Delta Connection pilots unite on pay, work rule issues

[crjdxr]

Sorry if this has already been posted.

http://columbus.bizjournals.com/columbus/stories/2006/07/17/daily4.html

Business First of Columbus - 11:10 AM EDT Monday

Union leaders representing pilots for the four airlines that serve as feeders for Delta Air Lines Inc. said Friday they will work together on issues relating to work rules and compensation.
The commuter airlines that make up Delta Connection include Comair Inc., a subsidiary of Delta; Atlantic Southeast Airlines Inc.; Mesa Air Group Inc. and Chautauqua Airlines Inc.

J.C. Lawson, a Comair pilot and union leader for the Air Line Pilots Association, said the cooperative effort came about so that Delta, which is trying to reorganize after filing for bankruptcy last fall, can't pit the airlines against one another by offering more aircraft or business in exchange for concessions.
"It's a classic tactic to use the threat of fleet deployments and flying to divide and conquer us at the expense of our livelihoods," Lawson said.
Comair pilots in January approved a four-year contract that will result in $17.3 million in employee pay cuts. The contract is contingent on Comair reaching an agreement with its flight attendants.
The pilots union represents Comair, Atlantic Southeast and Mesa pilots. Chautauqua's pilots are represented by the International Brotherhood of Teamsters Local 747.
Atlanta-based Delta (Pink Sheets: DALRQ) is one of the largest carriers at Port Columbus International Airport.
Atlanta-based Atlantic Southeast, part of SkyWest Inc. (NASDAQ:SKYW) offers services at Port Columbus. Chautauqua Airlines, subsidiary of Indianapolis-based Republic Airways Holdings Inc. (NASDAQ:RJET) and Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group provide connecting flights through several major airlines, including Delta and American Airlines Inc.

 

[wmuflyguy]

too little too late.

 

[FreightNazi]

Business First of Columbus - 11:10 AM EDT Monday

Union leaders representing pilots for the four airlines that serve as feeders for Delta Air Lines Inc. said Friday they will work together on issues relating to work rules and compensation.
The commuter airlines that make up Delta Connection include Comair Inc., a subsidiary of Delta; Atlantic Southeast Airlines Inc.; Mesa Air Group Inc. and Chautauqua Airlines Inc.

J.C. Lawson, a Comair pilot and union leader for the Air Line Pilots Association, said the cooperative effort came about so that Delta, which is trying to reorganize after filing for bankruptcy last fall, can't pit the airlines against one another by offering more aircraft or business in exchange for concessions.
"It's a classic tactic to use the threat of fleet deployments and flying to divide and conquer us at the expense of our livelihoods," Lawson said.
Comair pilots in January approved a four-year contract that will result in $17.3 million in employee pay cuts. The contract is contingent on Comair reaching an agreement with its flight attendants.
The pilots union represents Comair, Atlantic Southeast and Mesa pilots. Chautauqua's pilots are represented by the International Brotherhood of Teamsters Local 747.
Atlanta-based Delta (Pink Sheets: DALRQ) is one of the largest carriers at Port Columbus International Airport.
Atlanta-based Atlantic Southeast, part of SkyWest Inc. (NASDAQ:SKYW) offers services at Port Columbus. Chautauqua Airlines, subsidiary of Indianapolis-based Republic Airways Holdings Inc. (NASDAQ:RJET) and Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group provide connecting flights through several major airlines, including Delta and American Airlines Inc.


Don't think they are threatening!

 

[John Pennekamp]

Great. Now that we're buddies again JC "Just Caved" Lawson can screw us again.

 

[sniper]

After all the name calling, Mesa this Mesa that, now please help us, lets unite?

If I was a Mesa pilot I would have said "kiss my a---"

 

[Turkey Shoot]

All that stuff is an empty gesture. As soon as someone figures they can get a quick upgrade by caving, the deal goes in the crapper.

Close the hole that allows for these kids with 250 hours to fly jets (people will have to dire first before Congress gets off their collectives a$$es). Get some guys that believe themselves worthy a descent paycheck that have some experience. I see what the young guys do and all they crave is that left seat because they think there be more out there. Well guess, what? There may not be much one day. Better make a nice bed now because we'll all have to sleep in it one day.

As long as we have the current mind set, we'll continue to cut each others throats and management will laugh all the way to the bank.

 

[~~~^~~~]

J.C. Lawson, a Comair pilot and union leader for the Air Line Pilots Association, said the cooperative effort came about so that Delta, which is trying to reorganize after filing for bankruptcy last fall, can't pit the airlines against one another by offering more aircraft or business in exchange for concessions.

Isn't JC is the same guy who signed Comair's concessions for growth deal while sending ASA pilots telling us how much Comair's pilots supported us? What ever.

