FedEx and Pilots reach TA !!!!

[1800 RVR]

I hope the terms are favorable and that we can get back to the business of kicking UPS's ass as usual.

First of all, congrats to you Purple people on a TA, and I hope that you guys get what you deserve.

But, Mr. Champ, I would like to know how you guys "kick UPS's ass as usual"? Or, was this comment made, tounge-in-cheek? Remember, karma is a bitch, and both companies are financially strong right now, but I would beg to differ on this comment. But, that is for another thread at another time...

Once again, congrats to the FedEx'ers and can't wait to see the details!

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

You're Wrong

VaB....your understanding is wrong. This has been addressed by various members of the MEC...a number of times. If Bob and the boys say its a good deal, then most likely it is. It doesn't matter what they call it, largely that is semantics....except that Retro Pay requires the company to ammend its earnings reports. That accounting nightmare is not going to happen. Just because it may be called a "signing bonus" vice "retro pay" doesn't mean a thing...depends on what is paid and to whom.

After the job the negotiating committee did, I can't believe you would be juvenile enough to make the statement you did.

My Negotiating Committee still speaks for me....maybe we should change your sticker to "my Negotiating Committee speaks for me....except when it comes to a one item, arbitrary issue based on semantics without me reading an otherwise good document that makes good sense."

I am not trying to start a fight here, I've just seen you make more enlightened posts in the past. Were you drunk?

 

[klhoard]

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Well, let me be the first to go on record as a NO vote . . .
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I've been raking in the cash over the last 18 months while y'all were in negotiations flying VLT, DRF, and AVA. . . .
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I guess the gravy train has officially stopped for four more years. . .
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[VaB]

kc10/c130:

I agree with the whole vice the part issue, but retro pay was a supposed requirement from the beginning. Otherwise, they've got no motivation to get the thing done. It's not the only motivation obviously, but you get the point.

Remember all the cool stickers and people signing off with "One more day of retro pay"? Well, if noone is going to stick to that, what was the friggin point?

Now, you have to do me a favor and tell me if it's a signing bonus instead of retro pay before I look at it, so that I don't accidentally read it.

No, if it's sigining bonus, I don't think I'll be reading it.

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

crack

VAB---must be smokin it

KLHoard.....this is like crack.....I thought you quit....you couldn't resist could you....you'll be back at it 24/7 and before you know it.

Flight info detox is a biatch

 

[Blueline]

Retro pay means "amended" 2004 and 2005 W-2 statements which requires us to file amended returns. It is a huge pain in the a$$ (I had to file an amended return this year for 2005 after the company got a ruling from IRS that Workmens Comp was not tax deductible).

Retro pay counts as income in the year in which the payment was made. It would be on your 2006 W-2 (if paid in 2006). At our airline, our retro pay check allowed contribution to 401K as well as the company match.

 

[VaB]

Well, the negotiating committee guys did do a good job. Just the minor detail of reading what they've actually agreed to.

And I'm pretty sure that it was ALPA that had the stickers made that said the 'one more day of retro pay' thing, it's not like it's something that I made up and making an arbitrary issue. I could be wrong, it's happened from time to time.

Some of you guys are getting pretty fiesty already, and we haven't even seen anything. What's going to happen when we actually get to see some details. I'm all-a-twitter with the exctiement.

Now, Laughing Jakal, have some of this crack, it will calm you down.

 

[Aviator7576]

retro pay

Champ...

For you and the rest of the "tax impaired", you don't have to file amended returns for those years unless you actually got paid the money in those years. The difference between retro pay and a signing bonus matters on the company books. Seems like fedex has a signing bonus that is close to a retro calculation. UPS signing bonus does not take into effect longevity in seat as well as overall longevity.

JMO

Aviator7576

BTW...congrats on the TA

 

[SNIZ]

Retro Pay Calculation

First of all, awesome job by our negotiating committee. I'm thinking if they are happy with the terms I'll vote yes.

Secondly, I looked at our last table position for retro pay. It says 7% x 1404 credit hours based on the Dec 2003 pay rates. IF we got that...then is the calc...1404 x current hourly rate x.07 x #years of service w/o a contract? For me that would be 1404 x 96 x .07 x 2(my time with the company)? Is that correct? Could use some help on that. Also heard during a recent hub turn brief by the MEC that table position was based on your current seat on date of signing.

Thirdly, after we all (me included) stop getting giddy about the retro pay, possible pay raise. I'll wager that the most important/valuable part of this TA will be the work rules/duty rig/daily min CR section and company contribution toward our health care costs. FWIW.

 

[active_herk]

VaB,

Just out of curiosity sake, let's say we are given a signing bonus instead of retro pay, but the UNION (not the company) tells us that the signing bonus is the exact same amount that the retro pay would have been, and that all the people who would have been afforded payment under retro pay will receive the signing bonus (for example those who have retired and those who have left for other reasons). Let's also say that they have negotiated it so that all the tax implications are the same as well. They have also ensured that retirement calculations (high 5, B plan contributions, etc.) are exactly the same. In other words, in the unions eyes it IS EXACTLY THE SAME except for the name, would you still be against it?

