Enjoy your medical JB no voters.

[scoreboardII]

Until your first visit to the Dr for flu and he hands you the bill for $500

 

[jonjuan]

*IF* there's an option for a HDHP that has, say, a $5000 deductible with 100% covered above that, and the company contributes much of that into a HSA that is pretax and rolls over year to year, I'd be happy to do it. I don't really want or need a prepaid medical plan that covers everything; I just need insurance so that I'm not destitute if something really bad happens (cancer, heart attack, transplant, ICU, etc.) I couldn't care less about preventive care, drug rehab, sex reassignment, etc., etc.

Exactly. If it's just two folks and you are relatively healthy and don't go to the dr for every sniffle, you can save a ton. Spouses company has a $1,500 contribution. We contribute $4K/year pre-tax (great benefit) and use probably $1,000/year in services. Our HSA account is now worth over $28K and is invested in mutual funds making 4-5%/year. If our annual costs change, we can always revert to a low deductible plan. The money we stocked up forever belongs to us. After age 65, we can use the money for anything we wish and not necessarily medical related.
It would make me sick to pay a higher premium to help offset all the grannies and grandies who use the system out the whazoo or having to pay 2/3 the premium of people who have 7 kids.

 

[redflyer65]

Hey Jonjuan,

How do you roll your HSA over? I thought it expired each year. Sounds like a good deal.

RF

 

[jonjuan]

Hey Jonjuan,

How do you roll your HSA over? I thought it expired each year. Sounds like a good deal.

RF

A Health Savings Account is money that is yours to keep. You are thinking of a HRA which is an account based on use or lose every year.
If you have the investable income, you may even want to pay for all medical expenses out of pocket so as to save as much as possible in the HSA. After age 65, it's identical to a pre-tax IRA account.
http://www.shrm.org/hrdisciplines/benefits/articles/pages/hsasvshras.aspx


A good HSA long term strategy...
http://news.nhealth.com/04232009Introducing the HSA Strategy.pdf

 

[Smarta$$]

A Health Savings Account is money that is yours to keep. You are thinking of a HRA which is an account based on use or lose every year.
If you have the investable income, you may even want to pay for all medical expenses out of pocket so as to save as much as possible in the HSA. After age 65, it's identical to a pre-tax IRA account.
http://www.shrm.org/hrdisciplines/benefits/articles/pages/hsasvshras.aspx


A good HSA long term strategy...
http://news.nhealth.com/04232009Introducing the HSA Strategy.pdf

See Blue pilots, this is a good thing.

What could possibly go wrong?

 

[Dizel8]

It's all about cost shifting.

"How to Make Consumer-Driven Health Care Work for You (the Employer)
*****
Issue
*****
Today, employers are faced with health insurance costs that are rising much more quickly than inflation or wages. To stem the tide, many employers increase employees’ health plan contributions, deductibles, copayments and out-of-pocket limits. But these changes are unpopular and fail to address the underlying problem—health care utilization. The number of employers adopting a Consumer Driven Health Care (CDHC) approach has increased sevenfold since 2003. However, many employers are finding CDHC to be a mixed blessing, at best. While CDHC is a potential solution, few plan designs include the three elements necessary for changing consumer behavior and decision-making: incentives, education and involvement.

Some employers have offered a qualified High Deductible Health Plan (HDHP)-Health Savings Account (HSA) in addition to a more traditional plan, only to have minimal participation. Other employers have paired a Health Reimbursement Arrangement (HRA) with an HDHP, only to find employees frustrated with increased out-of-pocket expenses.

Solution

A short-term solution does not exist. Instead, what is needed is a long-term strategy that will likely take at least three years to implement. During each year of the campaign, incentives to participate will change as will direct employee enrollments. Education must be ongoing. Employees must learn new skills, like how to interpret an explanation of benefits and how to shop for value and quality in health care outcomes. Involvement is a must; all participants must become more aware of how their health care dollars are spent.

A transition campaign might take this form:

• Year 1. The employer offers the traditional (low deductible) plan with a Health FSA. The employer encourages consumer-driven behavior by seeding the account or providing matching funds up to a certain dollar amount.

• Year 2. The employer offers the same options as Year 1, but adds an HDHP and pairs it with an HRA. In Year 2, there should be sufficient incentives to drive participation toward the HDHP-HRA model. Examples might include much lower HDHP premiums, no employer funding of the FSA or enhanced wellness and preventive care benefits for HDHP-HRA participants.

• Year 3. The employer offers the HRA once again and replaces the traditional plan and Health FSA with an HDHP and a Health Savings Account (HSA). Incentives (such as premium contributions) should drive participation toward the HSA.

• Year 4 and beyond. The employer could then move away from the HRA at some point and offer a HDHP-HSA as the only option. Each year, the employer should reinforce the idea that health care consumerism is a partnership between employer and employee to reduce overall health care costs.


