another misconception. If your primary residence and place of work is based overseas then you are NOT limited to 35 days per year stateside. EK gives you 42 days of vacation per year and it's pretty easy to add a few days to your vacation weeks via bidding. So you can spend all 50 or so days in the USA without worrying about losing your tax status. Lots of misinformation on this website. If you are seriously considering making the move find someone working there to get the real scoop.
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Emirates Posts $1.6 Billion Profit
- Thread starter Furloughed80
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another misconception. If your primary residence and place of work is based overseas then you are NOT limited to 35 days per year stateside. EK gives you 42 days of vacation per year and it's pretty easy to add a few days to your vacation weeks via bidding. So you can spend all 50 or so days in the USA without worrying about losing your tax status. Lots of misinformation on this website. If you are seriously considering making the move find someone working there to get the real scoop.
Non competitive?? Are you sure?
base pay on new rate - 85,275
flt pay per year - 9,800
housing allowance - 42,000 (find an inexpensive apt and pocket the extra)
provident fund- 10,233
2011 profit share- 18,200
Total for FO 165,508
42 days vacation and free transportation. Haven't included per diem but you could probably add another 8k per year. If you don't take the housing you get a free villa or apt with utilities paid.
uba757
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Ek does not allow you to commute! (cough, cough) So the allowance is great because you have to live in DXB! (cough, cough) I get Business class tickets to go home on my leave for 42 days that I can make into 60 days with a little bidding ingenuity. I also get Business class seats to any EK destination and Captains get First class seats. The Salary could be better but when I look at the entire package, I have to say that I am pretty happy with it! uba757
Kalifornia
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I don't see much point in cheering on Emirates success. It's still a tight law place that pilots have to live in. When you have to worry about kissing in public and petty alcohol induced crimes to the point of massive jail sentences, something is messed up. You know what the standard sentence for a first time offender here in the states for stealing handcuffs? A weekend in jail and probation. Which should certainly suck and discourage such action. However 2 days in jail versus 7 years in a Middle Eastern prison is beyond fathom. Yea, that is really cool - international wide body Captain. However, and a big however = you are exchanging freedoms at the very place you now call home for money (which should be much higher) and jumbo shiny jet syndrome to fly at Emirates.
The UAE is also a place that's clearly propping up Emirates with subsidies to out compete the rest of the world. Why would other pilots be pro Emirates massively expanding when it negatively impacts other airlines operating in the western world.
Finally, there is no ASAP program at Emirates. In other words, never make a mistake and never be associated with anyone who makes a mistake or be in charge of someone who makes a mistake. There's no union protection....
excerpt from Melbourne Tail Strike Incident
At Melbourne airport, a 42-year-old Danish pilot was sitting in the cockpit of his Emirates Airbus with his Canadian co-pilot running through their preflight checklist in preparation for their 14 1/2-hour flight to Dubai.
The captain had been flying for 22 years, including almost five years with Emirates and was familiar with Melbourne airport, having flown there at least four times in the previous six months.
He was also familiar with the Airbus, having clocked up 1372 hours on it. But he was tired. He had flown 98.9 hours in the past month, more than Qantas pilots are allowed to fly and barely short of Emirate's monthly limit of 100 hours. The pilot would later claim to have had only 3 1/2 hours sleep in the previous 24 hours because he was "out of whack" despite spending the previous 24 hours resting in Melbourne.
Those pilots "resigned". I have also been told some management members were forced to resign or were fired. Guilt by association; TID (This Is Dubai)
The UAE is also a place that's clearly propping up Emirates with subsidies to out compete the rest of the world. Why would other pilots be pro Emirates massively expanding when it negatively impacts other airlines operating in the western world.
Finally, there is no ASAP program at Emirates. In other words, never make a mistake and never be associated with anyone who makes a mistake or be in charge of someone who makes a mistake. There's no union protection....
excerpt from Melbourne Tail Strike Incident
At Melbourne airport, a 42-year-old Danish pilot was sitting in the cockpit of his Emirates Airbus with his Canadian co-pilot running through their preflight checklist in preparation for their 14 1/2-hour flight to Dubai.
