Delta Pilots stapled to the bottom of the list.

Speedbird34

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This is totally unfair. But I never supported the Merger anyway. Hoping the new Airline works out and the years we shall all spend on reserve as we get displaced does not hurt too much.
No protection from layoffs or displacement. The award has too many holes in it as regards displacement due to shrinking airplanes or moving equipment around.
We have already had displacements in system wide. I hope we have leave of absence when we begin shrinking. we get to keep our numbers during the layoff and also travel bennies. So we can go fly somewhere else and return when we can hold a line on a B767ER under my present conditions.
 

koepp

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They were hired after the merger was announced on 04/14/08. Why would they expect anything but date of hire?
 

filejw

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This is totally unfair. But I never supported the Merger anyway. Hoping the new Airline works out and the years we shall all spend on reserve as we get displaced does not hurt too much.
No protection from layoffs or displacement. The award has too many holes in it as regards displacement due to shrinking airplanes or moving equipment around.
We have already had displacements in system wide. I hope we have leave of absence when we begin shrinking. we get to keep our numbers during the layoff and also travel bennies. So we can go fly somewhere else and return when we can hold a line on a B767ER under my present conditions.
Well the arbitrators basically used a mathematical method to make sure every body had the same % on the list as they had on the old list. If you were zero before you are zero now. And there are furlough protections...
 

skystud25

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They were hired after the merger was announced on 04/14/08. Why would they expect anything but date of hire?
We were hired at the same time as folks 2-3 classes ahead of us, had id cards, employee numbers, and class dates. So why should we be treated differently?
 

FlyinPiker

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We were hired at the same time as folks 2-3 classes ahead of us, had id cards, employee numbers, and class dates. So why should we be treated differently?
I believe this was negotiated in the JCBA. The arbitrators are not singling anyone out, they are following what both sides unions (NWA & DAL) had already decided on. When was the last NWA class? Maybe that was something they used to pick that date.
 
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MJ42

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We were hired at the same time as folks 2-3 classes ahead of us, had id cards, employee numbers, and class dates. So why should we be treated differently?
To Quote Puff Driver from another thread...":crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: ".

I guess you should have applied sooner, like 2007. If you would have gotten hired then, you'd be senior to our 2000 hires. Besides, you knew what you were getting into, would you have turned the job down if you were told(before your class date) you'd be junior to everyone at the new DAL?
 
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FlyinPiker

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As for Speedbird...

Anyone that is going to come on this board and complain about not being able to hold their seat in a 767 when they are sitting at the bottom of a 12,000 pilot list deserves any flame they have coming.

You can blame the possibility of your horrible luck on the merger all you want, but as a fellow Delta pilot I fully believe with this economy the reduction in capacity and rumored displacements would still be going down.
 

FlyinPiker

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We were hired at the same time as folks 2-3 classes ahead of us, had id cards, employee numbers, and class dates. So why should we be treated differently?
Here you go:

Pilots hired after April 14, 2008, shall be junior to all pilots on the ISSL
and shall be listed in order of date of hire consistent with the Joint
Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA.).
 

TNPILOT

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This is totally unfair. But I never supported the Merger anyway. Hoping the new Airline works out and the years we shall all spend on reserve as we get displaced does not hurt too much.
No protection from layoffs or displacement. The award has too many holes in it as regards displacement due to shrinking airplanes or moving equipment around.
We have already had displacements in system wide. I hope we have leave of absence when we begin shrinking. we get to keep our numbers during the layoff and also travel bennies. So we can go fly somewhere else and return when we can hold a line on a B767ER under my present conditions.
I was in one of the first classes cancelled at NWA. I will be happy to trade with you so I can enure your mistreatment.
 

NuGuy

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Heyas,

DAL made a huge issue about this in their briefs. I told everyone that the date of constructive notification was going to be very important, and the arbitrators did EXACTLY what was the precident, which was DOH.

The Mesaba flow ups kept their number and place on the list. A very small win for the NWA side.

Nu
 

jetjockey#1

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Heyas,

DAL made a huge issue about this in their briefs. I told everyone that the date of constructive notification was going to be very important, and the arbitrators did EXACTLY what was the precident, which was DOH.

The Mesaba flow ups kept their number and place on the list. A very small win for the NWA side.

Nu
That's great. Hey Lee, I hope you are very proud of yourself. You unified the greatest airline, and staple some of your own "brothers" below some guys who don't even work here, not even at NWA. Let's just hope the NWA MEC takes over, they seem to get what they want every time. Lee time to resign, and time to start working for a living.
 

JohnQ

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That's great. Hey Lee, I hope you are very proud of yourself. You unified the greatest airline, and staple some of your own "brothers" below some guys who don't even work here, not even at NWA. Let's just hope the NWA MEC takes over, they seem to get what they want every time. Lee time to resign, and time to start working for a living.
If you say so. Lee Moak will go down like Harry Truman...disliked by many at the time, but remembered as a very strong, effective, great leader.

I defy you to find any other MEC chair who led a pilot union through BK, helped foil a hostile takeover that would have trashed our careers, and was part of an effective, proactive process that ensured one contract and one SLI (with flaws, but basically not too egregious) just weeks after DCC.

You won't. But keep on telling yourself otherwise if it makes you feel better.
 

Speedbird34

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If you say so. Lee Moak will go down like Harry Truman...disliked by many at the time, but remembered as a very strong, effective, great leader.

I defy you to find any other MEC chair who led a pilot union through BK, helped foil a hostile takeover that would have trashed our careers, and was part of an effective, proactive process that ensured one contract and one SLI (with flaws, but basically not too egregious) just weeks after DCC.

