DAL junior Pilots sold down the river by NEW MEC

[GogglesPisano]

Regretting leaving World yet? .

Never.

 

[DYLIN]

Whats even more sad is when you talk to pilots who fly these regional jets, they are even more excited that they are getting growth. But they dont realize that an the end they are destroying the very majors they want to work for.

Some are like that, many are not.

Everyone where I work, and I do mean every last one that I have flown with so far, is disgusted with any expansion in vendor flying.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Problem is that OUR MEC thinks that DCI makes a lot of money and this allows better mainline contracts and rates.
I am so dumbfounded as to how they came to that, but that is what I have been told.
I have tried to wrap my arms around why we want DCI to grow. I makes me really confused.
Now I know we will be getting more mainline jets so this is only a short term issue for DAL, but our union did not need to pacify them this way.

 

[Networ-King]

I just love the absolute BS "spin" the union had the gall to put out in their email:


"It’s important to understand that the agreement is a settlement over an issue of scope language [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]interpretation [/FONT]and [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]not [/FONT]an issue of "scope relief." Scope language is intended to protect pilot jobs. This agreement enhances job protections for Delta pilots. There has been no change to the scope language in our contract, and this settlement will [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]not [/FONT]increase the number of regional jet hulls; it simply codifies the number of seats that will be allowed in up to 26 of those aircraft."


The company was limited to a certain number of 76 seat jets. The union just allowed them to go over that amount by almost 30 additional 76-seat jets. That is scope relief pure and simple. They just allowed the potential parking of even more DC-9's. I don't care that the total number of RJ's did not increase. They are allowing more 76-seat jets to exist.

DAL/NWA alpa has proven once again that they are utterly incapable of preserving scope protections. The company says "boo" and they pee their pants. RA must be laughing his rear-end off.

Ask any of the roughly 2000 pilots at both DAL and NWA that were furloughed after 9-11 how that useless no-furlough clause worked out for them. Sure glad the union got an "improvement" in it in exchange for this.

Same f*&king pig with a different color lip stick....Just wait till the pilots, "brothers and sisters" that don't get furloughed fly an overwhelming amount of open time and then justify it with some lame a$$ excuse. HHHmmmmm what was that average number of hours of open time flown monthly genitalee?????? 4000? oh that's right it was around 5000 hours of open time flown monthly by the double breasted brothers. D a m n.... why oh why didn't I accept that recall?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

They have the contractual right to do it, and we are suckers for money. We are are our worst enemy.

 

[hockeypilot44]

This makes me sick to my stomach. I want to give praise to the US Airways' pilots that de-certified ALPA. I wish the new Delta pilots would follow your lead. ALPA is run as a business. We are NOT represented by ALPA. ALPA represents itself and only itself. We caught the company BLATANTLY violating our contract on a HUGE issue and let them off the hook for a bullsh!t no-furlough clause. If we can't hold the company to our current scope agreement, then how are we going to hold them to our new no-furough clause agreement? The correct answer is, "WE CAN'T." We essentially just gave up more scope for nothing in return.

 

[whatitdoing?]

I think the FAA is my better friend than ALPA.

 

[Networ-King]

They have the contractual right to do it, and we are suckers for money. We are are our worst enemy.

Ding Ding Ding Ding .... we have a winner. Great logic ACL... I'll look for the supportive posts of your ALPA brethren should you ever get furloughed for years while the greedy wh o r e s rake in the dough while you can't put food on the table for your family. History will repeat itself because of the same greedy f*&ks that did it last time .... count on it.

I sure hope there are no furloughes because of this relief, but words like.....force manuer, no furlough clause, scope relief, recession, economic melt down..... hhhmmm lots of fun word for lawyers to throw around in courts to justify just about anything. Good luck...

 

[whatitdoing?]

No furlough clauses are a joke. Totally unenforceable. Notice how they put in the 'but' if you do furlough. This is pathetic. Delta MEC just sold away scope.

 

[701EV]

Hey ACL65,

Maybe ALPA should have wrapped their arms around the PID in 2000 and we might not have this problem today. Now the DCI carriers will fight to under cut each to get some of these aircraft.

We're all screwed.

701EV

 

[Turtle21]

New MEC just signed off on scope relief to the company on the 76 seat overage of airplanes. They got us "Furlough" protection. We all know that it will not hold up. But we will NEVER get that scope back. Great job MEC

ALPA... they add RJs to the fleet and expect no furloughs. WTF.

ALPA freaking locks a fox in the hen house and pats themselves on the back for protecting the chickens.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Which one?