The captain had been flying for 22 years, including almost five years with Emirates and was familiar with Melbourne airport, having flown there at least four times in the previous six months.
He was also familiar with the Airbus, having clocked up 1372 hours on it. But he was tired. He had flown 98.9 hours in the past month, more than Qantas pilots are allowed to fly and barely short of Emirate's monthly limit of 100 hours. The pilot would later claim to have had only 3 1/2 hours sleep in the previous 24 hours because he was "out of whack" despite spending the previous 24 hours resting in Melbourne.
Those pilots "resigned". I have also been told some management members were forced to resign or were fired. Guilt by association; TID (This Is Dubai)
Kalifornia,
There is a lot of truth to what you say. Dubai is very far from perfect. When things go bad they go very bad. Certain behaviors have to be kept behind closed doors and you quickly learn that you do not live in a society where all are equal. It's unfortunate but those are the breaks when you live in a country ruled by a royal family.
Emirates is not a dream job and I don't think anybody goes there due to "shiny jet syndrome." The vast majority of Americans out here have been furloughed multiple times and are trying to salvage a career. Sure it's not perfect but you have the opportunity to walk into a very good paying job from day 1 with decent benefits.
There is no union and as a result lots of guys you fly with are anal to the extreme. Training can be a nightmare and summers are hot as h#ll. Certain nationalities tend to be more difficult to fly with. But when it comes to social life it is not as strict as many would think. More like Miami than Saudi Arabia in my opinion. Sure you don't kiss in public but in nightclubs or private residences people do whatever they want. 13,000+ cabin crew from 100+ countries living in company owned skyscrapers and the vast majority are single. Obviously there are no equal opportunity laws in Dubai and the age/appearance of the fa's here is a testament to that fact. You can have a good life in Dubai and an almost unhealthy amount of fun, but you have to come to terms with certain unpleasant aspects of life in the Middle East. As you pointed out there is zero job security and you do not want to get on the wrong side of the law.
There is a lot of truth to what you say. Dubai is very far from perfect. When things go bad they go very bad. Certain behaviors have to be kept behind closed doors and you quickly learn that you do not live in a society where all are equal. It's unfortunate but those are the breaks when you live in a country ruled by a royal family.
Emirates is not a dream job and I don't think anybody goes there due to "shiny jet syndrome." The vast majority of Americans out here have been furloughed multiple times and are trying to salvage a career. Sure it's not perfect but you have the opportunity to walk into a very good paying job from day 1 with decent benefits.
There is no union and as a result lots of guys you fly with are anal to the extreme. Training can be a nightmare and summers are hot as h#ll. Certain nationalities tend to be more difficult to fly with. But when it comes to social life it is not as strict as many would think. More like Miami than Saudi Arabia in my opinion. Sure you don't kiss in public but in nightclubs or private residences people do whatever they want. 13,000+ cabin crew from 100+ countries living in company owned skyscrapers and the vast majority are single. Obviously there are no equal opportunity laws in Dubai and the age/appearance of the fa's here is a testament to that fact. You can have a good life in Dubai and an almost unhealthy amount of fun, but you have to come to terms with certain unpleasant aspects of life in the Middle East. As you pointed out there is zero job security and you do not want to get on the wrong side of the law.
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Dornier 335
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Also a fact is that the Chairman and CEO of EK, Ahmed bin Saeed Al Maktoum runs the Department of Civil Aviation - Dubai (DCA). Rumors are that many EK pilots underlog their yearly flying hours and fly way in excess of their 1000hr/year limit. But if you are CEO and king (sorry Sheikh) of the regulatory authority then really there is no problem.
overseas boy
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Dumb Pilot
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I raise the BS flag on that one, this is a major international airline and not some papas and mamas operation
I don't think there is any profession in the world that has more people willing to start and more people willing to believe B.S than airline piloting.
