Crash in MN

[TwinTails]

They were less than 1/2 mile from the approach end of the runway, a little bit off course to the left.There wasn't much airplane left by the time any pictures were taken, really just a burning hole and a little section of the tail. It's a marshy pine forest area more than a mile to the nearest road. The crash sight looked fairly compact like a steep impact angle.

 

[Chunk]

Other data...

I heard 2 miles from the threshold of RWY 27...

Here's some other details, at least according to Fox News..

1. N41BE (King Air 100)
2. Crash occurred @ 1020 local
3. Aircraft in bad weather are controlled to the ground by ATC and this airport didn't have a tower....that may have been a factor.

Chunk

 

[Beavis]

Skeezer....

LOL!!! I have never laughed at a post before. Kudos to the "parody" on the media's sensationalism on any aviation topic!! Pilot error.....right?!?!?!?

Seriously, prayers and wishes to the families of our colleagues who are lost, doing the job we all do!!!

 

[Veronaut]

Reported by Gulfstream 200-

"At first it was reported that good old Teddy Kennedy was also onboard......"

I heard that Sen. Ted Kennedy was not only on board the aircraft at the time of the crash, but was the sole survivor & managed to escape the wreckage in order to get help, but didn't report the accident to authorities until many hours later...

'naut

 

[Chunk]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

That stings! I wonder how much longer ole' Teddy can escape the Kennedy curse. He must have lived this long through healthy living...

Chunk

 

[ShawnC]

Anyone else get the impression that this crash is the case of get-there-itis that the FAA is so careful to point out is one of the death traps of aviation.

 

[350DRIVER]

First, my thoughts and prayers go out to the family and friends. I would assume that the 200 did have one however not completely sure. The 350 as well as the C90B we operate BOTH have them not to mention others in the fleet that I have also flown. I don't think the older models came with them. The A90, E90, B100 & B300 in our fleet do not have them onboard.

I would hate to speculate to the cause of this crash however ICING can get one in trouble rather quickly not to mention other problems that it sounds like they had. The King Air fleet does well in icing conditions so this should be interesting when ALL facts come out.


another sad day in aviation.

3 5 0

 

[350DRIVER]

A 100 as reported by ABC News-
thought the "witness" accounts were somewhat interesting.
____________________________________________________
The pilots called the Eveleth-Virginia airport to get clearance for landing when they were about seven miles out and they reported no problems, said Gary Ulman, who was on duty at the airport at the time.

When the plane didn't land, Ulman said, he took off in a plane to search for it. He soon saw smoke.

"The wreckage was scattered and fully engulfed in flames," Ulman said. "Just looking at it, it would take a miracle to survive it."

Another pilot, Don Sipola, said visibility in the area at the time was 2 1/2 miles, well above the one-mile minimum for a standard instrument landing. He said the crash site was south of the normal approach path, so the plane must have deviated "for unknown and unexplained reasons
____________________________________________________


3 5 0

 

[s.o.sJTB]

Fox News is reporting that the fueler at the departure airport had a great grandfather of "Mid-eastern" descent.....

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

My capt. on today's (& yesterday's) trips was from MSP, and actually flew the A/C that crashed in one of his previous jobs. We dropped our cargo in MSP and were talking about it with the FBO employees. It is sad.

My wife says seeing stuff like this makes her not want all of our family to fly on a plane together. The media doesn't make our job any easier, that's for sure.

As soon as I heard about it, I automatically thought "non-precision approach-CFIT". I have been reading how the FAA wants to make all approaches with a glideslope. They want to used modern avionics to get rid of non-precision step-down procedures.

I heard an NTSB person on TV stating that the plane did have a CVR and it would be sent to DC for analysis.

Cliff
GRB

 

[Brother Francis]

I flew a 200 for 12 years. Dunno about a 100 model, however the 200 model has a limitation of 140 kias minimum airspeed in icing conditions. Below this speed, the AOA is such that ice will acrete on the bottom of the wing behind the area protected by the boot. The limitation was imposed as an AD following several accidents in which this phenomena was cited

Flew an ILS into BLF in freezing fog several years back. 140 till short final reference the limitation. Slowed to 100 over the fence. Inspection after landing revealed a thin coat of ice back to the spar from root to tip on the underside of the wings.

