Eagle recalls

[jcb071]

Only AA Counts

Aviation is and always will be, what is good for me. In the end Eagle will get the shaft as usual. APA just wants to get all of their pilots off the street ASAP, and there is nothing wrong with that, every pilot group wants to recall it's pilots. However, to do this at the expense of another pilots job saddens me.

 

[80drvr]

Re: Only AA Counts

Aviation is and always will be, what is good for me. In the end Eagle will get the shaft as usual. APA just wants to get all of their pilots off the street ASAP, and there is nothing wrong with that, every pilot group wants to recall it's pilots. However, to do this at the expense of another pilots job saddens me.

Please elaborate how this proposal will be at the expense of eagle pilots. AMR wants to grow Eagle, but it can't because of the ASM cap. Every new jet delivered now will result in the retirement of two turboprops. I don't know what the manning ratios are for the different fleets at AE, but it appears that the status quo isn't too good for AE pilots, especially those furloughed or who face the prospect of furlough due to those retirements.

Also consider that AMR plans to increase the daily utilization of the AA fleet from 9.5 to 11.0 hours/day next quarter. This results in approximately 38500 additional hours/month which will require approximately 500 pilots to man.

APA's effort to get the CRJ70 will allow AE to retain more RJ and keep turboprop feed flying without further reductions in force. In other words, AE keeps more cockpit seats without the CRJ due to the ASM cap. This would also provide for more flow through opportunities, which obviously require job vacancies at AA once a number is obtained to be worth anything.

You are correct that APA is concerned about getting our furloughees back to work. This latest proposal is about the profession and not about the furloughs.

 

[EagleRJ]

80drvr,
I think the overall opinion of the proposal by the employees at Eagle is one of cautious optimism. If we had an expanded proposal to study that laid out the details and a firm timeline, the mood might in fact be one of jubilation. Eagle has always been the little brother at AMR, so we are used to being wary when we hear of a proposal that we are told will benefit us. The devil's in the details, so if an implementation plan is developed that treats Eagle employees in an equitable manner, I'm guessing the proposal will have our unconditional support.

 

[MartinFierro]

Please elaborate how this proposal will be at the expense of eagle pilots

I agree with jcb071 and others in that this proposal from APA is not the best for Eagle pilots. Basically, AA would take over most of the RJ flying. As I understand it, they would fly all 50 and 70 seaters, leaving Eagle with the few 44 seaters already on property and the 135s. All existing orders for the 44 would be turned into 50 seaters, flown by AA.

If this is correct, then all of those positions taken over by AA would mean that corresponding number of Eagle pilots would be furloughed. Eagle has no orders for more turboprops, and as stated above, the all of the new ERJ-140s would be converted to ERJ-145s, and not flown by Eagle. Thus, while the ASM cap would not be an issue, there would be FAR fewer planes for Eagle pilots to fly. If Eagle had orders or planned to order more props, then the situation would be different. But it isn't.

So, it results in more Eagle pilots on the street. And the flow-tru? Someone tell me how, unless the current flow-thru is renegotiated (and has anyone implied that it would be?), how Eagle pilots would flow thru? There would be hardly any RJs that Eagle pilots would be left to fly to be able to flow thru.

I take it that many disagree with me and think that in the long run it would benefit Eagle pilots. Perhaps, at this point anything is only speculation. But I personnally don't think being furloughed indefinitely (for potentially a much longer time) in exchange for the hope of someday flying for mainline is worth it.

 

[EagleRJ]

Did you actually read the proposal? Phase Three involves moving all of the remaining pilots at Eagle over to AA, thus the flow-through would be a moot point.
There's bound to be the faction at Eagle that thinks that APA wants to take all our jets and ride off into the sunset, and we'll end up with nothing. This proposal is still just that- the details are still to be worked out. It's clear though, that it has the potential to be lucrative for all three parties- AMR, APA, and Eagle.

 

[MartinFierro]

Good point. I just reread that part. It would still clearly mean an immediate (and large) reduction in the amount of flying Eagle does, which would put more Eagle guys out. Perhaps down the road it would be beneficial, if we were to joing mainline, but I guess I'm just skeptical as to how it would all really play out (our current contract and flow thru case in point).

But here's hoping for the best!

 

[Skywalker]

here's the question I have...they say they will recall AA first (595) then TWA (290) then Eagle (304) furloughs...so that makes 1200 of us on furlough and they never mention that they will not hire off the street before EVERYONE is recalled...big loophole there...

 

[~~~^~~~]

Phase III should be Phase I.

If you have one list, then you automatically have:
(1) The ability to operate the right sized equipment
(2) One union political leadership
(3) No fights over phases I, or II.

The Eagle pilot's concerns that AA/APA will steal their jets and ride off into the sunset seems legitimate. My thought is that if you promise to love us later, you can love us now. Put things in proper order and onelist first. Then everyone will suppport Phases I and II.

Getting onelist through management will be easier as a united group. Together - pilots telling the press "All American Flying by American Pilots" is appealing - it gives you the moral high ground.

 

[3green]

perfictly said... ~~~~+~~~~

 

[publisher]

point

What is suggested will eventually mean, why does one have a commuter in the first place.

From the mainline standpoint, they would prefer not to have any ownership of any commuter/regionals.

They started to own pieces of some so they would have control and information. That way they could direct what was an independant contractor if there were routes that these companies did not want and/or could benefit from some profitable ones.

As the RJ came along, it blurred the picture and has caused problems. This is why I fully expect a reverse of the consolidation that has gone on over the last 5 years.