 

[VaB]

VaB,

Just out of curiosity sake, let's say we are given a signing bonus instead of retro pay, but the UNION (not the company) tells us that the signing bonus is the exact same amount that the retro pay would have been, and that all the people who would have been afforded payment under retro pay will receive the signing bonus (for example those who have retired and those who have left for other reasons). Let's also say that they have negotiated it so that all the tax implications are the same as well. They have also ensured that retirement calculations (high 5, B plan contributions, etc.) are exactly the same. In other words, in the unions eyes it IS EXACTLY THE SAME except for the name, would you still be against it?

Alright, alright. I've had a few grilling beers since the posts above and have come back to earth a bit. I rescind what I said about not reading the thing, but I will be a bit more skeptical of the bonus vice retro. I mean, that was the war cry we have been singing since Day 1. William Wallace had "Freedom!!!" and we, FedEx ALPA, have had "One more day of retro pay". But I shall remain open-minded and closed-mouth.

Someone admitting they are wrong on FI? Got to be a first.

 

[FoxHunter]

Gentlemen,



Second, I don't want Retro Pay. I want a signing bonus. Here is the reason. Retro pay means "amended" 2004 and 2005 W-2 statements which requires us to file amended returns. It is a huge pain in the a$$ (I had to file an amended return this year for 2005 after the company got a ruling from IRS that Workmens Comp was not tax deductible).


What do you think?

Champ42272

Wrong, wrong, oh so wrong!

 

[sandman2122]

Hey Champ42272:

I gotz two words for ya: H&R Block

 

[PurpleTail]

I rescind what I said about not reading the thing, but I will be a bit more skeptical of the bonus vice retro. I mean, that was the war cry we have been singing since Day 1.

My MEC speaks for me and THANK YOU to those that have dedictated their time and effort to making this TA happen. And to all those AVA, DFT, extra flying whores out there you owe everyone more than a beer or two. You know who you are too.

First, read the entire contract and judge it for what it is or is not.

Second, Yes, retro was our war cry (and still is in my book) but we had to have some kind of slogan.

DON'T GET HUNG UP ON WHAT IT IS CALL, signing bonus v retro pay, as long as the dollar amount is a correct and accurate figure of what we would have earned since the amendable date.

Of course I would like it to be called retro pay but if the company has to write a fat check for the delay then call it whatever the he!! you want to.

 

[AlbieF15]

You can just call it the "boat fund..." and send the d@mn check.

Beers, beers, beers for the negotiating committee...and the P2P guys, and the strategic awareness guru (Sleepy), the block reps, and the committe guys too. It was a group effort.

Awful proud of those guys who flew 100% and no more since June. That's easy for some of us with ANG jobs, but to those guys who just sucked it up...no kidding...thank you.

Like SNIZ says...I'm very interested in the work rule improvements. I bid abou 50% on my seat, but yet got my 27th out of 30 slot for recurrent training this month. Its not the first time I've been blindsided with little things like that. None of those annoyances make this a "bad" job, but seeing the improvements to the small stuff like that will make life much smoother under the next contract. I hope to see some improvements in scheduling, subsitution, and open time rules when I finally get to peek at the TA. I didn't think healthcare was a big deal--until I needed an out of network neurosurgeon last year--I'm interested in seeing what the next contract offers. I don't understand SCOPE, but I'm confident the guys that do put in a good effort to protect our long term security.

Again--thanks to the union workhorses, and to the bros who supported them...

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

Albie15 ... Whaa??
June??? I haven't flown extra in almost two years... Memphis based...no guard/reserve...you mean you rat b@st@rds have only been serious about this since June?
Somanabiotch!!

 

[SNIZ]

Retro/Bonus Calc Re-Attack

Ah...now that we have the naming thing settled. Anybody wanna QC my hypothetical calculation a few posts back? Thx.

 

[pilot141]

Someone admitting they are wrong on FI? Got to be a first.

Ban him! BAN HIM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


:beer:

They can call it my Lollipop and Pedicure Restitution Fund for all I care; if the numbers add up to Yrs x Hours x Pay x 7% (basically what we were asking for) then it's fine by me.

But give me some increased B-fund, a better trip-rig and better healthcare or you can stick your Lollipop and Pedicure Restitution Fund right up your a$$!!!!

 

[AlbieF15]

LJ,

I have over 1100 hours in my makeup bank--and I've haven't done a draft or AVA trip in over 2 years. I rarely even make my BLG... My name is our there and my calendar is unblocked--take a look.

My point was the FAMILY AWARENESS campaign started in June. That was when my "untrained" ears first heard the 100% and no more vibe. I have been flying 80% or less for years, so it really didnt' change my life very much.

While we are all in this together--it does seem the MD11 F/O crowd had the most leverage. Again...thanks.

 

[PurpleTail]

Ah...now that we have the naming thing settled. Anybody wanna QC my hypothetical calculation a few posts back? Thx.

Ballpark it this way...

Our last contract was amendable JUN04, that was 27 months ago...

At the VERY LEAST figure roughly 2000 hrs of back pay. (8 months @ 68 hrs BLG + 4 months @ 86 hrs BLG = 888 hrs annually/12= 74/mon X 27=1998). Each month that goes by without a contract increase the figure by 74 hrs.

Multiple 2000 hrs X whatever your pay increase is (plus interest ) and you should be close.

Is this correct logic or am I missing something? Be nice!