Fedex Disputed Pairings

[semperfido]

Next time, aim for the angry old guy with a change purse and wallet on a chain.

say it's not true. change purse and wallet on a chin? that is an ugly picture. :uzi:

 

[sandman2122]

needapayraise:

FedEx ALPA is not to blame for your negotiating problems. Feel free to "raise the bar" as high as you can.

Sounds like you guys gave up commercial deadheads?

 

[needapayraise]

Never had them contracturally guaranteed to begin with. Rumor is that Fred is gonna charge you a pretty penny to keep yours.

 

[Echopapa]

Excellent precision, not so much on the accuracy... FoxHunter is the one you're thinking of, not Fox3 (who mentioned negotiations)

hoya

My appologies to Fox3. I can think of no greater insult then to be associated with FoxHunter.

I move to have my comments retracted from the record......

 

[AlbieF15]

Needapayraise,

Taking shots at guys in the same lifeboat isn't good business. We are doing the best we can, just like you guys. Our MEC took a lot of input from the crew force on ways to improve Q of life. Pay RATES a small piece of the puzzle. Trip rigs, duty rigs, etc etc can tweak a lower pay rate into a higher W-2. I think you'll find our guys have researched this pretty well and are doing a good job. The 4 pillars of our next contract didn't come from Herndon, it came from surveys of the line pilots.

I think the last thing a negotiating committee needs during times like these is sniping from their own ranks. We get enough of that from FCIFs and emails from management.

The Brown pilots I know are a good lot and will be working hard to do what is best for you guys. Trust us that we are doing the same for our FDX brethren (and sistren!) If you really want FDX to get an industry leading contract, then walk out at Brown for a week or two--the fallout will cause both companies to consider the ramifications. However, don't goad us for pulling down "your" contract--I think the ball is in your own court there. We have enough on our hands with our own managment without having to make the IPA happy. We are trying to pull each other up here, not down.

PS--Fox 3 is a union member in good standing, but he DID fly a strike Eagle for a while despite being raised as a C model driver. I'm not sure I can be cool about that...

 

[needapayraise]

The problem is that the NMB knows that YOUR ALPA OPENER for pay is LESS than what UPS management currently has on the table and that will make it next to impossible to get anything more out of them.

 

[Marko Ramius]

Wadr....

The problem is that the NMB knows that YOUR ALPA OPENER for pay is LESS than what UPS management currently has on the table and that will make it next to impossible to get anything more out of them.

If your profile is correct, you've been in the civilian portion of this industry for qutie some time. If so, by now you should have learned it's always something else with management. You're simply taking the baitfish they've left for and run with it. If you want that money in your avtar, you guys will have to ignore the bs, keep putting forth comprehensive contract proposals with supporting number, and communicate much better than you have so far. In this environment, companies can drag negotiations out much longer than usual and the NMB will do nothing about it. Keeping the faith and remaining focused on the goals and not worrying about the interference management will always run is the only way it'll work. Or you can go to the regional board and spend all day arguing about how Mesa, SkyWest, Chautaqua, Pinnacle, etc have ruined your contract/life and feel at home.

 

[needapayraise]

If your profile is correct, you've been in the civilian portion of this industry for qutie some time. If so, by now you should have learned it's always something else with management. You're simply taking the baitfish they've left for and run with it. If you want that money in your avtar, you guys will have to ignore the bs, keep putting forth comprehensive contract proposals with supporting number, and communicate much better than you have so far. In this environment, companies can drag negotiations out much longer than usual and the NMB will do nothing about it. Keeping the faith and remaining focused on the goals and not worrying about the interference management will always run is the only way it'll work. Or you can go to the regional board and spend all day arguing about how Mesa, SkyWest, Chautaqua, Pinnacle, etc have ruined your contract/life and feel at home.

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS. The NMB is now questioning how the IPA can be asking for more pay when UPS has more on the table than what FedEx ALPA is even opening for. So you see, our talks are now intertwined with what FedEx is asking for and since they are asking for so little in the way of pay it's going to be very difficult to get much more pay out of UPS no matter what we do. OBTW, the chances of us getting released are slim at best.

 

[fox3]

Apology accepted

My appologies to Fox3. I can think of no greater insult then to be associated with FoxHunter.

I move to have my comments retracted from the record......

Echopappa,
Apology accepted. Guess I better change the screen name to avoid confusion.

 

[New FDX Guy]

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS. The NMB is now questioning how the IPA can be asking for more pay when UPS has more on the table than what FedEx ALPA is even opening for. So you see, our talks are now intertwined with what FedEx is asking for and since they are asking for so little in the way of pay it's going to be very difficult to get much more pay out of UPS no matter what we do. OBTW, the chances of us getting released are slim at best.

Then have your negotiators get smart on the FedEx proposal and rebut this ridiculous angle from the NMB. They are cherry-picking the low hanging fruit to get to you guys early. Stick it to them by throwing all the changes in work-rules and minimum guarantees back in their face. Show them how the W-2 is affected, not just some arbitrary 'hourly' rate.

