Favorite words of a new Lear 24 F/O

[LAZYB]

Yeah you'll go far if you can't deal...

... with demanding pax or other's unreasonable expectations

...a point that every one keeps saying is about the pax on board...and that got me thinking...what about the pax...how do you know that they didn't encourage this? might have said something like, "let do somethign 'fun'"...just a thought, take it how you will...

How about the Gulfstream crash in Aspen?

What makes a professional? Do you just do what's right when you think someone's looking?

 

[flyincheap]

To all who give a rats ***

What the Lear driver did is wrong, but who are any of us to judge. We all have made errors in judgement, and such. That is what makes this country great is our freedom to voice our opinions, but not judge.
As far as the Lear goes, hmmm I have about 6000+ PIC Lear 23,24,25 yes the ole 28 longhorn, 35,36, 55. Hmmm way to many lonely hours. The lear is a great aircraft and look at its original intention It will handle the stess, hmmm stay positive you will be just fine. I do NOT NOT NOT recommend this though for anyone. I am also a certified recert test pilot for Mark II wings for anyone wants my background. I have done a great deal of work with Dee Howard and many of their test pilots.
For the one who stated a Lear losing one engine loses half the thrust Hmmm, let me think back, not the whole truth. Study a bit more, not putting you down just take a look at another book on this. Ole the old V1 cut. I give you this the Lear 25 at 82 degree's and sea level takes right at 186 lbs of rudder pressure to maintain directional control with little or no, hmmm another bad move aileron input. Of course you Lear drivers know that aft CG is always what % MAC I like my CG at 26 doing recerts on Mark 2 wings. Hmmm enough of that, just to justify my Lear knowledge and background. Lets dont judge each other, just voice our opinions and keep the insults, degrading remarks to a min God bless and safe flying to ALL

 

[Brett Hull]

it would be pretty cool to continue with some more of the original impressions of new lear pilots... I kind 'a enjoyed reading it until WW3 started.

O.K. This came out of my mouth one night at YIP in a 24D: Power set, uhhh....rotate! (at about Vr + 10)

And to continue WW3...

It's nice to know we have a bunch of Gold Seal CFI/Av. Safety Inspectors watching over our sholders ready to squeal to the FAA when they have no clue to begin with.

 

[7B2]

What the Lear driver did is wrong, but who are any of us to judge. We all have made errors in judgement

Judgement is a stretch here..
Who are we (in this case legaleagle) to judge; not sure, but it seems like he has a solid "case" of what he saw; and judged right in my opinion.
We can go without these a$$holes.
And I will most definately do the same.

I do not want to share airspace with pilots who can't identify bad judgement from stupidity.

Again; legaleagle, you did the right thing

 

[pilotman2105]

Legaleagle

Sometimes you have to "squeal" on people to get them to shape up and keep everyone else safe. Like it or not, antics like that Lear are unsafe for not only themselves, but other people as well.

I have no problem with idiots taking themselves out of the foodchain Darwinism style, but I do have a problem when they may potentially take others out with their moronic antics.

Good call Legaleagle.

To those who do not agree with Legaleagle's decision to report, I'd be interested to hear why. (Notice this has nothing to do with whether Legaleagle has been gloating about the reporting, etc. It merely asks what it asks, his decision to report the "occurance.") And try to give your reasoning some substance. Something more than just "People that report to the FAA are morons."

 

[flyincheap]

I agree with your post about legal eagle, however I stick to my point, I guess I did not make it clear, lets keep the insults and degrading comments to ourselves. Voice your opinion, judge what is right and wrong if you must, but why do we have to insult when there is a difference of opinion. Yes, these guys were wrong, and legal I commend you for saying strongly how you feel. I want to be in safe skies at all times too. We are heading hopefully to the same place, it is the roads we choose to live our lives by that makes this such a great place. Thanks again

 

[KingAirKiddo]

Wait a second...I don't get it; there's a post with more than 50 replies and not ONE of them concerns that whole Delta/DALPA/Comair/ASA/RJDC/Scope thing?

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Re: One caveat however.

At the end he pulls up, and at about 200-400 ft, he initiates a 360 barrell roll.

I wonder what the recovery procedures are for an engine failure at this altitude while inverted.

There's a time and a place, and this wasn't it.

