Departure Procedure Question

[Stifler's Mom]

I don't have my Jepp plates with me, so going to do this best I can by memory.

Departing from Macon (MCN) on runway 6 in IFR conditions. The Departure Procedure says to turn to a heading of 090. The tower initially told us to fly runway heading.

What would be the appropriate thing? Turn to a heading of 090 or fly runway heading. I thought that the procedure of a heading of 090 was correct as the Tower doesn't have radar contract to provide us with obstacle avoidance.

Beuler???????

 

[aa73]

I don't have my Jepp plates with me, so going to do this best I can by memory.

Departing from Macon (MCN) on runway 6 in IFR conditions. The Departure Procedure says to turn to a heading of 090. The tower initially told us to fly runway heading.

What would be the appropriate thing? Turn to a heading of 090 or fly runway heading. I thought that the procedure of a heading of 090 was correct as the Tower doesn't have radar contract to provide us with obstacle avoidance.

Beuler???????

MILF - if Tower issues you a heading to fly, that always takes priority over whatever the DP specifies. They probably coordinate with Departure control or Center for the min vectoring altitude before giving the heading to you.

 

[Flying Illini]

Based on what happened to us today, I would say that if tower gave you an assigned heading that you are to fly THAT new assigned heading. Not the one on the departure procedure...I say that based on this:
Leaving KABE (allentown, PA) this morning we departed rwy 24. The DP says fly rwy heading through 800' then a right turn to 320 do not exceed 190 kts. We recieved this DP from clearance. When tower gave us our takeoff clearance he ONLY said, "...cleared for take-off, rwy 24." Hence, the previous clearance would take precedence.
In your case, since you recieved an amended clearance, I would fly what the twr told you to.

I may be waaaay off base on this and I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

Of course, you could always clarify with tower...that's alot easier than a NASA report.

 

[Flying Illini]

...aa73 posted while I was typing...sorry for the duplicate answer.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

I don't have my Jepp plates with me, so going to do this best I can by memory.

Departing from Macon (MCN) on runway 6 in IFR conditions. The Departure Procedure says to turn to a heading of 090. The tower initially told us to fly runway heading.

What would be the appropriate thing? Turn to a heading of 090 or fly runway heading. I thought that the procedure of a heading of 090 was correct as the Tower doesn't have radar contract to provide us with obstacle avoidance.

Beuler???????

The only time to use a Departure Procedure is when the airport is IFR (or below minima dictated by the Procedure), and you have not recieved any particular initial assignment on receipt of your IFR clearance. Usually this happens with the tower closed. Issuing authority will say:
"cleared as filed, maintain 3000, contact me when airborne, void if not off by 12:34" In that case you are to fly the obstacle departure procedure. If they assign a heading, that negates the need to fly the procedure.

If you happen to lose an engine: the ONLY procedure to fly is what is described in the Airport Analysis manual. If none, go straight out. Y'all should know this stuff...

 

[satpak77]

Aim 5-2-6

read that, pretty lengthy, talks about DP's and basically says that ATC may vector aircraft off the DP for system efficiency and traffic control

I would assume the "runway heading" is vector-ish in nature, regarding the DP

http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap5/aim0502.html#5-2-6

note that SID's are also DP's, altho we tend to think of "the front of the plate book" when talking about DP's.

If you depart DFW and the SID requires "turn to XXX at 2 DME, intercept Maverick XXX outbound" and tower says "Eagle Flight, maintain runway heading", then you maintain runway heading, period.

 

[svcta]

Asssigned-Expected-Vectored-Filed, in that order.

 

[Rogue5]

Hey svcta:

If you're getting that order from 91.185(c) "Lost Comm under IFR" the order to follow is actually:

(1) Route. (i) By the route assigned in the last ATC clearance received;

(ii) If being radar vectored, by the direct route from the point of radio failure to the fix, route, or airway specified in the vector clearance;

(iii) In the absence of an assigned route, by the route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance; or

(iv) In the absence of an assigned route or a route that ATC has advised may be expected in a further clearance, by the route filed in the flight plan.

AVEF, not AEVF.

Back to the Raider game...

 

[FmrFreightDog]

If you happen to lose an engine: the ONLY procedure to fly is what is described in the Airport Analysis manual. If none, go straight out. Y'all should know this stuff...

Yes.... And what you are, in effect, saying is that even though he didn't know the answer he should know better than to ask the question. There's so much complaining going around on this board that it's actually refreshing when someone asks a legitimate question. If someone asks a question, and you know the answer, I would think the answer would suffice. The condescending comment is unnecessary and inappropriate.

 

[Rythm3]

Asssigned-Expected-Vectored-Filed, in that order.

Are you sure about that? I always thought it was Assigned, vectored, expected, filed. I could be wrong too. It's been a while.

 

[TonyC]

Are you sure about that? I always thought it was Assigned, vectored, expected, filed. I could be wrong too. It's been a while.

The ole "Avenue F" acronym: AVE F

 

[SkyBoy1981]

Yes.... And what you are, in effect, saying is that even though he didn't know the answer he should know better than to ask the question. There's so much complaining going around on this board that it's actually refreshing when someone asks a legitimate question. If someone asks a question, and you know the answer, I would think the answer would suffice. The condescending comment is unnecessary and inappropriate.

I'll second that!

Also, at towered airports, unless you were given a DP as part of your clearance that specifies a heading to fly, the Tower/Local controller is required to give you a heading as part of your takeoff clearance. As Oakum mentioned, the Obstacle DP on the back of the airport diagram is to be used for non-towered airport departures and engine failures.

 

[Stifler's Mom]

No harm, no foul. We querried the tower about our initial heading. We were concerned about engine out climb performance because there is an antenna farm off the end of the runway.

One of those learning experiences that we encounter from time to time and was wondering what you all thought.

Thanks for the insight.

 

[atrdriver]

What do you do in ATL? You fly the heading that they give you, lets say off of 9L, Rwy heading, 100, 115, 130, 170, whatever they tell you. If you pop an engine then you do what's in the Airport analysis or the fly the DP.

 

[svcta]

Rogue, you're absolutely right. Back to the scotch....