CesnaCaptn
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Freight Dog
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Dornier 335
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True, but there was a heated discussion about yearly flight time limits on pprune (sigh) some time ago. It also included the Sheiks position within the regulatory aviation authority.
For those who are interested with EK, I'd recommend some further reading on pprune. Remember: Try not to change your interview date, this is not looked upon positively.
knowlimits
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uba757
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HA25
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Look, I'm no fan of EK, and I have my own issues with them, but truth be told. Dubai and the Emirates in general are very 1st world nations, and one of the few places in the middle east where laws are obeyed.. it is a nation of laws, and the royals are actually respected and do what's in the best interest of their people with a long term plan and vision... I have a friend who's a PE fund manager down there and he's got nothing but good things to say about how they do business.
chignutsak
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What a moronic request. This area is titled Majors, not US Majors. If Emirates doesn't qualify as a Major, then I don't know what does.
Furloughed80
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For those of you complaining about the T&Cs at Emirates; please compare this to the total compensation for a first year F/O at an un-named US legacy where you will be lucky gross over $30,000 and not have health insurance for the first 6 months.
I just read another article about Emirates nearing the 100 flights a week mark to Australia. That's not a typo, 100 flights a week. You are kidding your selves if you don't think we will see similar numbers to the US in the next decade. How are US airlines going to respond? They are not, because they can't.
Furloughed80
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clr4theapch
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This is an American webside about American aviation...so create your own from the desert....J/A and call it habibi flight info....go for it
Thank you mr moderator...enough with this government own cash register, low fuel charge airlines.......enough...its time to protect our own
You are not a Major...period. You are a government entity.
so there you have it...You are part of the UAE cash register.....
Check how many flights NWA or DELTA now has per week to Tokyo.....You will be surprised and they are not owned by uncle sam or pay a dollar for fuel.......last time I check fuel is the highest cost to an Airline, not wages........do your research and get bck to us
typhoonpilot
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Interesting thread. A lot of misconceptions about Emirates and the UAE.
Fact: The government of Dubai gave Emirates $10 million in start up capital in the mid 1980s. Since then they have not given any more money to them. The Dubai government is the shareholder of Emirates and receives a dividend every year from the airline. This year Emirates paid the government a $543 million dividend.
Fact: Emirates buys jet fuel on the open market just like every other airline. We sometimes tanker fuel into Dubai because it's cheaper at some out stations than it is in Dubai. We rarely tanker fuel outbound.
Somebody talked about financing. That's an interesting topic. It's the in vogue thing for the Europeans and some Americans to complain about the Ex Im financing that Emirates just started using last year to fund a portion of their Boeing aircraft purchases. Ex IM financing is a set-up by the U.S. Government that is intended to help U.S. manufacturers in the exporting of products overseas. Really a non issue, but some choose to make it one.
U.S. carriers and U.S. pilots should be careful in complaining about financing. How much money did the U.S. government give to U.S. airlines post 9-11?
The competitive advantage that U.S. carriers enjoy via Chapter 11 reorganization shouldn't be dicounted either. That type of debt restructuring and/or forgiveness is not available to most foreign airlines.
Green does a reasonable job debating the pay issue. I'm the second most senior American at Emirates. I've been a captain for over 7 years now and certainly make much more than the published $10,000 month for a 10 year captain.
Schedule: Yes, we work hard. No doubt about it. The guys on the A330 work the hardest by far with lots of night turns to India. On the B777 when in top bid months the rosters can be very nice. That's one really nice point about the rosters. It's not like in a U.S. major where you are junior forever. The bid groups rotate so that you can be top bid at least twice a year. Great when your are a new joiner, not so great as you get more senior, but everyone is okay with it because it's fair.
