed pairing! When it comes down to the short hairs (negotiations) guys like this worry me -- I would bet he'll cave.

Negotiations???? Did you say negotiations? Funny you should bring that up...

The only negotiations I am aware of are between the union and the company. The only people voting on a revised contract are union members. The only people asked about their preferences are union members.

You, along with about 3 percent of the pilot population, have voluntarily removed yourself from the negotiation process. In doing so you have chosen to allow your voice to be unheard, at least as far as the union negotiating team is concerned. You are not part of the collective barganing process. You have no vote for the revised contract. You have no say in its outcome. You might as well be a ramp agent for all the impact your opinion will make on the outcome of OUR contract negotiations.

If we have to enter self help you are not invited. Not only do I not expect you to participate, you are not allowed to participate. You are not part of this event.

I won't talk about the negotiations with people who have no say in its construction or ratification. If it is brought up by anyone but a union member (ramp agent, non-member pilot, or neighbor), then my response is the same....I dont want to discuss OUR negotiations with outsiders.

Just sit back and enjoy your ride. This doesn't concern you.

 

[hoya saxa]

Negotiations???? Did you say negotiations? Funny you should bring that up...

The only negotiations I am aware of are between the union and the company. The only people voting on a revised contract are union members. The only people asked about their preferences are union members.

You, along with about 3 percent of the pilot population, have voluntarily removed yourself from the negotiation process. In doing so you have chosen to allow your voice to be unheard, at least as far as the union negotiating team is concerned. You are not part of the collective barganing process. You have no vote for the revised contract. You have no say in its outcome. You might as well be a ramp agent for all the impact your opinion will make on the outcome of OUR contract negotiations.

If we have to enter self help you are not invited. Not only do I not expect you to participate, you are not allowed to participate. You are not part of this event.

I won't talk about the negotiations with people who have no say in its construction or ratification. If it is brought up by anyone but a union member (ramp agent, non-member pilot, or neighbor), then my response is the same....I dont want to discuss OUR negotiations with outsiders.

Just sit back and enjoy your ride. This doesn't concern you.

Excellent precision, not so much on the accuracy... FoxHunter is the one you're thinking of, not Fox3 (who mentioned negotiations)

hoya

 

[VaB]

Negotiations???? Did you say negotiations? Funny you should bring that up...

Ooooops. Looks like it's time for a mediated debrief for another blue on blue. Poor Fox3, he had so much to live for...

Next time, aim for the angry old guy with a change purse and wallet on a chain.

 

[klhoard]

. . .<snip>. . .
I had to read what it wrote.. . .<snip>
.

.
.
.
Now THAT's funny!!! I thought I smelled a nasty, foul, wet, flatulence also. . .
.
.

 

[needapayraise]

How come Polar SETTLED for a 10% raise and your rocket scientists on your MEC/NC OPENED with an 8% raise? Do you FedEx pilots realize how much money you are leaving on the table? And don't give me the line that all you want is scope, retirement, scheduling, and insurance. We are going to get those things too plus a sizable raise, although not as sizable as we were going to get thanks to you guys. I guess ALPA national told you guys that the airline industry is in a bad way and that you shouldn't expect a sizable pay raise. Just wait till Fred tells you guys that if you want scope then you will have to give up your commercial deadheads.

 

[semperfido]

Next time, aim for the angry old guy with a change purse and wallet on a chain.

say it's not true. change purse and wallet on a chin? that is an ugly picture. :uzi:

 

[sandman2122]

needapayraise:

FedEx ALPA is not to blame for your negotiating problems. Feel free to "raise the bar" as high as you can.

Sounds like you guys gave up commercial deadheads?

 

[needapayraise]

Never had them contracturally guaranteed to begin with. Rumor is that Fred is gonna charge you a pretty penny to keep yours.

 

[Echopapa]

Excellent precision, not so much on the accuracy... FoxHunter is the one you're thinking of, not Fox3 (who mentioned negotiations)

hoya

My appologies to Fox3. I can think of no greater insult then to be associated with FoxHunter.

I move to have my comments retracted from the record......

