FedEx at Air Inc.

[FNG_that's me]

I'm not really a stone thrower, but I must sum up what's going on here:

mar=inferiority complex

757=sour grapes

I suspect that airlines like military pilots because when they're flying an engine-out approach down to mins the company wants that to not be the scariest situation the pilot has ever seen in an airplane.

 

[AdlerDriver]

As I said before, this thread isn't about how I'm treated on the flight deck.

This thread is about a certain level of bias and now with your latest post even condescension by military pilots towards civilian pilots.

If I, in fact, have a bias it's only been re-enforced by my personal experiences.

And I suppose you could make the same point--and essentially did.

I should have more confidence? Puh-LEEZE! I can forgive this one because we've never flown together...I'm borderline cocky. The "Five Hazardous Attitudes....I invented four of them...

Enjoy your career. You earned it.

I think you tend to see things in people's statements (written and verbal) that aren't really there. How was my last post condescending? How did I exhibit a bias? I acknowledged the value of a diverse pilot force and said that was the best way to have it.

If you're so borderline cocky than why do you seem to be so concerned with this Captain "appreciating" your DC-6 experience? Let your flying abilities speak for you. Then you don't need to convince anyone of anything. They'll see if for themselves.
Adios.

 

[b757driver]

As I said before, this thread isn't about how I'm treated on the flight deck.

This thread is about a certain level of bias and now with your latest post even condescension by military pilots towards civilian pilots.

If I, in fact, have a bias it's only been re-enforced by my personal experiences.

And I suppose you could make the same point--and essentially did.

I should have more confidence? Puh-LEEZE! I can forgive this one because we've never flown together...I'm borderline cocky. The "Five Hazardous Attitudes....I invented four of them...

Once again, I have to agree with mar....some military guys just don't get it! It's not about "us" vs "them", it's about the CIVILIAN cockpit of a jetliner, not some F-16 maverick. The two are world's apart. Yes, the transition can be made between the two. Attitude is more difficult and I guess some feel the need to huddle because that's what they're used to - the old boys' club. What they forget is that they ain't in the military anymore and when you go to a new environment, the norm is to assimilate, not create another status quo and retain a herding instinct.
I made the transition 100% and never looked back. After my reserve time was over, I was on my own, no cushy club to fall back on in any manner, shape or form. And I feel a whole lot better knowing I did it myself with absolutely NO help from anyone.
Again, because some don't get it, I'm perfectly happy where I am and have NO desire to go elsewhere right now. My whole point is about biasness and how some on this thread think that's OK and everyone should see it their way and only a military pilot can be the best. That is so naieve that it doesn't even warrant a response. In an earlier example I mentioned the ex-military Capt who blew 4 tires on a fully-laden 747 because he "forgot" to flare and tried to blame it on the aircraft. How come, if he was so good, well-trained etc. that he could possibly have been so dumb? Gosh, I suppose he was human like the rest of us and therefore EQUALLY able to make the same mistakes as the rest of the pilot fraternity. Like I said, it's all about attitude, respect for everyone and fairness. I'm surprised these virtues seem foreign to some.

 

[b757driver]

B757 driver,

Why don't you clue us in on who your employer is. Or explain why you don't want to.

Just curious how your schedule, benefits, retirement and W2 compares.

BTW, I DID work my my tail off the "old fashioned way" and earned my concrete job, even with internal recommendations. You have NO idea what you're talking about.

Why should I and what difference would it make anyway???? Compares to what?
That makes TWO of us then!

 

[mar]

Now this is gettin' fun!

I suspect that airlines like military pilots because when they're flying an engine-out approach down to mins the company wants that to not be the scariest situation the pilot has ever seen in an airplane.

I was taking this thread pretty seriously until I read this. That is truly hilarious.

Tell me, Sky God, which is a more perilous situation? An engine out on a DC6 or an engine out on a turbojet aircraft?

If you think it's six one way and half a dozen the other, then you too have a total loss of perspective.

This thread is really perfect in a lot of ways because you guys are making my points for me.

But honestly I'm not giving you enough credit. You want so badly to know that your job was rightly acquired through hard work, skill and knowledge. After all, this ain't no flying club where any little rich kid can sign up.

I love the threads started by guys just gettin' out of the military: "Should I go to FedEx or UPS?"

You know, it's like: "Should I wear my brown dress today or my purple dress."

Who cares? Let's go eat.

 

[FNG_that's me]

Sky God...yes, I like that.

Tell me, Sky God, which is a more perilous situation? An engine out on a DC6 or an engine out on a turbojet aircraft?


If you think it's six one way and half a dozen the other, then you too have a total loss of perspective.

Well, I guess that depends on if your turbo-jet is a B-52 or an F-16...talk about loss of perspective.