People getting arrested in the UAE: Usually there is more to the story. A recent one about a Brit would died in jail made the news. He tried to throw a maid off the balcony at his hotel then fought with the police. Not handled well since he died in custody, but clearly he wasn't just walking down the street minding his own business before he was arrested. Couples arrested on the beach for indecent behavior have usually gotten a warning to stop first. When they argue and become belligerant they will get arrested. If they stop and say sorry then nothing usually happens.
The job isn't for everyone and it certainly has some drawbacks. That said it is far better then being on furlough or working at some places in the U.S. or elsewhere.
In terms of contract jobs. There isn't a single contract in the world right now that has as good a total pay and benefit package as Emirates. The only difference for some people is the ability to get home. At Emirates that is very difficult so some choose to take a contract that pays less and has far fewer benefits in order to have a commuting option. Korean is the prime example. Roughly $3000-4000 less per month in pocket, but a far better commuting option.
Typhoonpilot
Fact: The government of Dubai gave Emirates $10 million in start up capital in the mid 1980s. Since then they have not given any more money to them. The Dubai government is the shareholder of Emirates and receives a dividend every year from the airline. This year Emirates paid the government a $543 million dividend.
Fact: Emirates buys jet fuel on the open market just like every other airline. We sometimes tanker fuel into Dubai because it's cheaper at some out stations than it is in Dubai. We rarely tanker fuel outbound.
Somebody talked about financing. That's an interesting topic. It's the in vogue thing for the Europeans and some Americans to complain about the Ex Im financing that Emirates just started using last year to fund a portion of their Boeing aircraft purchases. Ex IM financing is a set-up by the U.S. Government that is intended to help U.S. manufacturers in the exporting of products overseas. Really a non issue, but some choose to make it one.
U.S. carriers and U.S. pilots should be careful in complaining about financing. How much money did the U.S. government give to U.S. airlines post 9-11?
The competitive advantage that U.S. carriers enjoy via Chapter 11 reorganization shouldn't be dicounted either. That type of debt restructuring and/or forgiveness is not available to most foreign airlines.
Green does a reasonable job debating the pay issue. I'm the second most senior American at Emirates. I've been a captain for over 7 years now and certainly make much more than the published $10,000 month for a 10 year captain.
Schedule: Yes, we work hard. No doubt about it. The guys on the A330 work the hardest by far with lots of night turns to India. On the B777 when in top bid months the rosters can be very nice. That's one really nice point about the rosters. It's not like in a U.S. major where you are junior forever. The bid groups rotate so that you can be top bid at least twice a year. Great when your are a new joiner, not so great as you get more senior, but everyone is okay with it because it's fair.
People getting arrested in the UAE: Usually there is more to the story. A recent one about a Brit would died in jail made the news. He tried to throw a maid off the balcony at his hotel then fought with the police. Not handled well since he died in custody, but clearly he wasn't just walking down the street minding his own business before he was arrested. Couples arrested on the beach for indecent behavior have usually gotten a warning to stop first. When they argue and become belligerant they will get arrested. If they stop and say sorry then nothing usually happens.
The job isn't for everyone and it certainly has some drawbacks. That said it is far better then being on furlough or working at some places in the U.S. or elsewhere.
In terms of contract jobs. There isn't a single contract in the world right now that has as good a total pay and benefit package as Emirates. The only difference for some people is the ability to get home. At Emirates that is very difficult so some choose to take a contract that pays less and has far fewer benefits in order to have a commuting option. Korean is the prime example. Roughly $3000-4000 less per month in pocket, but a far better commuting option.
Typhoonpilot
uba757
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I am 100 times more American than you will ever be, now go back to you little French LEGO toy that you call an airplane before you embarrass your fellow country men anymore! Have a nice day!
uba757
uba757
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That is correct, Delta and NW are not owned by Uncle Sam, they just go to BK Court to dump what they owe every so often to make things right and start over again until the next time they cant pay the bills. You need to do your own research so you stop embarrassing your fellow country men! Have a nice day!
uba757
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