Delta pilots-accuracy in reporting re:your contract

[Roomwithaview]

You got called out Redclown (thanks PCL), and you lost! Two people stated those type trips you showed aren't prevalent at your base. Your credibility is still zero.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Uh, I think you need to work on your reading skills, GL. I repeat, those trips are a dime a dozen. Translation, you can pick them up for straight pay all day long. MCO and ATL, are suffering from the trannyfication of SWA. So what you have is super senior former AAI I FOs who can't hold either base scarfing up any and all the discretionary flying. Not so much on the Cappy's side. At least it wasn't in ATL, last time I checked.

 

[redflyer65]

If that trip were in giveaway it wouldn't be picked up out of LAS. ATL, MCO maybe but not a 19.5 three day.

Trips like that are a dime a dozen.

Just sayin'

Genny,

You have reading comprehension problems?

I'm highlighting a post that says I got 'called out'. I love it when you open your pie hole and show how much of a Village Idiot you really are.

I didn't lose anything. PCL doesn't know what he's talking about and apparently you can't even read.

Need me to post more of those Delta 4 days that pay 21? Here's the difference.....

I can GUARANTEE you we don't have any of those at SW because we have a better rig. You get that right? Damn, your dense.

 

[redflyer65]

Uh, I think you need to work on your reading skills, GL. I repeat, those trips are a dime a dozen. Translation, you can pick them up for straight pay all day long. MCO and ATL, are suffering from the trannyfication of SWA. So what you have is super senior former AAI I FOs who can't hold either base scarfing up any and all the discretionary flying. Not so much on the Cappy's side. At least it wasn't in ATL, last time I checked.

Agreed Room. Atlanta is such a small base that there isn't near the flexibility like BWI,MDW, LAS and PHX. The other issue with ATL is the trips are not quite as good because how they have the schedule set up. It's hard to get an ATL guy back from the west coast with the same efficiency you see in other bases.

I'm not telling you anything you don't know because you are there. But out west, those one leg flights back to base are pretty sweet. The only down side is getting up early on the East Coast......except for that BHM trip I posted. That late report was really the only exception in that trip.

 

[slaquer5]

You got called out Redclown (thanks PCL), and you lost! Two people stated those type trips you showed aren't prevalent at your base. Your credibility is still zero.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Red is correct we do have lots of trips Red described . I like the more productive trips so I do not bid the rigged trips .


I am off to fly my 9 legs to LBB today

 

[Roomwithaview]

I am off to fly my 9 legs to LBB today

In a 200, I hope!

 

[Roomwithaview]

MEDICAL!!!

Medical - $58/month for a family of 4

Well, yours truly is paying $273 a month for a family of three and $42 a month for Dental

Swapa? Hello?

 

[bafanguy]

The real issue with pay at my legacy and all 3 for that matter is we work far more for far less than decades ago. This issue needs to be fixed. But many don't do their homework and just take the first available offer. More collaboration needs to occur. For example, my friends at Delta and United were surprised I can drop a trip every month for personal reasons. I have done so almost every month. Look at the whole picture and choose wisely. I believe most can go where they want with great effort - prep and career enhancing positions and work (i.e. safety, training jobs). Many choose not to for various reasons and as such we all have different things we must uniquely contend with.

I will agree things are improving rapidly for the better at the big 3 and according to my squadron buds at the other carriers at United, Delta, Southwest, and my experience at a legacy, work rules are critical and should be improved and will be as these new contracts are negotiated. I've had friends tell me they feel as if they're on reserve every time they fly in and out of ATL and receive ACARS extensions quite often on the 88 and 90.

The one big thing to look at when choosing to go to a legacy is retirements because seniority is everything. Also, older pilots tend to work more weekends with grown families. This greatly improves a young pilot's chances of being home for their families. A contract with holiday pay has a similar effect for the young pilots with families. Can you drop trips and pick up another one? Other information is good to know as well. For example, a large amount of training causes buying trips from pilots and they get paid to not work. Retirements cause a lot of training events. Once the trip is bought can you fly another trip over the same footprint and make double pay? Yes I can! This is just one in many examples to research and target your choice job as well as retirements and future fleet plans as best as you can. What percentage of widebodies are there and what is the the minimum time to that position? Can you "create" a 8,9,10 day vacation every month if you'd so desire without working 12 in a row? 12 in a row (regardless of credit) is not my cup of tea. 3 on, 4 off and weekends/holidays off is right up my alley! To each their own of course. This job for many gets very old real fast. Can you go back to the right seat in the same equipment, move to other equipment? Are there contractual seat locks to upgrade?

