CRJ Guys turn

[n757st]

Close, electronic

I guess that serves me right for correcting someone else.. ...either way, if I'm flying, in the Rj-200 I'm the fadec.

 

[BoilerUP]

The 200 is a fun airplane to fly, but is waaaay underpowered. Another 500-700lbs of thrust per side would go a LONG way for climbs in the mid-twenties and higher. It doesn't land like any "real" transport jet, so for me at least, consistancy on landings took a couple hundred hours to achieve. Its no turboprop but you can make it fall out of the sky if you have to descend quickly. Autopilot is kind of a POS in that it hunts bandly when you are making a turn in heading mode and switch to NAV; it also has occasional problems capturing a localizer. I'm glad it has ailerons; its easier to land in a stiff xwind than the Beechjet was.

FADEC and an ECS system worth a damn would be nice. Also, most ProLine4 bizjets I've seen have VNAV, so WTF was Bombardier thinking by not including it on the CRJ?

 

[Crossky]

They are cramped in the cockpit. The passengers hate them. They have no control feel whatsoever. It is the worst flying airplane I have flown in GA or the airlines. It does have the highest paycheck of any airplane I have flown so that is it's only plus. The air conditioning system is terrible. Auto mode automatically gives you full cold or full hot and that's about it.

No disrepect to a brother, but . . .

It flies better than an MD-80 - hyd powered controls do count for something. I haven't flown an ERJ but we definitely have more room up front than those guys. We aren't weight restricted much anymore unless it's a really long leg with strong headwinds, the ERJ is much worse with weight restrictions. Try jumpseating on an ERJ from Newark to OK City for example. The FMS kicks ass over what the Embrarer has. The cabin is taller, and you can actually use the overheads with some planning (it has two of them you know). Roll response is very rapid but you get used to it. In pitch it has a null zone like any hyd jet I would guess, keep it trimmed and it's not too bad. A little difficult to hand fly ALT and on approach, but it's a jet what do you expect. It's good enough for me.

 

[DrewBlows]

At least in the -200 the reason you get a better landing in a crosswind is the fact that only having 1 wieght on wheel signal means the GLD will not deploy.

You might have a point. It's hard to say why, but even "good" landings in the -700 "clunk" when you touch down. A really good roller is basically luck. I've seen guys fly it on level (literally level pitch since it sits 3 degrees nose low on all three wheels) like the -200 and other guys pitch up as much as 11 degrees (scary), but the result is usually the same. I prefer an in-between technique, which seems to give me consistant decent landings and at least a shot at a good one every once and a while. When I'm really feeling frisky I'll dip a wing at the last second to put one wheel down first. This works well, except when you put the wing down to high and start sliding laterally across the runway. So, needless to say, I'm still looking for the perfect technique.

 

[sweptback]

FADEC and an ECS system worth a dang would be nice. Also, most ProLine4 bizjets I've seen have VNAV, so WTF was Bombardier thinking by not including it on the CRJ?

It was the choice of the FMS that lacked VNAV. Evidently the version we got could do VNAV perfectly fine, but it was never certified for it (hence why it is certified for advisory purposes only, but still gives us all the information). That evidently saved a bunch of money that was passed down to the operators in lower costs. ASA's training department looked into certifying the FMS for VNAV, but Collins basically said to them "don't bother."

 

[dojetdriver]

kind of a new guy here..but what is a FADEC exactly?

Depending on who you talk to Fully Automated Digital Engine Control, Fully Automated Digital Electronic Control, Full Authority, ect.

It's a computer that controls the engine and tells it what to do. From engine start to engine shutdown. It's usually a "thrust by wire system", meaning that there is no physical connection between the thrust levers and the engine. Move the thrust lever, signal goes to the FADEC, sends info to the engine. Much like modern fuel injection on the new corvettes, ect.

In a perfect world, it keeps the engine from overtemping during starts, TO, climb, and cruise as well as keep it in normal operating parameters. There have been times when FADEC's have had software issues and for whatever reason shut down the engine in flight. ERJ's suffered from this problem in the early days.

The FADEC on the ERJ is like another guy called it, "FADEC light". It's also unnecessarily complicated to use. It needs ALOT of information before it can control the engine for whatever regime of flight. The Dork had a much more sophisticated FADEC. Just put the thrust lever in the appropriate detent (TO, Climb, or Cruise) and it will do the rest.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

Autopilot is kind of a POS in that it hunts bandly when you are making a turn in heading mode and switch to NAV

This doesn't happen if you select NAV mode prior to initiating any changes in the FMS. Example: If you are taken off course on a heading and then given a new heading to fly direct to FLM, if you select NAV mode and then execute the FMS with the new flight plan, the aircraft will make a smooth turn. It's when guys turn the heading bug and then select NAV mode in the middle of the turn that the aircraft gets screwed up. It may be a flaw in the system, but this is a way around it.

 

[Baronman]

The FADEC on the ERJ is like another guy called it, "FADEC light". It's also unnecessarily complicated to use. It needs ALOT of information before it can control the engine for whatever regime of flight. The Dork had a much more sophisticated FADEC. Just put the thrust lever in the appropriate detent (TO, Climb, or Cruise) and it will do the rest.

Just curious, what's so complicated about the ERJ "FADEC LIGHT?" You plug in 3 items prior to take-off, push the levers to the detent and then hit a button when you want climb or cruise power. If that's complicated I'd hate to see what you call all old turboprop!

 

[dojetdriver]

Just curious, what's so complicated about the ERJ "FADEC LIGHT?" You plug in 3 items prior to take-off, push the levers to the detent and then hit a button when you want climb or cruise power. If that's complicated I'd hate to see what you call all old turboprop!

Complicated in the fact that it can't do ANYTHING until you give it information. In flight, why can't it be like most every other airplane? You want cruise power, pull the levers back and let the FADEC do the rest. You want more power, push them up and let the FADEC do the rest.

Also, a go around is a total cluster with that thing. Push the levers up, make sure the PNF pushes the right buttons. If the detent is weak and you accidently go past it on the TO run, oh well. We'll have to wait until climbing to do anything about it. How many times in an XR have you hit the climb button TWICE only not to see the "E Climb" icon on the EICAS?

If you have ever flown a plane with a real FADEC, you will know what I am talking about.

Yeah, the ERJ has a few neat bells and whistles, but the FADEC light isn't exactly one of them. It's overly complicated and takes too much managment to be called that.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

Complicated in the fact that it can't do ANYTHING until you give it information. In flight, why can't it be like most every other airplane? You want cruise power, pull the levers back and let the FADEC do the rest. You want more power, push them up and let the FADEC do the rest.

Also, a go around is a total cluster with that thing. Push the levers up, make sure the PNF pushes the right buttons. If the detent is weak and you accidently go past it on the TO run, oh well. We'll have to wait until climbing to do anything about it. How many times in an XR have you hit the climb button TWICE only not to see the "E Climb" icon on the EICAS?

If you have ever flown a plane with a real FADEC, you will know what I am talking about.

Yeah, the ERJ has a few neat bells and whistles, but the FADEC light isn't exactly one of them. It's overly complicated and takes too much managment to be called that.

What ever happened to good old fashioned piloting? You want to go faster, push the thrust levers to the desired power setting. You want to slow down, set a fuel flow to achieve the desired speed. Is that too much for you guys or is it just that you want to b!tch about how much better your last airplane was than these things?