 

[TurboS7]

Maybe a deer hunter was sighting in his rifle and OOOPPPPSSS or maybe someone was ticked about aircraft flying over his land and he took a pot shot. There is always the chance that the airplane flew over a pot field, I guess that only happens in Tenn. Pesonally I stick with the freezing rain theory and a large buildup of ice on the under carriage and wing. I have seen clear ice(the only problem was I was in the airplane) slow and airplane down 40 kts. The biggest problem in the increased weight of the aircraft which increases the stall speed etc,etc. The aircraft may have a CVR but I doupt it has a flight recorder which would confirm all the theory's. Until then you'll be careful out there small aircraft kill people and that is a fact.

 

[Turbinehead]

Ever heard of this airplane?

http://www.aviationcharter.com/planes_chieftan.htm

NEw one to me.

 

[cvsfly]

I just got a laugh. Some new channel was interviewing a former NTSB chairperson. And they News guys said,"well when they find the CVR things will be more clear". The NTSB guy said well I doubt this aircraft had a CVR, and the news guy responded, " well yes It does I looked it up!"

Jacka$$. How many king airs have CVRs? Anyone know.

Multi-eng. turbine powered aircraft with 6 or more seats and for which 2 pilots are required by certification or operating rules must be equipped with a CVR according to 135.151. The requirements for KA are a trade-off. Obviously the KA doesn't require 2 pilot for certification. Most operators have Ops Sec A015 Auto-pilot in lieu of SIC. But if ever the autopilot becomes inop and the operator hasn't provided for SIC training and checking (having an SIC will also allow for some lower than std t/o min.), they are grounded for IFR. Many late model KA have option for CVRs if they are going to do 135.

 

[surplus1]

1 -- Does anyone know the official designator for the airport where this accident occured? K ???

2 --- is there a place on the web where you could find the JEPP apch charts for this airport? url please.

Thanks

 

[starchkr]

don't forget that tailplane icing could also adversely affect flight characteristics. I have no idea why when we talk about icing people ALWAYS think of only the wings becoming contaminated. Tailplane icing should be considered a more hazardous condition. The one thing to remember when your tailplane ices... the plane will react in the opposite direction as your pitch change corrections. For instance, as you pull back trying to get the plane to climb because you think the ice is causing a decrease in altitude, you are actually just forcing that nose further down. So now think of yourself pulling even harder as the nose comes further down.... and well you can figure the rest out from there.

 

[flx757]

1 -- Does anyone know the official designator for the airport where this accident occured? K ???

2 --- is there a place on the web where you could find the JEPP apch charts for this airport? url please.

Thanks

surplus,

The ICAO identifier for the Eveleth-Virginia airport is KEVM. I don't know of a site for JEPP plates, but there are a couple of links to the NOS charts posted on page one of this thread.

Hope this helps.

 

[surplus1]

Yes it does. Thanks a lot. I needed the identifier so I could struggle with the NOS charts.

 

[MetroSheriff]

Surplus1,

Here is the chart link:


http://edj.net/cgi-bin/echoplate.pl

 

[MetroSheriff]

According to the NTSB, the King Air was operated by Aviation Charter, Inc. of Eden Prarie, MN.

An NTSB search brought up the following previous accident by the same carrier:

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001208X09302&key=1


Any takers on how long before the buffoons at CNN dig this up and begin to try and draw parallels. It should be intriguing to watch.

 

[jetexas]

wow. that really points to icing up in my opinion.

I'm gonna wait and let Connie Chung tell me what happened ; )

 

[Chickenhawk]

AWWW...good to hear a bright statement from that A$$hole Mc Cain......Mr anti-aviation....

Are you seriously going to bash Sen. McCain? Is that all you have time to do after reading something on a bathroom wall?

