Delta ready to void pilots contract.

[Buckaroo]

AMEN!! It is by having that attitude that we fought and won the Revolutionary War, Civil War, WW2 and other turning points for the USA. You will be martyrs for the present and next generation of pilots. Well most of the ones with dignity and a sense of self worth anyway. Just like I salute every soldier who gave his life or limb for the greater good, we must standby every man and women walking the picket line @ DAL and put our petty differences aside. The reprucussions for scabs must be so severe and so unpleasant that anyone contenplating it will think twice before crossing a picket line. All in all a united pilot force is a stronger pilot force.

How can you picket a company that no longer exists? As soon as DALPA walks, Delta is out of business..........PERMANENTLY.

The will not be an airline to strike.

It will be just a bunch of goons marching in lockstep carrying signs.

 

[Birdstrike]

Some battles have to be fought for principles. We have this country because some men took a stand when it was necessary. I hope the Delta pilots have the fortitude to do so now. It is necessary.

What you say may be very well true and while I respect those principles, how long is Joe Delta going to be able make the mortgage and car payments while living off a limited strike fund? More importantly, how much certainty is there that this kind of a job action will still accomplish the desired goal for the risks involved? Got leverage? That's all I'm asking.

 

[Spooky 1]

AMEN!! It is by having that attitude that we fought and won the Revolutionary War, Civil War, WW2 and other turning points for the USA. You will be martyrs for the present and next generation of pilots. Well most of the ones with dignity and a sense of self worth anyway. Just like I salute every soldier who gave his life or limb for the greater good, we must standby every man and women walking the picket line @ DAL and put our petty differences aside. The reprucussions for scabs must be so severe and so unpleasant that anyone contenplating it will think twice before crossing a picket line. All in all a united pilot force is a stronger pilot force.

Unfortunately all this chest beating and braggadocio talk will not prevent the inevitable from happening. Either the airline will cease to exist and along with it, thousands of jobs will be lost by those who have nothing to do with your plight, or the airline will attempt to man from the outside. Eastern failed at this, but remember the Southern’s, Continnetal’s, and United that did not fail but continued operating albeit under a very dark cloud. There are hundreds if not thousands of pilots who would in fact cross the line out of greed or bare necessity to support families.

You may recall the two CAL pilots who were arrested for planning to kill or injur pilots who either crossed or scabbed at CAL. I wonder how much support they got from their fellow pilots when they were standing trail down in Texas? Think real carefully about the consequences of a strike. If you don’t feel the job is worth it anymore quit. I guess you could quit in the middle of a trip and that would show how much you care about them, but be careful before you take the whole show down with you. I doubt that you would ever get a job in aviation after being part of this scenario, no matter how just it may seem at the time.

 

[800Dog]

The Company has made a "proposal" that would severely cut our pay, take away our defined contribution retirement, and gut the rest of our contract.

I do not know if the CMR MEC is talking to the DAL MEC but I suspect the DMEC is too busy with its own concerns to be worried about Comair. Comair pilots may well take a similar stance and take this matter through 1113c, but if they do I don't think it will be bacuase of discourse with the DMEC. It will be because the company's proposal is unwarranted and sometimes it is necessary to say NO regardless of the risks. Comiar pilots have said NO before and may do so again. Don't be surprised if it happens.

Yes, it would be nice if all ALPA pilots worked toghether. However if that were to happen it would no longer be ALPA.

Best of luck to you guys at Comair. I am a former ASA guy and have always felt the commuter guys, whatever that means these days, were grossly underpaid. It is a shame that we as ALPA members are so divided.

 

[800Dog]

Unfortunately all this chest beating and braggadocio talk will not prevent the inevitable from happening. Either the airline will cease to exist and along with it, thousands of jobs will be lost by those who have nothing to do with your plight, or the airline will attempt to man from the outside. Eastern failed at this, but remember the Southern’s, Continnetal’s, and United that did not fail but continued operating albeit under a very dark cloud. There are hundreds if not thousands of pilots who would in fact cross the line out of greed or bare necessity to support families.

You may recall the two CAL pilots who were arrested for planning to kill or injur pilots who either crossed or scabbed at CAL. I wonder how much support they got from their fellow pilots when they were standing trail down in Texas? Think real carefully about the consequences of a strike. If you don’t feel the job is worth it anymore quit. I guess you could quit in the middle of a trip and that would show how much you care about them, but be careful before you take the whole show down with you. I doubt that you would ever get a job in aviation after being part of this scenario, no matter how just it may seem at the time.