Also keep in mind that the NMB is against you from the start(I think you already knew this).

 

[needapayraise]

We are doing just that.

 

[Marko Ramius]

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS.

I do understand that, and even if I didn't, you're pretty much everywhere pointing this out. My commentary still stands though. You almost seem surprised at what New FDX pointed out: the NMB is not your friend. The real problem isn't FDX: it's a terrible labor environment that is currently stacked heavily in management's favor. Too many people thought this tough environment was just for those who were in BK or 'greedy mainline pilots getting a dose of reality'. Fact is it been bad for all of us, and it's going to be a tough road no matter what. That said, without a release, the only thing you can do is keep blasting through the lies presented by the NMB and management so that they can't outlast you. The rest is diversions and part of the game. If you really believe the NMB would change their tune if FDXALPA changed theirs, ask them why they won't release the pilots at Great Lakes after nearly 5 years of negotiations? There isn't a comparison out there that doesn't show them behind their peers yet the excuses continue. There's a bunch of threads about it here if you run a search.

 

[PurpleTail]

What you don't realize is that our NMB mediator has specifically mentioned FedEx ALPA's pay opener as a factor in OUR negotiations with UPS. The NMB is now questioning how the IPA can be asking for more pay when UPS has more on the table than what FedEx ALPA is even opening for.

Hey NeedaBrain~

That's an easy one! Look at your current pay rates X guarentee compared to FDX, you need to be asking for double digit percentage increase just to catch up and be on top. Your amendable date was 6 months ahead of ours so why are you waiting on us to settle our contract. By all means be our guest and show us how its done big boy.

 

[PurpleTail]

As for carryover, you cannot do anything with it as far as drop or trade until you are in that month (i.e. open time is released and trip trading begins for the subsequent month).

You might be right on the conspiracy, but I still want to make the point you can trade off of holidays.

Goose17

There is one more scenerio that occassionally happens where a carryover trip gets dropped (it just happened in LA) and that is JURY DUTY conflict. The person I know had an 11 day trip, from Dec 19-29, that was just dropped without pay.

 

[FedEx1]

Yeah I know flying on the holidays can suck. But I did Thanksgiving on a Monday this year. Maybe celebrate the Epiphany and 3 Kings Day instead of Dec 25th. Make up holidays- a holiday together can be any day. You don't have to fly a disputed pairing in order to love and appreciate your friends and family.

 

[hoya saxa]

There is one more scenerio that occassionally happens where a carryover trip gets dropped (it just happened in LA) and that is JURY DUTY conflict. The person I know had an 11 day trip, from Dec 19-29, that was just dropped without pay.

Mil leave will drop 'em too. Not that there's anything wrong with that! (use Seinfeld inflection here)

hoya

 

[needapayraise]

Hey NeedaBrain~

That's an easy one! Look at your current pay rates X guarentee compared to FDX, you need to be asking for double digit percentage increase just to catch up and be on top. Your amendable date was 6 months ahead of ours so why are you waiting on us to settle our contract. By all means be our guest and show us how its done big boy.

Our 12yr captains make more than your 15yr captains and unlike you , we are going to get a DOUBLE digit pay raise. Just wait till Fred threatens to shut you down like he did last time, you'll roll over again just like you did then.

 

[Champ42272]

To stay on track of the original subject of this thread I submit this. If you fly disputed pairings (regardless of the holidays) it lengthens the time and energy it will take to get a contract.

If you want a contract now, you only have to do one thing.

DPUTFP.

Don't Pick Up The F$cking Phone. This especially applies to all Memphians.

Champ42272

 

[Marko Ramius]

Wait a minute Sarge, what's the point?.....I have no point.

You know everything is not an anecdote. You have to discriminate. You choose things that are funny or mildly amusing or interesting. You're a miracle! Your stories have NONE of that. They're not even amusing ACCIDENTALLY! "Honey, I'd like you to meet Del Griffith, he's got some amusing anecodotes for you. Oh and here's a gun so you can blow your brains out. You'll thank me for it." I could tolerate any insurance seminar. For days I could sit there and listen to them go on and on with a big smile on my face. They'd say, "How can you stand it?" I'd say, "'Cause I've been with Del Griffith. I can take ANYTHING." You know what they'd say? They'd say, "I know what you mean. The shower curtain ring guy. Woah." It's like going on a date with a Chatty Cathy doll. I expect you have a little string on your chest, you know, that I pull out and have to snap back. Except I wouldn't pull it out and snap it back - you would. Agh! Agh! Agh! Agh! And by the way, you know, when you're telling these little stories? Here's a good idea - have a POINT. It makes it SO much more interesting for the listener!

 

[AlbieF15]

..I am thinking "needaraise" is a management plant designed to A) make pilots attack each other instead of sticking together on common goals and B) make pilots appear so unsympathetic nobody can like them.

I'll put him on the ignore list for now...no longer responding to flamebait.