BTW, I can speak from experience: the absolute ********************tiest, most aggravating, hair-pulling, should-have-called-in-sick, what-the-********************-am-I-doing-this-for, the FA's-didn't-warm-my-nuts-enough, great-I-have-to-fly-with-ATL's-Golden-Girls-again, oh-great-another-SVO-48-hr-layover-wonderful-there's-a-passenger-next-to-my-crew-rest-seat-I-guess-it's-steak-again- worst day at a major is better than my ohh-goody-I-get-to-fly-the-newest-Barbie-jet-I-hope-there-are-only-5-MEL's-where-the-********************-am-I-going-to-get-something-to-eat-on-this-20-minute-turn-five-leg-day-they-screwed-me-out-of-3-hours-on-my-last-paycheck-where-am-I-going-to-get-something-to-eat-at-5am-God-some-of-the-FO's-I-fly-with-can't-even-land-or-speak-English-dinner-at-Applebee's-again-is-this-the-first-day-of-the-rest-of-my-life-another-night-at-the-Holiday-Inn-Airport-will-I-ever-fly-to-Europe-will-I-ever-get-to-a-major-why-don't-major-airline-pilots-say-hello-or-is-it-just-my-own-insecurity best day at a regional.

'

This would make an AWESOME lower back tattoo!

 

[SonicPig]

ALPA, the Widebody Pilots Flying Club.

That's what we 2172's at United call it. Sorry to hear it happened to you guys. It's one thing when management slips it to you, quite another when your supposed protectors do it.

The Pig.

 

[PCL_128]

This makes me sick to my stomach. I want to give praise to the US Airways' pilots that de-certified ALPA. I wish the new Delta pilots would follow your lead. ALPA is run as a business. We are NOT represented by ALPA. ALPA represents itself and only itself. We caught the company BLATANTLY violating our contract on a HUGE issue and let them off the hook for a bullsh!t no-furlough clause. If we can't hold the company to our current scope agreement, then how are we going to hold them to our new no-furough clause agreement? The correct answer is, "WE CAN'T." We essentially just gave up more scope for nothing in return.

This was a decision made by your own local elected reps, not by some nebulous entity in Herndon. "ALPA" doesn't make decisions, local pilots do. In any case, it was probably the right decision. Going to arbitration over 156 total seats is far too risky.

 

[Whataburger]

'

This would make an AWESOME lower back tattoo!

Target?

 

[Sedona16]

Time to recall Moak plain and simple. This guy is and has been WAY too cozy with management for some time. I would rather have a pissed off NWA guy in there than Moak at this point. Of course the only true way to solve the scope give aways is to get a Jr guy in the top spot....and thats probably not going to happen

 

[Turtle21]

This was a decision made by your own local elected reps, not by some nebulous entity in Herndon. "ALPA" doesn't make decisions, local pilots do. In any case, it was probably the right decision. Going to arbitration over 156 total seats is far too risky.

It took you this long to begin your cheer?

Herndon didn't protect the pilot right to vote (why would anyone expect it, they didn't let the pilots vote when billions of pension was given away, what's a little scope?)

ALPO travels through a dog and stinks worse with time.

 

[MINIME]

Can't wrap my mind around this language yet. But it seems dull and not very binding. Lawyers, the right lawyers, could possibly have a field day with it.

I'm very, very surprised that the DAL MEC allowed this to take place. Maybe they know something we're not seeing.

I disagree with the notion that this is too risky therefore, just sign some relief in hopes of not getting the pointier end of the ax. It just doesn't seem right. But what do I know... General what you say?

Our profession has been under siege for far too long. Scope is something that could help us bring it back to some normalcy.

 

[ReverseSensing]

... when you talk to pilots who fly these regional jets, they are even more excited that they are getting growth. But they dont realize that an the end they are destroying the very majors they want to work for.

Wait a minute there Forrest Gump: who's destroying the majors? The regional pilots? What're you smokin' there Ace of the Base? I didn't know DALPA's MEC was run by regional pilots.

Oh, and I fly a turboprop for an airline that's downsizing 25%, but it is a regional, so I guess I'm part of the problem, huh?

 

[Superpilot92]

This makes me sick to my stomach. I want to give praise to the US Airways' pilots that de-certified ALPA. I wish the new Delta pilots would follow your lead. ALPA is run as a business. We are NOT represented by ALPA. ALPA represents itself and only itself. We caught the company BLATANTLY violating our contract on a HUGE issue and let them off the hook for a bullsh!t no-furlough clause. If we can't hold the company to our current scope agreement, then how are we going to hold them to our new no-furough clause agreement? The correct answer is, "WE CAN'T." We essentially just gave up more scope for nothing in return.

"We" didnt do anything, Moak and his chronies did this on their own without even hinting to the pilot groups or the FNWA MEC members. This shat has to stop. We can not have people in these positions that only represent the minority.

Also the title of this thread is wrong, its not just the Junior pilots that get screwed when scope is given away its ALL pilots. Everything from Jobs, Schedules, Upgrades, commutes, and QOL issues are effected when our "leaders" offer our flying up to mgmt. Have we not seen enough of the effects with outsourcing flying? Was the latest issue with Midwest and UAL not enough to paint the cancerous effects of scope relief? We need people in our union positions that arent like politicians. ALPA has become a mirror image to the many problems in our government right now. Greed and personal agendas have ruined ALPA and if we are ever going to become a viable union again we must change this attitude.