Explanation

Many American health consumers remain unaware of the true costs of health care. Thus, any changes in health plans which result in more up front out–of-pocket expenses (even if there are long-term savings) are likely to meet resistance. Many employees consider health expenses in terms of co-pays, and not in terms of the entire cost of the service. Immediate replacement of a traditional plan with a HDHP-HSA model is typically not well received. The purpose of the multi-year plan outlined here is to gradually increase employee familiarity with the true cost of their medical expenses.
*****
*****
From Cathy Tripp, National Leader of Consumerism (Benefits Consultant at Towers Watson)--

Lessons Learned

Early adopters will tell you the CDHP journey hasn’t always been smooth sailing. Many have faced administration, communication and integration challenges, and some have found low enrollment numbers disheartening. Lessons learned from these trailblazing employers should be taken to heart:


1. Communicate, communicate, communicate.

2. Change or eliminate the popular benefit plan so employees have to pay attention at enrollment.

3. Allow enough lead time to thoroughly test systems and plan setup and data flows between vendors and administrators.

4. Reduce CDHP premium contribution levels to be lower than in current plans to drive enrollment."

 

[redflyer65]

A Health Savings Account is money that is yours to keep. You are thinking of a HRA which is an account based on use or lose every year.
If you have the investable income, you may even want to pay for all medical expenses out of pocket so as to save as much as possible in the HSA. After age 65, it's identical to a pre-tax IRA account.
http://www.shrm.org/hrdisciplines/benefits/articles/pages/hsasvshras.aspx


A good HSA long term strategy...
http://news.nhealth.com/04232009Introducing the HSA Strategy.pdf

Thanks for the info.

 

[jonjuan]

As it should be. Fact is, health care costs are going through the roof. If you make healthy choices (eat well, exercise, don't smoke), your health care costs should reflect those choices. Instead, those who aren't high users of the expensive and growing healthcare system subsidize those who are.
What's your solution?

 

[Dizel8]

Unhealthy choices are indeed bad, but many times bad things happens to good people. Examples we have already seen here.

Want to penalize bad choices, fair enough, no problem with that, some companies do, but where does one draw the line on that one? What percentage over target weight, how many drinks a week, steaks? Should one have to have a complete blood panel done every year to to not see deductibles go up?

 

[Splert]

...If our annual costs change, we can always revert to a low deductible plan ...

Priceless ..

So you admit that a CDHP sucks and doesn't save you money. A CDHP only saves money "if".

What happens when participation in the low deductible medical plan is reduced and as you freely admit adverse selection takes over? In other words less healthly people and more 'high' users? The low deductible plan goes away (unless of course it a CBA benefit) because costs skyrocket.

Good luck ...

A fool and his health care will soon be parted. Don't go snow skiing or have kids ...

 

[Dizel8]

"It'll never happen to me, I take good care of myself."

 

[Splert]

As it should be. Fact is, health care costs are going through the roof. If you make healthy choices (eat well, exercise, don't smoke), your health care costs should reflect those choices. Instead, those who aren't high users of the expensive and growing healthcare system subsidize those who are.
What's your solution?

Hook line and sinker ... Hook line and sinker.

What life choice is MS, testicular cancer, lymphoma, Autism, Type I diabetes, etc.

You are a fool and will sooner or later will be parted with your saving unless you are lucky. Not because you made 'healthly choices'.

Also don't have kids because they are always delivered healthily with no issues between 3 months prior to birth and 26 years old. Never, ever, never even if they eat Broccoli with every meal.

 

[N311HK]

Until your first visit to the Dr for flu and he hands you the bill for $500

Happened to me in May, you were off, it was $450 plus the 23hr 4 day that I called in for and of course by day 2 couldn't call in well cause, well ya know...

 

[Splert]

Happened to me in May, you were off, it was $450 plus the 23hr 4 day that I called in for and of course by day 2 couldn't call in well cause, well ya know...

Dude ... don't go to the doctor. Tough it out and save your HRA for the important stuff. geeezzzz.

5 year old daughter slipped playing on the monkey bars. Bashed her head and eye socket.

Stupid life choice I made allowing her to play.

Emergency room ... 4 staples ... CT Scan to make sure her swollen shut eye optical bone was not crushed (sure could have just said: Naaaa we will just see how it heals 'cause I want to save the $395.00 in my HRA). After all the airline I work for now calls me a consumer of health care. I call it a transfer of health care costs but who I'm I to argue with a PR company and their award winning teleprompter scripts and posters.

There goes 2 years of HRA savings in less than a split second and it is only June. Hope my shoulder I injured playing football in high school doesn't need to be repaired soon. I need to save for another 3 years to pay for it. Maybe if I eat granola for breakfast my shoulder will heal?

 

[jonjuan]

Having a high deductible still covers you, but at a well, higher deductible. Cancer, broken stuff, covered.
I never insinuated that a high deductible is for everyone. It does have it's place, however, for low users of the medical establishment (older, fatter, kids). If I have major surgery now, my deductible is only $4K which is paid out of the HSA we have accrued. Every penny on top is covered. 100%. When we have kids, you better believe we will switch to a lower deductible, higher premium plan and use all the jack we have saved to pay the premiums and deductibles.
Now, jblu going to an all high deductible HSA plan? Well, that's what unions Help protect from. Get a union to protect from this, quit and join a union shop, or suck it up. Management, is management, is management.