Spooky,
Instead of quitting, I had rather exercise my right to strike. If Delta goes away, so be it. I am planning on leaving this profession in the next year anyway and could care less about other employee groups. They could care less about the pilots and the fact we have already given a disproportionate amount. My fellow pilots are the only ones I care about. Sounds selfish but, most people hate pilots and so, I could care less about the affect a stike would have on them. I will sleep well at night and feel good about myself when looking in the mirror. I refuse to allow any management team to rape me and my profession. I know you will not understand this mentality and that actually makes me feel good as I can tell you are not a man of honor.

 

[Pilotbob3]

What you say may be very well true and while I respect those principles, how long is Joe Delta going to be able make the mortgage and car payments while living off a limited strike fund? More importantly, how much certainty is there that this kind of a job action will still accomplish the desired goal for the risks involved? Got leverage? That's all I'm asking.

Geez, you sound like a guy who would cross the line!

 

[DaveGriffin]

Dave,

As a former 3-year furloughee, I find your categorizing of the remaining furloughed guys as willing scabs highly insulting. Even in the worst times I'd never cross a picket line and I think you underestimate our younger pilots' integrity. Beyond the ethical and professional ramifications of scabbing, Delta's proposed pay rates are barely enough to attract someone to work here during normal times, let alone entice someone to cross a line and be labled for 30 years.

Do you really think the 475 pilots that are still on furlough are waiting with baited breath to come back to DAL at any cost? No way.

But, this isn't the first time you've painted DAL pilots with a broad, inaccurate brush.

You may, however, continue to bash the rich, disconnected, loser PRPs living in Peach Tree City.

-PF

We'll never get a chance to find out what the furloughees will do because there will not be a strike. The greedy b*stards that run the MEC may be big talkers but they have way too much to lose if they kill Delta.

The point I was making about the PRPs is that they were the guys running the MEC in 2002-2004 when the strategy was to deny there was a problem, stall and stretch out the C2K pay raises as long as possible. The PRPs don't care about the juniors now and they didn't care about them after 9/11. They have done everything they can to benefit the senior pilots.

They have taken the solidarity that you speak of so proudly and used it against you, to enrich themselves.

 

[FDJ2]

Strike and put Delta out of business!!!!!

It will ultimately be up to the company whether there is a strike and it will be up to the creditors whether they will sell their assets at pennies on the dollar and lose their $15B/yr cash cow and force DAL into liquidation. The pilots have negotiated in good faith and contributed more then any other stake holder towards Delta's recovery. It is Delta management that has failed miserbly and $325M won't help.

 

[FDJ2]

How can you picket a company that no longer exists? As soon as DALPA walks, Delta is out of business..........PERMANENTLY.

If Delta can't stay in business with the pilot deal they now have, $325m won't keep them in business. Management's request is just an opportunistic grab. GG said less then a year ago, "do it once, do it right", well we did, unfortunately management failed.

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Nevermind

 

[DaveGriffin]

Nevermind

You made some excellent points FBJ. Why did you delete them? I hope it wasn't a concern for the negative comments you could expect in return.

 

[wolfpackpilot]

The CMR MEC will do exactly what the CMR MEC is told to do.....

By D.W. and his kronies in Herdon that is.

 

[Draginass]

The real show to watch is Northwest. Stenland is going after the pilots with a chainsaw and, IMHO, is determined to totally subjugate the union. I don't think DAL management is that smart. I think Arpey at AA is sitting back and watching for the slash-and-burned "industry standard" contract so he can send the ultimatum to "his" pilot union . . . . of course, all in the spirit of "Win together" (or in reality . . . "You lose, but keep your job. We win and get you locked into a long term no strike contract like Eagle").

 

[Buckaroo]

Spooky,
Instead of quitting, I had rather exercise my right to strike. If Delta goes away, so be it. I am planning on leaving this profession in the next year anyway and could care less about other employee groups. They could care less about the pilots and the fact we have already given a disproportionate amount. My fellow pilots are the only ones I care about. Sounds selfish but, most people hate pilots and so, I could care less about the affect a stike would have on them. I will sleep well at night and feel good about myself when looking in the mirror. I refuse to allow any management team to rape me and my profession. I know you will not understand this mentality and that actually makes me feel good as I can tell you are not a man of honor.

# of times "I" appears in the above post - 8
# of times "me" or "my" appears in the above post - 6
This post indicates an unfathonable amount of lack of integrity. What a bozo. This jerk will get what he deserves.

 

[Buckaroo]

It will ultimately be up to the company whether there is a strike and it will be up to the creditors whether they will sell their assets at pennies on the dollar and lose their $15B/yr cash cow and force DAL into liquidation. The pilots have negotiated in good faith and contributed more then any other stake holder towards Delta's recovery. It is Delta management that has failed miserbly and $325M won't help.

No, it will be up to the pilots on whether or not there is a strike.