Feel good meetings with large expenditures of ALPA expense money don't provide contractual scope protection.

I know this is politics, but how about a public statement from Duane Woerth saying that ALPA's priority will be to bind scope within the brand to stop competitive bidding by alter ego air carriers? Oh, I didn't think so.

Better to give the children $2,500 to go outside and play.

 

[GuppyKiller]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

 

[wmuflyguy]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

1000PIC won't get ya sh#$, especailly if your an idiot.. Many many many people have considerably more PIC than that and are still stuck at regionals.

How much longer till you upgrade?

 

[COOPERVANE]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

Yes, that is what regionals were supposed to be for.

"get my thousand PIC, and I'm outta here. don't look back"

First of all, every word above is absolutely correct.
Let me guess. You still think that will be you. But you say "i'm different, I won't get stuck here"

Please tell me I'm mis-interpreting your post. Do you admit that you are one of those grads "chomping at the bit" to get "yours" and then move on? Do you REALLY think thats going to happen?........really?

If so, then YOU are the problem. YOU with your shortsightedness and willingness to step over your mother to fly a "guppy killer"..........Great

i do agree with you about the industry not changing until 1000 hour wonders stop filling the classes.

I always find it interesting that ALL pilots, every one, that get a job at a regional with <1000 hours think that they are competant and belong there. All pilots, every one, that came in with 2500-3000 after flying freight and/or instructing think 1000 is too little. Why is that? Do they POSSIBLY know something you don't?

Nah, they are just jealous of your superb flying skills. After all "hate the game not the playa" right?


Look mommie, I'm an airline pilot!!!! Sorry about the scuff marks!

 

[GearUpLightsIn]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

You did notice that the "majors" that you have been talking about have been in a little trouble these last few years, right? Airtran, Jetblue, SWA, UPS FEDEX, Cont: all hiring, but look at how many regional pilots there are that are way more qualified than you. When you get your 1000 PIC there will still be 1000's of regional pilots more qualified than you and that have people walking in their resumes. It isn't the late 90's and you can't just step on through the regionals like the vast majority of us at the regionals might like to. There are just as many regional pilots chomping at the bit to get one of those "major" jobs as there are CFI's waiting to get your current job.

But put that aside for a minute. Let's say you get your 1000 PIC and get a job at your "goal major". The fact that you were so willing to take so little in compensation at a regional has now hurt you at a major. You can't get the compensation that you now feel that you (rightfully) deserve at your goal airline because the proportional difference in compensation between you and the regional pilot guy is so great. Better compensation at the regional level is in everyone's best interest regardless of where your career goals are.

 

[HarryParatestes]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

1000 hours of flying as a CFI in a 150 or 172? Get real. Get yourself a couple of thousand hours of 121 PIC and get on with an LCC. No legacy carrier (except CAL) is going to hire for at least five years.

 

[DrewBlows]

Close the hole that allows for these kids with 250 hours to fly jets (people will have to dire first before Congress gets off their collectives a$$es).

It's not the 250 hour guys that are voting themselves pay cuts. It's the guy who is making $100,000 a year and who thinks he can't make $80,000 anywhere else. I've talked to many of them.

 

[Newman55]

It's not the 250 hour guys that are voting themselves pay cuts. It's the guy who is making $100,000 a year and who thinks he can't make $80,000 anywhere else. I've talked to many of them.

Sorry drew but paycuts are the way to go. Its the future and the destiny of this industry. If you don't like it QUIT and go on tour with tha big snoop dogg

 

[~~~^~~~]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors.

OK.... and your Avitar is an E170 in United colors, which is service replacement for a 737 and your name is "guppy killer"?

So what major job are you after? What you don't seem to realize is that you are performing that job now.

ALPA allowed all of this flying to go outside the brand's seniority list, then failed to allow anyone else to lock it in using scope, resulting in a free fall race for the bottom.

You are serving in the capacity of a major airline pilot now. You should realize that.

 

[BoilerUP]

Its amazing how a bunch of formerly "banned" names all belonging to out favorite group of flamers have recently reappeared once their name de jour has been banned...

 

[Exskydiverdrivr]

Regional airlines are supposed to be a stepping stone to the majors. Pilots need to use them for what they are, leave and don't look back. Management has ZERO incentive to increase wages and benefits because they KNOW that litterally thousands of young CFI and academy grads are chomping at the bit to get on there and get the required 1000 PIC so they can advance to their goal major.

That's great Guppy . except not everyone can leave for the majors. The reason s are as numerous as they are varied. But whatever the reason is, there will always be regionals and a need to insure that these pilot groups are fairly compensated.

