Do you think YOUR airline's mgmt. is watching this???

[flyguppy]

FYI, THEY ARE!! YGTBFKM!!!! :angryfire uke:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

CHICAGO (Dow Jones)--United Airlines said Wednesday it will press ahead with a controversial plan to outsource some international flying to Aer Lingus (EIL1.DB) despite further cutbacks at the Irish carrier.

The airlines announced an "innovative" plan last January that would see Aer Lingus operate flights from Madrid to the U.S. beginning in March on behalf of United, but using Aer Lingus planes.

Aer Lingus said Wednesday that it will cut a sixth of its workforce and is reviewing its remaining longhaul operation as part of a broader restructuring to stem losses.

United, a unit of UAL Corp. (UAUA), said the move did not affect the planned joint venture. "There is no change to our relationship with Aer Lingus," a United spokeswoman said Wednesday.

The expanded alliance has drawn fierce criticism from unions at both airlines as the new flights would be operated by "outside" employees.

Aer Lingus confirmed in February that it was recruiting separate pilots and cabin crew to staff the venture, despite lay-offs and furloughs at both airlines.

A spokesman for the United Airlines unit of the Air Line Pilots Association said the group was studying the cost-cutting news from Aer Lingus, and had no immediate comment Wednesday.

United and Aer Lingus said they plan to work together to share revenue and costs, in a partnership that could be closer than a typical airline alliance, which they already have.

-By Ann Keeton; Dow Jones Newswires; 312-750-4120; [email protected]

 

[ultrarunner]

CHICAGO (Dow Jones)--United Airlines said Wednesday it will press ahead with a controversial plan to outsource some international flying to Aer Lingus (EIL1.DB) despite further cutbacks at the Irish carrier.

The expanded alliance has drawn fierce criticism from unions at both airlines as the new flights would be operated by "outside" employees.

How many UAL flights a day are outsourced? This is no different!

 

[flyguppy]

Yes, it is different. They are planning to hire 3rd party employees. Not Aer Lingus, not UAL. Yet they will be using Aer Lingus aircraft and both airline's resources.

 

[ultrarunner]

Ok, so a slightly different spin on outsourcing, but outsourcing none the less.

 

[flyguppy]

They are going out and finding pilots and flight attendants to work for substandard wages, to fly Aer Lingus airplanes. Completely circumventing both airlines pilot and f/a groups.

A bit more than 'slightly different' in my opinion.

 

[ultrarunner]

Ok, so a B-scale? Right?

 

[spitfire1500]

Ok, so a B-scale? Right?

More like a damn Z scale...airlines went below the former B scale rates years ago!!

 

[nwaredtail]

Well, as long as the senior UAL guys got a little carrot to appease them, who cares? From what I have seen, management ran over the UAL pilots and have completely broken their spirit, as it were. I have many UAL buds, and their overall attitude is, "whatever, who cares, at least I'm still flying."

This probably isn't the case with the furloughed folks, but for anyone hired pre-1998....

 

[flyguppy]

Not really.......

Ok, so a B-scale? Right?

Having never personally experienced a true "B-scale"......from what I understand from history though, B-scalers were on the pilot seniority list. They were not brought in from the street while said airline had 1000+ pilots on furlough.

 

[GuppyWN]

Well, as long as the senior UAL guys got a little carrot to appease them, who cares? From what I have seen, management ran over the UAL pilots and have completely broken their spirit, as it were. I have many UAL buds, and their overall attitude is, "whatever, who cares, at least I'm still flying."

This probably isn't the case with the furloughed folks, but for anyone hired pre-1998....

Well then you reap what you sew.

What do you consider "senior" at United and why are the "junior" guys letting the senior put the screws to them?

You guys seem pretty United - pardon the pun. What gives? And why are you willing to allow your flying to be outsourced like this?

Gup

 

[Kugelblitz]

Is this really all that different from outsourcing domestic flying to regional airlines? How could this not have happened? It is the next inevitable evolution in the degradation of a position despised by a management culture that only thinks it should make more than a pauper's wage.

As we continue to lose our footing in our legal right to represent ourselves (Open Skies) and make a reasonable wage commensurate with the responsibilties of our tasks, wages and salaries will suffer. Some of this is due to short-sightedness on our parts, namely, people trying to hurry and get on with a major by grabbing large amounts of jet time for low wages and work rules at regionals/commuters with no concern about the impact this has on others or their own future by eliminating mainline opportunities.

The principle issue is with the selling out of the middle class by our government in a bi-partison fashion over the last 25-30 years. I see no reason for hope.

 

[crashpad]

Is this move significant enough to cause additional UAL pilots to be furloughed?

 

[Stifler's Mom]

...."whatever, who cares, at least I'm still flying."

Probably what many of the Midwest pilots said/thought, and look at them now.

More important question for me is, what are the UAL pilots going to do about this?

 

[instructordude]

Management reserves the right to run a business and make money period!

 

[Minimaniac]

This is different. While UAL outsources flying to other airlines, at no point have pilots been brought in to fly a United Airlines-owned aircraft while UAL pilots are on furlough. This is not an "operated by" deal. This is direct street hiring while pilots are on furlough.

 

[Hutchman]

Is this move significant enough to cause additional UAL pilots to be furloughed?

I think that UAL does not operate this route, so I guess no MORE furloughs......Till they take some more routes.

 

[Hutchman]

More important question for me is, what are the UAL pilots going to do about this?

Nothing. Their scope section was gutted in BK.

 

[nwaredtail]

What do you consider "senior" at Un

ited

Anyone that voted for the worst contract to save the pension, who foolishly thought it would work. AKA , USAirways.

and why are the "junior" guys letting the senior put the screws to them?

Percentages. Senior guys vote yes to save pension, senior F/O's get brainwashed just enough and junior folks don't have the numbers to stop it. Same thing happened at NWA.

 

[ultrarunner]

Aer Lingus has pilots on furlough?

 

[bluefin]

How many UAL flights a day are outsourced? This is no different!

Yes it is, this is affecting the "senior" pilots, the international wide bodies, not the fresh, brand spanking new guys. This is hitting them in the gut.