I'm starting to think that this topic is over your head. I didn't say that there is or isn't a bias, but I did try to explain why someone might prefer a pilot from a certain background.

Allow me to expand. The airlines don't want a pilot to feel(or be) in over his head when the $hit hits the fan in the company aircraft. If a pilot's only background is, say, small plane CFI, commuter slave, major pilot, then when his 737 loses an engine on the approach it might really be the scariest thing that has ever happened to him in his life...by far. Not so for someone who has been shot at while in an aircraft, or landed on the carrier at night, or taken an 8-ship into a grinder, or, yes, even flown the DC-6 into an IFR arrival through a gorge in Alaska...I guess I should add 'or been married'

Let's also clear up two common misconceptions:
1)The airlines are actually hiring you for your piloting skills...mostly false. Sure, you need to be good enough, but they are hiring you for your personality...both as it relates to being a good crew member and to being a good employee

2)The best way to prepare to be a 7x7 captain is to fly the 7x7 a lot...mostly false. Certainly knowlege and experience in the aircraft is a big help, but it is your varied experience that makes you a good captain and gives you the ability to adapt to the next situation that the sim checker had never thought of...(along with the personality that they look for above).

I think that most people can agree with this: a varied background makes for the best candidate. I hear that all the time from both civilian and military folks. Well, here's what I draw from that. Every pilot that is hired at company X will get the same experience in the next 10 years. So the 'varied' part must come before they get hired. If all they did was takeoff, cruise and land for the last 10 years, then they won't have a very varied background 10 years from now...see where I'm going...Now, if they did something out of the ordinary(see the 4 examples 3 paragraphs above) then in 10 years you've got a captain(or furloughee at USAir[sorry]) with quite a diverse flying history under his belt.

That right there is what I think makes the military pilot marketable to the civilian world. Let's face it, you can't dispute that they've dealt with some crazy $hiznit! Heck, the F-16 guy who still has one engine on the DC-10 is smokin' a Lucky on final...no big deal to him. Ok, kind of a big deal, but I think ya get the point.

Think of it as training to be an olympic miler. There is a whole lot more training than just running a mile. Weights, diet, psych preparation...stuff that isn't directly running, but sure helps when the whole package is put together...even the running is varied with sprints to long slow distance. Heck, the warmup jogs before the race add up to more than a mile...all to win the gold in a mile race.

If your issue is that you don't think you get the right amount of respect from the military guys, then I think you do have a complex. They might not know exactly what you did to get where you are, they might not even know what a DC-6 looks like, but they certainly appreciate that is wasn't an easy path to land the job. Again, excepting the 1% of them(and every other group in the world) that doesn't appreciate anything about anybody else.

You know, it's like: "Should I wear my brown dress today or my purple dress."

Cute...now go get your fukcin' shine box!!

 

[mar]

Keep talking fn new guy

<must> <exercsise> <superhuman> <restraint>

God I want to be so sarcastic right now.

This thread is above my head?

Never in my wildest dreams did I think I could actually sucker you guys into admitting that the bias exists and then to have you both demonstrate your condescension in such classic form. But you did it!

It's really beautiful.

Thanks, by the way, for your version of How To Become an Airline Pilot.

Golly, can you recommend a brand of sunglasses or maybe a watch that I should buy?

<sheesh>

 

[sandman2122]

From B757

Why should I and what difference would it make anyway???? Compares to what?
That makes TWO of us then!

Sounds like you're embarrassed or possibly ashamed of revealing this "great company" you've been talking about........

I know FedEx has it's flaws, there's not a perfect company out there, but it's hippocritical for someone to throw out attacks about one company when they don't reveal their own.......

 

[b757driver]

From B757



Sounds like you're embarrassed or possibly ashamed of revealing this "great company" you've been talking about........

I know FedEx has it's flaws, there's not a perfect company out there, but it's hippocritical for someone to throw out attacks about one company when they don't reveal their own.......

Your getting off track here again.......I did not say my present employer was either great or perfect. I said I was HAPPY there and with my lot. So sorry if that offends you and you think only the US majors are the bees knees. I happen to disagree with that and have found my own niche.

At least MY company is not so off the wall and values diversity and is not an old boys club. There is no reason for me to reveal anything, especially to someone as blinkered as you.

Embarrassed? Ashamed? Why? Because I have a job that I am content with and you want to compare apples and oranges? I don't think so.

 

[sandman2122]

I never said I was offended, I just have doubts about this airline you fly for....

Glad to hear this company you talk about is "not so off the wall" and "not an old boys club". Neither is mine. As an OUTSIDER you have no idea what it is like to interview and fly for FedEx - All you hear are stories on the road or on the internet.

Enjoy your job - I'm loving mine!