I don;t have any hard data to support this, but I believe the days of the low time guys coming in won't last much longer. It will become the vapid wasteland it was in the early 90's again where flying jobs will become scarce. Once the pool of drooling SJS guys dries up well pretty much be in a better negotiating position.

 

[DrewBlows]

Sorry drew but paycuts are the way to go. Its the future and the destiny of this industry. If you don't like it QUIT and go on tour with tha big snoop dogg

Who peed in your Cheerios?

 

[Newman55]

Who peed in your Cheerios?

No one peed in my cheerios. This industry sucks. Everytime you try and do something like this someone like mesa always screws it up. It never works.

 

[FreightNazi]

Hey BoilerUP, are you the former Purdue intern that worked in 727 flt training?

 

[GuppyKiller]

OK.... and your Avitar is an E170 in United colors, which is service replacement for a 737 and your name is "guppy killer"?

So what major job are you after? What you don't seem to realize is that you are performing that job now.

ALPA allowed all of this flying to go outside the brand's seniority list, then failed to allow anyone else to lock it in using scope, resulting in a free fall race for the bottom.

You are serving in the capacity of a major airline pilot now. You should realize that.

I know that plane is a 737 killer. I'm not going to get on with pax carrier, so I don't care if the replace them or not. I've got an in at UPS. As soon as I get my 1000 turbine PIC, I'm out of here!

 

[HarryParatestes]

I know that plane is a 737 killer. I'm not going to get on with pax carrier, so I don't care if the replace them or not. I've got an in at UPS. As soon as I get my 1000 turbine PIC, I'm out of here!

I know a guy who had an "in" at UPS. Six years later he is still at CHQ. Your 1600 hrs plus 1000 121 PIC won't cut it. Good luck though. Some slip though and get on with very little time, but these days there are a ton of experienced guys out there to pick from.

 

[Medic1277]

I know that plane is a 737 killer. I'm not going to get on with pax carrier, so I don't care if the replace them or not. I've got an in at UPS. As soon as I get my 1000 turbine PIC, I'm out of here!

How pathetic. After I read things like that, I'm glad I'm not in the flying business anymore.

 

[GuppyKiller]

What's wrong with having an "in"? I have a great "in" at UPS, and she said that once I get the 1000 PIC turbine, UPS will interview me! That's why I'm in such a big hurry to upgrade, so I can get out of here and on to my goal airline. You guys should try the same thing instead of settling for being a regional lifer.

 

[VABB]

How pathetic. After I read things like that, I'm glad I'm not in the flying business anymore.

Hey Medic,

Do you know Chet Kelly?

 

[Medic1277]

Hey Medic,

Do you know Chet Kelly?

I still love that show. Corny as all hell!

 

[VABB]

I still love that show. Corny as all hell!

Yeah, but still addictive. I like the episodes better with the Ward LaFrance rig.

 

[Newman55]

I know that plane is a 737 killer. I'm not going to get on with pax carrier, so I don't care if the replace them or not. I've got an in at UPS. As soon as I get my 1000 turbine PIC, I'm out of here!

The plane isnt a 737 killer per se. If the plane can't make money its going to the desert one way or the other. As everyone where is so fond of saying the planes are going to go where they need to go. If mainline can't afford to do service on a city with a 737 then they will use a 70 seat airplane. People get all up in arms about a E-170 however a CRJ-700 serves in the same function. The airplanes simply went where they needed. The difference is the pilots can't use artificial demand in their contracts anymore. Scope clauses are good for job protection until they get too restrictive and hinders the ability to compete. The other thing we regional pilots should be saying is why not us. Why not let mainline aircraft come to the regionals. Its your chance to make your job as good as a major without having to start at the bottom of someone elses list. That should be a new ALPA slogan WHY NOT US.

 

[Medic1277]

Yeah, but still addictive. I like the episodes better with the Ward LaFrance rig.

Season 0ne and two are out on DVD. Season three should be out soon.

 

[John Pennekamp]

What's wrong with having an "in"? I have a great "in" at UPS, and she said that once I get the 1000 PIC turbine, UPS will interview me! That's why I'm in such a big hurry to upgrade, so I can get out of here and on to my goal airline. You guys should try the same thing instead of settling for being a regional lifer.

Ah yes, kids with stars in their eyes. Reminds me of the 500 hour Riddle Wonder Boy flight instructors we hired in the late '90s. They all told you how they had an "in" because Daddy worked ar United or Delta or FedEx and that they were going to get their 1000hr PIC and be OUT! Now they're all senior 50 seatr captains fighting for an ASA retirement package.

Let the boy dream. In 10 years when he's a top dog captain on the E195 working for $95 an hour he'll be like the rest of us...