Difficult Airports

[FCPhotography]

I like the busy airports because of the scenery. ATL, BOS, ORD, LGA, EWR, JFK,PHL. Getting paid the little we do to watch a 747 go around at 50 feet is pretty cool.

ORD gate hold for 2 hours in the middle of a trip never bothered me.

 

[Fred Rogers]

good stuff

These are very interesting. I almost completely forgot about the mess that is L.A. A gazillion little airplanes going this way and that, mixed in with tons of rich folks (and all you "lucky" people who fly them) in and out of VanNuys and every other airport down there.

As to the previous post, FC- I agree that I don't mind the delays in the middle of the trip.. but doesn't it always seem to run smooth in the middle, and then on your friday... big constipation? Maybe it's just cause you're excited to get home and everything feels like it takes twice as long.

 

[minitour]

With very limited experience, I would have to say...

IFR: CLE
VFR: BKL

Why is it CLE can issue me a taxi clearance to 24L or 6R for departure after I get my clearance...then half way there, I'm at a dead stop while they switch me to 6L or 24R depending on where the winds are at? And why is it that they don't get how in a 172 I can be ready at 24L at L right NOW (since I did just tell ground "N123 can be ready now for the intersection departure") for IMMEDIATE takeoff (and yes...I see the SWA 737 on 5 mile final...I'll beat him out....let me goooooo! Please!) or how I can take 6R from N and be ready right NOW rather than have me taxi behind a CAL 757 alllllllllll the way to the end, then have me wait the 3-4 minutes after he goes when I coulda beat him out in the first place? I know first come first serve....but how about we use some common sense too.

As for BKL...if I want to leave VFR to the East...why do they put me on a hdg/alt restriction that puts me right through CGF's class D. (then CLE app doesn't want me in the Bravo and doesn't want me to talk to CGF tower either...wtf?) I only needed to do that once (after another pilot warned me ) to never go in/out of there VFR again.

...but I've heard TEB is bad too.

-mini

 

[chperplt]

I've seen a lot of LGA mentioned, but I haven't seen one mention of the reason LGA sucks. The airport is fine when the Jamaican lady isn't anywhere near the airport. She shows up and ends up with aircraft pointed nose to nose on A and B.

 

[Cat Driver]

Difficult in bad weather? BGBW

Expensive? BGBW

 

[Guitar rocker]

Someone might have mentioned it, but I dont know the identifier anymore, but never really cared landing in Guantanamo Bay.....fine landing on 28 but didnt care much for 10, at least not in the lead sled.

 

[MissKittyKat]

TGU? Teguigalpa? (sp)

 

[Lead Sled]

From a "technical" point of view the toughest domestic US airports would probably be ASE, followed closely by EGE. When it comes to the rest, and I've been to all of the ones mentioned, if you've been to one you've more or less been to them all. (After all, just how tough is getting vectored to final?) The fun doesn't really begin until after you've landed.

'Sled

 

[AlabamaMan!!]

Sled knows what I'm talkin about. If I didnt have to worry about paying the bills, I'd give the boss "four thumbs down" to ASE and EGE.

 

[Say Again Over]

Intl airports; The old FUNCHAL, Madeira Island before the lengthened the runway was fun. (LPMA)

 

[FLYnMONKEYS]

TEX isn't bad. Wide open departing to the west. You can get a bit of a bumpy ride in and out though.

X

Try it in a plane with a 40 degree wing sweep!

 

[Captain4242]

ASE and EGE are tough; definetly know what you're doing before venturing in there. I've seen them both about 10 times, and I still get a litttle uptight.
TEB and PHL get my votes for most annoying, though.

 

[Fred Rogers]

I've seen a lot of LGA mentioned, but I haven't seen one mention of the reason LGA sucks. The airport is fine when the Jamaican lady isn't anywhere near the airport. She shows up and ends up with aircraft pointed nose to nose on A and B.