 

[AlbieF15]

Needapayraise,

Taking shots at guys in the same lifeboat isn't good business. We are doing the best we can, just like you guys. Our MEC took a lot of input from the crew force on ways to improve Q of life. Pay RATES a small piece of the puzzle. Trip rigs, duty rigs, etc etc can tweak a lower pay rate into a higher W-2. I think you'll find our guys have researched this pretty well and are doing a good job. The 4 pillars of our next contract didn't come from Herndon, it came from surveys of the line pilots.

I think the last thing a negotiating committee needs during times like these is sniping from their own ranks. We get enough of that from FCIFs and emails from management.

The Brown pilots I know are a good lot and will be working hard to do what is best for you guys. Trust us that we are doing the same for our FDX brethren (and sistren!) If you really want FDX to get an industry leading contract, then walk out at Brown for a week or two--the fallout will cause both companies to consider the ramifications. However, don't goad us for pulling down "your" contract--I think the ball is in your own court there. We have enough on our hands with our own managment without having to make the IPA happy. We are trying to pull each other up here, not down.

PS--Fox 3 is a union member in good standing, but he DID fly a strike Eagle for a while despite being raised as a C model driver. I'm not sure I can be cool about that...

 

[needapayraise]

The problem is that the NMB knows that YOUR ALPA OPENER for pay is LESS than what UPS management currently has on the table and that will make it next to impossible to get anything more out of them.

 

[Marko Ramius]

Wadr....

The problem is that the NMB knows that YOUR ALPA OPENER for pay is LESS than what UPS management currently has on the table and that will make it next to impossible to get anything more out of them.

If your profile is correct, you've been in the civilian portion of this industry for qutie some time. If so, by now you should have learned it's always something else with management. You're simply taking the baitfish they've left for and run with it. If you want that money in your avtar, you guys will have to ignore the bs, keep putting forth comprehensive contract proposals with supporting number, and communicate much better than you have so far. In this environment, companies can drag negotiations out much longer than usual and the NMB will do nothing about it. Keeping the faith and remaining focused on the goals and not worrying about the interference management will always run is the only way it'll work. Or you can go to the regional board and spend all day arguing about how Mesa, SkyWest, Chautaqua, Pinnacle, etc have ruined your contract/life and feel at home.

 

[needapayraise]

If your profile is correct, you've been in the civilian portion of this industry for qutie some time. If so, by now you should have learned it's always something else with management. You're simply taking the baitfish they've left for and run with it. If you want that money in your avtar, you guys will have to ignore the bs, keep putting forth comprehensive contract proposals with supporting number, and communicate much better than you have so far. In this environment, companies can drag negotiations out much longer than usual and the NMB will do nothing about it. Keeping the faith and remaining focused on the goals and not worrying about the interference management will always run is the only way it'll work. Or you can go to the regional board and spend all day arguing about how Mesa, SkyWest, Chautaqua, Pinnacle, etc have ruined your contract/life and feel at home.

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS. The NMB is now questioning how the IPA can be asking for more pay when UPS has more on the table than what FedEx ALPA is even opening for. So you see, our talks are now intertwined with what FedEx is asking for and since they are asking for so little in the way of pay it's going to be very difficult to get much more pay out of UPS no matter what we do. OBTW, the chances of us getting released are slim at best.

 

[fox3]

Apology accepted

My appologies to Fox3. I can think of no greater insult then to be associated with FoxHunter.

I move to have my comments retracted from the record......

Echopappa,
Apology accepted. Guess I better change the screen name to avoid confusion.

 

[New FDX Guy]

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS. The NMB is now questioning how the IPA can be asking for more pay when UPS has more on the table than what FedEx ALPA is even opening for. So you see, our talks are now intertwined with what FedEx is asking for and since they are asking for so little in the way of pay it's going to be very difficult to get much more pay out of UPS no matter what we do. OBTW, the chances of us getting released are slim at best.

Then have your negotiators get smart on the FedEx proposal and rebut this ridiculous angle from the NMB. They are cherry-picking the low hanging fruit to get to you guys early. Stick it to them by throwing all the changes in work-rules and minimum guarantees back in their face. Show them how the W-2 is affected, not just some arbitrary 'hourly' rate.

Also keep in mind that the NMB is against you from the start(I think you already knew this).