 

[310]

mccain's campaign reform law is going to limit my and your free speech in regards to a candidate's position- within 60 days of an election- this is what i call taking pc to the ultimate stupid and illegal extreme. all in name of shutting up the conservatives- the media left can still do their spin under the new law- so I think mccain deserves some bashing.

 

[Chickenhawk]

That's the first time I've ever been called pc....bully yes...but never pc.

You guys are way too serious.

 

[Chickenhawk]

It's a supreme cop-out I know....but name one prez who has stayed in touch with his campaign mouthpiece. I am very proud to serve under our current CIC, but don't think I'm too blind to know that the current situation in the Mideast is easily exploited to ensure approval ratings stay in the upper half which helps elections nationwide, and secures posts in all of the Capitol Hill seats. The little bugs in the politician’s ears are trained as PR folks first and foremost, and it’s a Hollywood show at best. We can only hope they keep our interests at heart, taxes at attainable levels, and out of war as much as possible. The rest is smoke and mirrors, and too many people (a.k.a. Meet the Press) get totally engrossed to ensure the paycheck stays steady. Take McCain literally? Believe that the FAA (like the NRA…NAACP) could ever be privatized? Please.

My point, and sense of humor, feeds off the inevitability that pol’s will likely come up with something new to Pi$$ off more people…get more press…get more attention….get more votes. It’s a dirty system…one I went to college to become a part of. You can’t take it too seriously. Watching Sen. McCain try to straighten his arms reminds me everyday that he spent 5 ½ years in a prison protecting the rights that I trash everyday, and what he chooses to do politically is political. There’s a separation in what it takes to be a good person and citizen, and what it takes to win elections. There is no better voter that the pi$$ed off voter.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

A pilot supporting Mccain??
Its America, vote for whom you choose, I just wouldn't be too vocal about supporting good ole' Mccain around too many in aviation. Do your research, his crazy ideas would put many in this business out of work, corporate and airline.
Just cuz he sat in a POW camp he does not get my vote.....I would like to keep my job.!!!
Chickenhawk, just curious, what do you like about Mccain? Is it the military sevice you can relate to? I can surely understand that, it is honorable for sure. As far as your life and career as a pilot, what can he do?
not bashing at all - just curious..

 

[ksu_aviator]

Oh don't expect a rational explanation out of the gay-hawk (not a personal attack, just a simple attack on a college, which by the way does have the highest percentage of gay students so it really does apply). Just look at their prized basketball coach. He has never been seen with a women, and he even took the former football coach to a awards dinner. You draw the conclusion. Oh ya, don't forget that his favorite tie is pink.

 

[Chickenhawk]

Gstream 200....yes...military. I went through survival school learning how to implement some of the things that Mr. McCain himself used to stay alive. Undying admiration clouds my ability to see any use to the political vehicle. It never steers true, and smells. Don't want anyone to lose their job. And that I truly mean.

As for ksu_a$$pirate. How in the world can anyone from a purple school make fun of a gay color. I do applaud your attack on good ole Roy though. Takes guts to say something that would no doubt get you lynched. And I know you aggies know what a lynchin' is.....if I only had a spitoon. Sorry..misspelled faggies.

Know what you call a cute girl in Manhattan.....
.........A Tourist.

What does the average Kansas State player get on his SATs?
..........Drool.

What do you get when you put 32 KSU cheerleaders in one room?
..........A full set of teeth.

How do you get a Wildcat cheerleader into your dorm room?
..........Grease her hips and push.

Priceless.

Fly safe and laugh out loud.

 

[TurboS7]

Survival school is great but when it comes to torture I think that not having experienced it before makes it easier then if you have been through it before. The body hates pain and when it knows it is coming you do weird things.

 

[cl-65link]

Unfortunately Mr. McCain seems hell-bent to screw some of his former colleagues who are now major airline pilots. He has proposed a major-league baseball style arbitration system to settle airline labor disputes. This effectively takes away labor's last-ditch negotiating tool, the strike. Of course, he blamed United's woes of a couple of years ago on labor.