The Gate holds some days are pretty random.. not a cloud in the sky and we are held at the gate for an hour.. by the time we get there.. no one around. Ground can be frustrating sometimes, ESPECIALLY when the aformentioned controller is at the helm. I've heard SEVERAL "everybody be quiet" calls from her. Then someone else takes over and everything is better within 5 min. Crazy. I think it's just a whole bunch of airplanes crammed into a small space.

 

[groundpointsix]

As for BKL...if I want to leave VFR to the East...why do they put me on a hdg/alt restriction that puts me right through CGF's class D. (then CLE app doesn't want me in the Bravo and doesn't want me to talk to CGF tower either...wtf?) I only needed to do that once (after another pilot warned me ) to never go in/out of there VFR again.

-mini

Yeah, but if you go out of there IFR your initial heading is 360 and they send you 5 miles out over the lake at 1500agl, even in a 172. Pick your poison I guess.

 

[PHX767]

Yep, ASE is one of the most gawd awful places to put an airport I have seen. On arrival, it's possible to hear,"TERRAIN,TERRAIN", "TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC", and "OH JEEZ THAT WAS CLOSE" in the same 10 second time span. And on departure you jink right while climbing so as to miss the arriving traffic buzzing by under the left wing.

LGA does suck. I have been number 62 for takeoff on a cold rainy night.

Surprised nobody has mentioned BOS. Some pretty long delays there.

I find lately there is a new trend in annoying ATC controllers at some not really busy airports. The "monitor tower" phrase - then when you forget after about 10 minutes and say, "xxxx holding short, ready" they ask if you know what monitor the tower means. Sigh. Well, I guess not.

 

[wmuflyguy]

Yeah, but if you go out of there IFR your initial heading is 360 and they send you 5 miles out over the lake at 1500agl, even in a 172. Pick your poison I guess.

I had Chicago approach do that. Landed at Midway with a student, went to take off, they wanted direct Gipper (southbend). I said nope and they gave us a vector us right over the middle of southern Lake Michigan. We (me and controller) argued on the radio for a minute (apparently the controller thought we came in over the lake, which we didn't) the fact that i told him we were single engine and repeated attempts to get a vector closer to land he was pissed off and he kept saying unable, about 1/2 the way across this guy said "your half way there anyways, cleared direct gipper" (did I mention it was January and night time).

I guess they were getting even with me for showing up at 7pm on a tuesday nite in a 172.

 

[minitour]

Yeah, but if you go out of there IFR your initial heading is 360 and they send you 5 miles out over the lake at 1500agl, even in a 172. Pick your poison I guess.

To the East? Off the 6s?

My only *thinking* 3? 4? trips into BKL they were using 6R/L and it was always runway heading to X altitude then CXR direct YNG.

I could see getting 360 off of 24R/L though...

I guess its not BKL tower that's the problem there. It's CLE approach that won't clear you into the Bravo...then tries to think you have to talk to them and can't switch to CGF... I understand the safety thing...traffic density, talk to the controller...he's your friend. But from a regulatory standpoint...I can't just go blowing through a class D area without talking to TWR.

A published VFR route could perhaps be a solution?

-mini

 

[groundpointsix]

To the East? Off the 6s?

My only *thinking* 3? 4? trips into BKL they were using 6R/L and it was always runway heading to X altitude then CXR direct YNG.

I could see getting 360 off of 24R/L though...

I guess its not BKL tower that's the problem there. It's CLE approach that won't clear you into the Bravo...then tries to think you have to talk to them and can't switch to CGF... I understand the safety thing...traffic density, talk to the controller...he's your friend. But from a regulatory standpoint...I can't just go blowing through a class D area without talking to TWR.

A published VFR route could perhaps be a solution?

-mini

You know, I think I've only been into BKL and used the 6's once. I don't remember what they gave me as an initial heading. 360 off of the 24s always though and you're right, it's CLE approach that is the problem, they're just trying to keep you out of the approach path into CLE. I have asked for an early turn south and the times I've done it the controllers haven't been able to do it because of traffic. I did get a westerly heading once without asking for it, but I was in a twin and didn't need it either. The 360 heading is also to keep you away from the buildings in downtown I believe, but that's not the tower's fault.