Talk with and research until you have a clear picture. For example, I had no desire to spend 5-10 years in the right seat of a mad dog working 4-day trips Fri-Mon, in and out of ATL (puke) for Delta. I didn't care for stagnation, the 737 nor many leg trips only commutable on either end of a 4-day trip for Southwest.

Now to the OP point...sorry for the diatribe - some may benefit?

The overall annual compensation will be roughly the same as these contracts are built upon each other for similar aircraft at the big 3 so ensure you choose wisely. Good luck to all hopefuls researching for your final destination because, you will ultimately marry it!

Pave,

Excellent rundown and analysis of criteria for considering a career carrier (for those faced with the uptown "problem" of having to choose between them).

Working for a carrier with a contract offering all the flexibility/options you mention is exactly where a person would want to work. It's not even a debatable subject.

Of course, the most advantageous use of all those goodies is seniority based so, since everybody doesn't get the same stuff from Day One, even having all those goodies may not quickly offer everyone the life described. (The retirement picture at the big three may affect that to a large degree for those getting the nod early in the hiring push...this is a unique point in history)

However, if I may offer a thought as the voice from beyond the end of the road, talking to those facing that big career choice (you do "...ultimately marry it !"), all those contract specifics are ephemeral, existing on thin and shifting ice. One day you wake up being identified as the "best paid" airline pilots in the country/world/solar system/universe...with the best contract conditions and lifestyle...only to wake up some morning years down that same road to see the company filing BK with all of the above up for grabs and not in a good way.

Since, as you correctly said, the money is going to be relatively the same over several decades among the carriers, I would suggest that in choosing a legacy carrier to "marry", I'd focus more on broader factors to include things like labor/management history which ultimately affects everything, pilot bases, etc., which are big factors affecting life as an employee, more than contract boilerplate which is guaranteed to change.

Best of luck to everyone in the chase. It's really serious stuff.

 

[General Lee]

Genny,

You have reading comprehension problems?

I'm highlighting a post that says I got 'called out'. I love it when you open your pie hole and show how much of a Village Idiot you really are.

I didn't lose anything. PCL doesn't know what he's talking about and apparently you can't even read.

Need me to post more of those Delta 4 days that pay 21? Here's the difference.....

I can GUARANTEE you we don't have any of those at SW because we have a better rig. You get that right? Damn, your dense.

Great Redclown, you have plenty of 3 days worth 19 trips or whatever, yet so does DL and the other legacies, and they are called INTL trips with two legs and nice rest breaks. You "LUV" to point out some DL 4 day trips worth 21 hours, yet fail to show the majority of your trips with exhausting multiple leg days. You try to hide those, but those trips are what your airline is based off of, high productivity. Sure, there are some DL fleets with the same thing, but there are also 85 newhires a month currently, and 5000 retirements coming that haven't really even started yet. That means quicker upward movement, away from "worse" trips and the ability to move to different fleets if one wants to find the right type of flying for the particular pilot. That is something that most LCCs lack, variety in flying types and fleets. Plus, the lack of 5000 retirements. All 3 legacies have that coming.

It's a no brainer Red, and you're watching the unbelievable upward movement from the other side. No wonder you scramble to find any unproductive DL trip you can, you are very jealous and want to try to promote an airline that is heading more towards stagnation than career acceleration. I hear there have been SWA pilots in a couple of the last newhire DL classes. Have you put your app in yet Red?



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Here are just one example that I found without even looking hard...

ATL MD88 (Sept)

Pairing #6097

Day One: ATL-DCA-ATL-CLT (1:16 ground time in ATL)
Day Two: CLT-DTW-BWI-ATL-GSO (ground time of 1.06,1:51,1.00)
Day Three: GSO-ATL-PVD (ground time 2.02)
Day Four: PVD-ATL-MLB-ATL ( 3 hours of ground time in ATL)

So the trip is 3 legs, 4 legs, 2 legs, 3 legs and pays....


Wait for it...



21.4 - Does that sound very efficient? SW rig would pay min 26.

How about a three day that pays 16? There's plenty if that's your gig.

ATL M88? There's a good chance someone is going to be paid 42.8 hours for it.

 

[Roomwithaview]

Ss

ATL M88? There's a good chance someone is going to be paid 42.8 hours for it.

So DAL has a no $hit double time program? Like to hear more about that.