Difficult Airports

[wmuflyguy]

Yeah, but if you go out of there IFR your initial heading is 360 and they send you 5 miles out over the lake at 1500agl, even in a 172. Pick your poison I guess.

I had Chicago approach do that. Landed at Midway with a student, went to take off, they wanted direct Gipper (southbend). I said nope and they gave us a vector us right over the middle of southern Lake Michigan. We (me and controller) argued on the radio for a minute (apparently the controller thought we came in over the lake, which we didn't) the fact that i told him we were single engine and repeated attempts to get a vector closer to land he was pissed off and he kept saying unable, about 1/2 the way across this guy said "your half way there anyways, cleared direct gipper" (did I mention it was January and night time).

I guess they were getting even with me for showing up at 7pm on a tuesday nite in a 172.

 

[minitour]

Yeah, but if you go out of there IFR your initial heading is 360 and they send you 5 miles out over the lake at 1500agl, even in a 172. Pick your poison I guess.

To the East? Off the 6s?

My only *thinking* 3? 4? trips into BKL they were using 6R/L and it was always runway heading to X altitude then CXR direct YNG.

I could see getting 360 off of 24R/L though...

I guess its not BKL tower that's the problem there. It's CLE approach that won't clear you into the Bravo...then tries to think you have to talk to them and can't switch to CGF... I understand the safety thing...traffic density, talk to the controller...he's your friend. But from a regulatory standpoint...I can't just go blowing through a class D area without talking to TWR.

A published VFR route could perhaps be a solution?

-mini

 

[groundpointsix]

To the East? Off the 6s?

My only *thinking* 3? 4? trips into BKL they were using 6R/L and it was always runway heading to X altitude then CXR direct YNG.

I could see getting 360 off of 24R/L though...

I guess its not BKL tower that's the problem there. It's CLE approach that won't clear you into the Bravo...then tries to think you have to talk to them and can't switch to CGF... I understand the safety thing...traffic density, talk to the controller...he's your friend. But from a regulatory standpoint...I can't just go blowing through a class D area without talking to TWR.

A published VFR route could perhaps be a solution?

-mini

You know, I think I've only been into BKL and used the 6's once. I don't remember what they gave me as an initial heading. 360 off of the 24s always though and you're right, it's CLE approach that is the problem, they're just trying to keep you out of the approach path into CLE. I have asked for an early turn south and the times I've done it the controllers haven't been able to do it because of traffic. I did get a westerly heading once without asking for it, but I was in a twin and didn't need it either. The 360 heading is also to keep you away from the buildings in downtown I believe, but that's not the tower's fault.

I get where you're coming from on the regulatory thing too and at BKL it's either risk swimming or risk your certificate. Fortunately I've moved south and don't have to go up there anymore.

 

[minitour]

Fortunately I've moved south and don't have to go up there anymore.

Now that makes me jealous....aside from the fact that I'd miss too many of my beloved Tribe's games.

-mini

 

[81Horse]

DUT (Dutch Harbor) is very sporting (especially in a 737).

http://www.alaska.faa.gov/fai/images/AKPEN/DUT-c.jpg

 

[imacdog]

Stuart West and Crane always made me pay attention.

 

[81Horse]

Lake Union? Kenmore?

 

[imacdog]

SJA. Actually, Lopez can be very demanding with a strong southwest wind, but Crane and SW are always a challenge in a heavy 207.

 

[81Horse]

D'oh! I was faked out by your avatar.

Did you see this elseforum? http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=70118&highlight=airpac+russian+thunder

 

[PurpleTail]

I haven't seen anyone mention Telluride, CO at 9,063 ft elevation and 6,800 ft runway, no landing long or short there. I will concur with Aspen as well, very tricky.

 

[imacdog]

D'oh! I was faked out by your avatar.

Did you see this elseforum? http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=70118&highlight=airpac+russian+thunder

Yes, Launchpad and I are coworkers in the summers.

 

[pilotpat]

Aspen is fun as long as its clear!! LOL As far as EGE goes, ATC kinda forgot about me on the LOC approach there - kept me at 15,000' after RLG VOR and on an 8 mile final I thought, "This must be what its like in the Space Shuttle"!! And then to smack me in the face they let a 757 depart when I was on a 2 mile final....umm, 'scuse me...I'm tryin' to land here. That was pretty funny. Luckily we were picking up pax and were empty at the time.

Also when in PBI after my initial Falcon training I had to do my 3 landings - the rental pilot we had said, "We'll go to Vero to do that". Not knowing FL airports I said, "okay"...then it was 'Traffic, traffic, traffic' - 'Do not decend' - 'Do not climb' - 'Which one of you said VRB was a good place to go'. I guess I should have known Flight Safety was based there - duh!! But hey, I got a great first-hand flying experience in the new airplane

 

[Beatrix Kiddo]

Aspen, Eagle, Telluride. But the single most dangerous airport I ever flew into was St. Augustine FL. before they put in the tower...Dunno if its better now but back then it was a deathtrap...


wiggle your big toe...

 

[Spooky 1]

Kmhw

Certainly not the most difficult but for grins you might go out to Moses Lake, WA on some gusty day with three or four C-17's in the pattern doing all sorts of unorthadox approaches and go-arounds, along with maybe one or two Boeing test beds or pilot trainers and then just to make it interesting a Japan Airlines B747 doing approaches to the recipricol runway that you are using. Gets hard to keep up with all the action. Lots of TA's going off all the time. Hats off to the controllers on those days.

 

[avbug]

I never really thought of an airport as being difficult. It it's difficult, why land there in the first place?

Eagle has a wide open approach...not what one would term "difficult."

Aspen...water flows downhill, so do you. There are big rocks in the area, but there's a lot of space between the rocks, and that's where Aspen is. Any place that was home to John Denver can't be dangerous, and Aspen is only dangerous if you make it so.

Telluride...I went in there this summer and watched a Cessna 150 towing sailplanes off that ruway. That should say it all, right there. Difficult? It's a little downhill, but also uphill once you reach the middle. Departing, you have lots of altitude right off the bat, and the gaps in the terrain all go downhill. Good food in town, friendly folks, not at all difficult.

There's a few fields out there a little more challenging than others, but difficult?

Anybody ever land at Sandwash, UT?