I get where you're coming from on the regulatory thing too and at BKL it's either risk swimming or risk your certificate. Fortunately I've moved south and don't have to go up there anymore.

 

[minitour]

Fortunately I've moved south and don't have to go up there anymore.

Now that makes me jealous....aside from the fact that I'd miss too many of my beloved Tribe's games.

-mini

 

[81Horse]

DUT (Dutch Harbor) is very sporting (especially in a 737).

http://www.alaska.faa.gov/fai/images/AKPEN/DUT-c.jpg

 

[imacdog]

Stuart West and Crane always made me pay attention.

 

[81Horse]

Lake Union? Kenmore?

 

[imacdog]

SJA. Actually, Lopez can be very demanding with a strong southwest wind, but Crane and SW are always a challenge in a heavy 207.

 

[81Horse]

D'oh! I was faked out by your avatar.

Did you see this elseforum? http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=70118&highlight=airpac+russian+thunder

 

[PurpleTail]

I haven't seen anyone mention Telluride, CO at 9,063 ft elevation and 6,800 ft runway, no landing long or short there. I will concur with Aspen as well, very tricky.

 

[imacdog]

D'oh! I was faked out by your avatar.

Did you see this elseforum? http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?t=70118&highlight=airpac+russian+thunder

Yes, Launchpad and I are coworkers in the summers.

 

[pilotpat]

Aspen is fun as long as its clear!! LOL As far as EGE goes, ATC kinda forgot about me on the LOC approach there - kept me at 15,000' after RLG VOR and on an 8 mile final I thought, "This must be what its like in the Space Shuttle"!! And then to smack me in the face they let a 757 depart when I was on a 2 mile final....umm, 'scuse me...I'm tryin' to land here. That was pretty funny. Luckily we were picking up pax and were empty at the time.

Also when in PBI after my initial Falcon training I had to do my 3 landings - the rental pilot we had said, "We'll go to Vero to do that". Not knowing FL airports I said, "okay"...then it was 'Traffic, traffic, traffic' - 'Do not decend' - 'Do not climb' - 'Which one of you said VRB was a good place to go'. I guess I should have known Flight Safety was based there - duh!! But hey, I got a great first-hand flying experience in the new airplane

 

[Beatrix Kiddo]

Aspen, Eagle, Telluride. But the single most dangerous airport I ever flew into was St. Augustine FL. before they put in the tower...Dunno if its better now but back then it was a deathtrap...


wiggle your big toe...

 

[Spooky 1]

Kmhw

Certainly not the most difficult but for grins you might go out to Moses Lake, WA on some gusty day with three or four C-17's in the pattern doing all sorts of unorthadox approaches and go-arounds, along with maybe one or two Boeing test beds or pilot trainers and then just to make it interesting a Japan Airlines B747 doing approaches to the recipricol runway that you are using. Gets hard to keep up with all the action. Lots of TA's going off all the time. Hats off to the controllers on those days.

 

[avbug]

I never really thought of an airport as being difficult. It it's difficult, why land there in the first place?

Eagle has a wide open approach...not what one would term "difficult."

Aspen...water flows downhill, so do you. There are big rocks in the area, but there's a lot of space between the rocks, and that's where Aspen is. Any place that was home to John Denver can't be dangerous, and Aspen is only dangerous if you make it so.

Telluride...I went in there this summer and watched a Cessna 150 towing sailplanes off that ruway. That should say it all, right there. Difficult? It's a little downhill, but also uphill once you reach the middle. Departing, you have lots of altitude right off the bat, and the gaps in the terrain all go downhill. Good food in town, friendly folks, not at all difficult.

There's a few fields out there a little more challenging than others, but difficult?

Anybody ever land at Sandwash, UT?