You won't. But keep on telling yourself otherwise if it makes you feel better.
For the junior guys this list could have being date of hire for all the difference it makes. The MEC never expected that the junior pilots would get stapled to the bottom. and also the resultant result.
Check the difference between that tentative list Delta side put out. Most delta guys lost 800 positions from that list. This list is on the junior side a NWA windfall I have not more than a few Nwa pilots hired before me behind me. For me this could have been a DOH list for all the difference it makes.
Junior guys I mean any of the new hires post 9/11 check the list the total amount of NWA pilots hired before you junior to you does not exceed 120 pilots.
I believe our union failed our pilot group. But time to move on. I am not going to dwell on it. It is just a job no big deal. Hopefully it continues to just take 12 days of my month. I would hate to fly on the Northwest side for now and listen to all the blabla bla and also some Delta guy who thinks he should control what I feel.
Cheers guys hoping the future is not too bleak and try to find alternatives to the job so you are not scared of losing your job. I can live with that possibility.
The Delta guy I refer to is the dude on this forum talking trash. Lee moak I guess had good intentions. he is an alright guy just got out played by a ruthless Northwest group who play to win at all cost and did win.
 
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propdog

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For the junior guys this list could have being date of hire for all the difference it makes. The MEC never expected that the junior pilots would get stapled to the bottom. and also the resultant result.
Check the difference between that tentative list Delta side put out. Most delta guys lost 800 positions from that list. This list is on the junior side a NWA windfall I have not more than a few Nwa pilots hired before me behind me. For me this could have been a DOH list for all the difference it makes.
Junior guys I mean any of the new hires post 9/11 check the list the total amount of NWA pilots hired before you junior to you does not exceed 120 pilots.
I believe our union failed our pilot group. But time to move on. I am not going to dwell on it. It is just a job no big deal. Hopefully it continues to just take 12 days of my month. I would hate to fly on the Northwest side for now and listen to all the blabla bla and also some retarded Delta guy who thinks he should control what i feel.
Cheers guys hoping the future is not too bleak and try to find alternatives to the job so you are not scared of losing your job. I can live with that possibility.
You were a brand new hire at DAL...hired after all the NWA people who are ahead of you. You were living the fantasy wet dream that you'll be sitting pretty behind 500 NWA pilots. Didn't happen...time to move on and quit gripping!
 

skystud25

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To Quote Puff Driver from another thread...":crying: :crying: :crying: :crying: ".

I guess you should have applied sooner, like 2007. If you would have gotten hired then, you'd be senior to our 2000 hires. Besides, you knew what you were getting into, would you have turned the job down if you were told(before your class date) you'd be junior to everyone at the new DAL?
Internet Tough Guy:

I wasn't whining, just asking a question. Yes, I would have still taken the job, but that's beside the point. The pilots who started in the last two classes were no different than those who started a class or two earlier and were integrated, that's all I'm saying. We made our decisions based on the same information back in Jan. and Feb., that is, we thought a merger might be coming. It's a matter of principle we're talking here; every new hire in the last two classes had their class dates and employee numbers, but weren't technically on property yet, so the good folks at NW made an issue of that technicality to get as much as they could for their pilots. Fine, that's life and I accept it.

I'd tell you to grow up, but I've read enough of your vitriol over the last few months to know that's not probable. Welcome to Delta.
 

Speedbird34

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You were a brand new hire at DAL...hired after all the NWA people who are ahead of you. You were living the fantasy wet dream that you'll be sitting pretty behind 500 NWA pilots. Didn't happen...time to move on and quit gripping!
Save your lecture for those who care to hear your opinion. totally worthless to me and expected.
 

MJ42

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Internet Tough Guy:

I wasn't whining, just asking a question. Yes, I would have still taken the job, but that's beside the point. The pilots who started in the last two classes were no different than those who started a class or two earlier and were integrated, that's all I'm saying. We made our decisions based on the same information back in Jan. and Feb., that is, we thought a merger might be coming. It's a matter of principle we're talking here; every new hire in the last two classes had their class dates and employee numbers, but weren't technically on property yet, YOU MEAN LIKE OUR POOLIES WHO ARE STILL WAITING? ONLY DIFFERENCE IS THEY DIDN'T HAVE THEIR ID'S. WEAK ARGUEMENT!so the good folks at NW made an issue of that technicality to get as much as they could for their pilots. Fine, that's life and I accept it.

I'd tell you to grow up, but I've read enough of your vitriol over the last few months to know that's not probable. Welcome to Delta.
Sorry, but re-read post #7 from an original DAL pilot. You seem to have felt a sense of entitlement and now complain you're not senior to our 2000 hires? You came to DAL knowing the merger was already announced, and you had the choice to turn down the offer.

I'm okay with the list. I'm very happy to be a part of the new DAL. I think this will be a great company! Thanks for welcoming me to DAL, I'm excited to be here!
 
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Speedbird34

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Sorry, but re-read post #7 from an original DAL pilot. You seem to have felt a sense of entitlement and now complain you're not senior to our 2000 hires? You came to DAL knowing the merger was already announced, and you had the choice to turn down the offer.

I'm okay with the list. I'm very happy to be a part of the new DAL. I think this will be a great company! Thanks for welcoming me to DAL, I'm excited to be here!
You sound exactly like a northwest pilot. If I had my way we would never be in the same company but the majority and share holders have spoken and that is democracy so now we suck it up and with time it would not matter who the RD's are or the ND's.
And for the junior guys who got stapled I feel your pain. Take solace in the fact that hopefully a majority of this guys would be gone in a few years and our system would do the hiring for the future. It is a good thing they won they may have shut down the Airline otherwise.
 

~~~^~~~

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Nevermind.
 
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