Cat Yaak and ATR-DRIVR...I agree, I'd take issue with the pilot if that was my wife on board. I wonder how many may have died on the ground had he plowed into some houses or a busy road?

 

[CSY Mon]

Hmm, kind of tricky situation:

Ya see a drunk driver stumbling to his car, not able to open the door or start it on the first few attempts....Ya take his keys away, or ya call the cops...Either way, ya probably saved lifes as the drunk should not be on the road.

Ya see a hotshot Lear driver do a roll just after take-off and ya call the cops.
Same thing..?

It would be hard to turn in a fellow pilot for just about anything.

Been there, done that: Flown with a thick fog of alcohol in the cockpit after the other guy(s) stayed up too late and had too much fun.

Seen guys bust minimums, duty time regs and such.

There is a strong feeling of not ratting on the other guy in this business.

On the other hand...This roll deal after t/o with revenue pax onboard shows a clear lack og judgment, airmanship and maturity.

As I bystander I would not call the feds, nature and the FAA tower cab folks would take care of it...
Washing my hands?
Yes and now.
The guy needs to loose his ticket:
He may be a sharp stick, in his mind anyway, but with the judgement and disipline of a 12 year old.

If I did not call the cops, he may kill somebody the next time.

Sitting on the fence on this one I guess.

Legaleagle did the correct thing from a legal/moral point of view as his phone call could indeed save the next load of nurses and commuters on the freeway when LR pilot screws up the roll and stalls/spin into the pavement and/or the schoolbuses.

As for the tone of the message?
Well, low key would be perhaps be the better solution...It sounded like legaleagle was blowing his horn slightly for having turned in the idiots, etc.

The fact however is that this Lear hot-shot driver should not be allowed to drive a wheel-barrow or anything else.
What is his next stunt gonne be?
Snap roll on short final?
Scoot across the runway in front of departing heavy?
(If ya time it right and ya have enough power, ya can do it.)


Laywers being scum?
Well, O.J. Simpsons is for sure on the wrong side of bars because of expensive lawyers..Justice not served.
Nuff said.

 

[captainv]

flyincheap -

good to hear from an authority!

>For the one who stated a Lear losing one engine loses half the thrust Hmmm, let me think back, not the whole truth. Study a bit more, not putting you down just take a look at another book on this.

feel free to refresh my memory, i stopped studying the book when i stopped flying the airplane. i believe the guy i was responding to has no experience in the airplane so i wasn't shooting for book numbers. one motor vs. two motors running - you'll have about half the available power, no? sure, a little residual as it winds down, but if you've got some numbers, i'd be fascinated to know...

>Ole the old V1 cut. I give you this the Lear 25 at 82 degree's and sea level takes right at 186 lbs of rudder pressure to maintain directional control with little or no, hmmm another bad move aileron input.

my point was that the V1 cut can be a handful to an applicant trying out for a charter job on a typical corporate runway, especially if they have limited Lear experience. i'd prefer to leave those maneuvers to the sim. i remember a LR-25 departing PIT on thanksgiving a few years ago. relatively new FO was flying and they determined the captain gave him a V1 cut on takeoff. drifted off the runway, cartwheeled, both died. my point was you can reset a sim.

i wonder how the rudder pressure compares to the RJ, the RJ just feels more docile. i'll ask at my next recurrent. we flew a 25D with the Century III wing. Flew a Mark II a few times, main thing i remember is the higher ref speeds...

 

[flyincheap]

All great points I was a check airman for many years and wow did I get ice veins Thanks for the sims Probably let me live longer.

The v1 cut, hmm no experiece with RF Does it have hydraulic boost.
The lear 20 series does not have any hydraulics on flight controls which makes it tougher.

Stay safe

 

[7B2]

Hello,
legaleagle apologized 3 times already about the wording in his 1st post, so stop referring to that.

Again, we all must agree (give up your ego for once) he has prevented a future f*ck-up.

This Lear Captain doesn’t deserve to be in the position he is in.

 

[Jmmccutc]

I have no bones to pick with the FAA, always been treated

same here one of my flight instructors' wife is a cle fsdo employeee and she has always helped me out

 

[enigma]

Edited to retract any words I might have said that would in any way support legaleagle. I do think he was correct in reporting the aileron/barrel roll, but his posts here continue to prove him quite childish.

enigma

 

[ThomasMore]

(Deleted by the poster)