EMB170/190 Drivers

[BrickTop]

I know exactly what you're talking about and it's not a door seal. There is a distinct difference. I have over 2000 hours on the 170/175 and I've always heard this noise, but can never identify the source, nor can anybody else i've asked. It does not happen all the time, and yes my fellow crewmembers have noticed it as well.

Has anyone written Embraer. Somone should. To me it sounds pretty serious. Apparently not since none have fallen out of the sky yet.

 

[BeachBummer]

I've never heard anything like that on the 190.

But it does shake like hell when you ask for full spoilers...turbulent air over the horizontal stab. Heavier the better...doesn't seem to shake as much then.

Whats a "first class" first of all?

I've never heard that either, must be the wallet of the pilots screaming for more $$$$$. But we're fixing that on all the jetBlue E90's...

 

[SpauldingSmails]

It sounds like the door seal vibration issue. It often sounds from the flightdeck like there's someone paying a horn in back of the plane, like a distant buzz/humm. The sound usually manifests itself at higher airspeeds, starting at 15,000 ft or so and slowly fading as you climb higher.

I don't believe its the actual internal pressure door seal, but rather the rubber shroud that is mounted over the top of the forward doors, over time the shroud wears and airflow may get between the rubber piece and the fuselage causing the vibration/humming noise. I've seen these removed from the aircraft on occaision, there is CDL relief for it. Occaisonally, a little fidgeting with the rudder trim will cause the airflow to change a bit, the seal will lay flat against the fuselage and the noise will go away. Its benign, however annoying.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

I know exactly what you're talking about and it's not a door seal. There is a distinct difference. I have over 2000 hours on the 170/175 and I've always heard this noise, but can never identify the source, nor can anybody else i've asked. It does not happen all the time, and yes my fellow crewmembers have noticed it as well.

I'm also wondering what kind of noise the wheel wells could make in flight, as they are partially open. If the brushes around the tires are getting ragged, or if say one of the mains retract and stops just shy of where it should... etc. etc. I'm sure some wierd air flow noises could emanate from there as well, if everything isn't just so.

 

[Browntothebone]

I thinks that as lots more of these aircraft enter service in the US, the airlines will get all these bugs worked out and the aircraft will become a true regional workhorse.

 

[BrickTop]

I'm also wondering what kind of noise the wheel wells could make in flight, as they are partially open. If the brushes around the tires are getting ragged, or if say one of the mains retract and stops just shy of where it should... etc. etc. I'm sure some wierd air flow noises could emanate from there as well, if everything isn't just so.

Those were my thought exactly. Funny. I thought about the aerodynamic brushes on the wheel wells being a culprit. Either way its definitely bizarre. But its Brazilian what isn't.

 

[Salukipilot4590]

I thinks that as lots more of these aircraft enter service in the US, the airlines will get all these bugs worked out and the aircraft will become a true regional workhorse.

Dude...you're good!

 

[Browntothebone]

Dude...you're good!

Thank you. But, I was merely mentioning the fact that as the 170/190 get more numerous in the fleets of regional airlines, that the nagging bugs that are inherent in any new type will get worked out and the aircraft will become the new standard for regional airlines, much like the 50 seat RJ is now.

 

[Salukipilot4590]

Thank you. But, I was merely mentioning the fact that as the 170/190 get more numerous in the fleets of regional airlines, that the nagging bugs that are inherent in any new type will get worked out and the aircraft will become the new standard for regional airlines, much like the 50 seat RJ is now.

...aaaand that was the problem...

 

[Blueline]

This is not a door seal. I have heard poor door sealing this ia a low groan like a deep viration in the fuselage.

It is the flap on top of the door not the seal. The door flap comes from the factory too long and vibrates against the fuselage. The maintenance solution is to cut the flap shorter.

 

[aa73]

But it wasn't. Get over it. Do you constantly bitch over the things that you wish that were but are not? Say something constructive folks.

Nope, I love giving you guys shee-it! All in good fun compadre! Hence the sticking tongue out smiley.

 

[Headfake14]

SLower meaning near approach speeds. Lower angle of attack and slower speed meaning on approach vs initial decent at 320kts

You decend at 320? I don't know about the 170...but the 190 redlines at 320...the damn speed tape is so sensitive, we'd get the "High speed" all the time.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

You decend at 320? I don't know about the 170...but the 190 redlines at 320...the damn speed tape is so sensitive, we'd get the "High speed" all the time.

The 170/175 maxes out at 320kt as well and I avoid hiting that mark like the plague.

Hell with the "high steve" warning, it's OVSPD protection that turns the event into a real goat rodeo, especially if you're on a VNAV path descent. Airplane goes past 320, boards extend nose pitches up, speed falls below 320, aircraft re-seeks VNAV path shoots past 320, boards up, nose up... you have to TCS or FLCH your way out of that cycle. Not fun.

 

[WSurf]

I thinks that as lots more of these aircraft enter service in the US, the airlines will get all these bugs worked out and the aircraft will become a true regional workhorse.

There is nothing Regional about the 170/190 except for the paychecks that the crews accept each month.

While they had more and more of the planes the chances of getting on with a major slowly fade away.

 

[Mickey]

SLower meaning near approach speeds. Lower angle of attack and slower speed meaning on approach vs initial decent at 320kts

Interesting! I'm usually at a high AOA during approach.
Wouldn't you have a lower AOA during your 320kt descent and a higher AOA during your slower approach?

 

[BrickTop]

You decend at 320? I don't know about the 170...but the 190 redlines at 320...the damn speed tape is so sensitive, we'd get the "High speed" all the time.

If you read a little closer you will see I fly the CRJ. 335kts.

 

[Headfake14]

ah...I assumed you were on the 170/190 given the topic of the thread...didn't check your profile.

I wish it had a barber poll like the CRJ....and a center tank.

 

[Browntothebone]

There is nothing Regional about the 170/190 except for the paychecks that the crews accept each month.

While they had more and more of the planes the chances of getting on with a major slowly fade away.

Most regional pilots nowdays don't want to get on with a major and instead, want a career at the regionals. That's why they want larger aircraft like the 170/190 at the regionals.

 

[TCAS]

I'm sure they NTSB will figure out what the noise is when one of them breaks up at altitude one day.

 

[Minimaniac]

I'm sure they NTSB will figure out what the noise is when one of them breaks up at altitude one day.

Well that was an absolutely ignorant post!


As a few 170/190 pilots who actually know what the heck is going on have said before, the noise comes from a rubber piece that attaches to the top of the doors. It follows the contour of the doors, and is about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch thick. This piece does not affect pressurization, or structural integrity. The leading edge of these rubber pieces fray over time as they are exposed to the slipstream and to the high speed dirt kicked up by other planes' jet blast while taxiing. When these leading edges fray, they begin to vibrate, and eventually airflow can get under the entire leading edge and really make some noise. Depending on where the fray is occuring, different airspeeds and angels of attack will trigger the noise. Some planes will make noise in the climb, some in slow cruise flight, some in fast cruise, some in the decent, some at 270kts, some at 310 kts. Each occurance is different, as each rubber piece frays at a somewhat different spot, and may have been left unfixed for a longer time. Aft door vibrations are not easily heard up front, and we need the FAs to notify us of the problem- super reliable. The front door problems are easily detectable by the flight crew. When Mx comes out, they often just trim the deteriorating piece with a pair of scissors, which is surprisingly effective.

When you board a 170/190 next time, look at the door. Along the top, fixed to the door itself, is a grey piece of textured rubber that follows the curve of the door. This is the culprit.