civil air patrol

[polysciguy9]

This may not be a concern for you, but I visited a CAP unit and attended a meeting in Florida. I was turned off by the religiousness of the unit. Since most of the youth members were sponsored by a church, I felt more like I was at a revival than a search and rescue operation. That and most of the senior members were pretty far on the conservative end of things. I imagine this is pretty common.

That aside, most CAP members I've ever known have turned out to be real tools. Proud of their uniforms, though.

 

[Swede]

I guess my experience (youth CAP) was totally different. We had a good bunch of guys, were proud of our uniforms, and had a lot of fun. It was slightly dorky, but no more than Boy Scouts - why go camping, learn to tie knots, or skin rabbits for an acorn stew, when you can learn to fly and hang out with pilots and their airplanes?

We had a WW2 B-24 pilot who came in and taught us naviagation and told some cool stories to boot. Only had one or two tools in a squadron of about 20, and they were effectively ignored, or mocked as necessary.

This is going to seem impossible or maybe ridiculous, but I directly credit my CAP experience with success in UPT and a career in USAF fighters. I'd say give it a try... it's not like you are enlisting. You can bail at any time.

 

[Icelandair]

Its a good program, especially for youths. Sure the uniforms are dorky, but like the scouts it teaches kids discipline and responsiblity. My children will probably end up joining it one day.

 

[LAXSaabdude]

I know a few years ago there was an ELT going off at a local airport and the CAP showed up looking for it. They narrowed it down to a Hawker, which belonged to a large fractional, that was sitting on the ramp for the night. Despite the objection of the line guys, the CAP members broke out the tool box and started opening random panels on the Hawker. Luckily a quick thinking line guy got the Maintenance Department for said fractional on the phone, which then proceded to chew some CAP ass and come back for seconds. The plane had to be put back together and inspected by a mechanic. These are all personal experiences, I am sure locations vary, but I say stay away.

Had a sort of similar situation (not quite as dramatic) a few years ago. I got called out to the airport from the hotel late one night, apparently the ELT had gone off when we had landed (not my leg ). I got out to the airplane to try to shut it off, and there is a CAP guy on site "supervising" the whole event. For some reason, the "Reset" switch wasn't operating.

I got on the phone to MOC to try to get some more ideas on how to shut the thing off, and they said that they would have to roadtrip MX out to the airplane. As I am having a rather detailed conversation with MOC, I mention that they may want to bring a new battery with them, as the ELT had been going off for a couple of hours now. As soon as I said that, the "Colonel" breathing down my neck interrupted my important conversation with - MY COMPANY - and shouted out over my voice "Oh, yeah, they DEFINITELY need to bring a battery up here!"

YMMV, but there definitely seems to be a little "irrational exuberance" from some of these guys.

LAXSaabdude.

 

[TR4A]

Most mission flying we do is fully funded by other agencies, such as USAF.

We are heavily supported by the USAF, and many of our activities are tasked to us by the USAF. When we are doing things tasked to us by the USAF, we have status as the auxiliary of the USAF.

The CAP is the USAF's Axillary. The CAP's money, aircraft come from the Air Force's budget.

 

[Icelandair]

One downside to the CAP adult program is that, like with all other volunteer organizations, theres a lot of the whole "all cheifs and no indians" syndrome. We had a guy once go up to a Lt. in the real air force and since he was a captain in CAP he demanded a salute. Another guy thought he knew everything about drill in the military because he drilled with axes in the fire department for parades.

 

[JCJ]

The CAP is the USAF's Axillary. The CAP's money, aircraft come from the Air Force's budget.

Well, sorta... Not to get too crazy about it, but there are things about CAP & its relationship with the USAF that are still hotly debated by the lawyers, even though the organization is over 60 years old.

There is federal legislation establishing CAP as a federally chartered non-profit corporation and other federal legislation establishing it as the auxiliary of the USAF. Wing and Region Commanders are actually corprorate officers of CAP (the corporation), as are several of the national staff.

Although we are the Auxiliary of the USAF, we are not a part of DOD and not a military service.

Most of what we actually do is in the capacity of the USAF Auxiliary, but we also have a lot of things we do (including some of our flying missions) as a Corporate (non-USAF Auxiliary) entity.

Our aircraft and other equipment are owned by the Corporation, but are provided to the Corporation through funding provided by the SECAF (another federal law specifically authorizes this arrangement). A substantial portion of our budget is from (or flows through) the USAF, but we also have a separate corporate budget and funding from sources other than the USAF.

Now maybe you understand why we have so many lawyers.

About the dorks, they drive us nuts too. They are in the minority and we try to keep them under control or steer them elsewhere. Unfortunately, they stick out like sore thumbs. As pointed out, this also varies alot with the locality.

The majority of us are just pilots or other people who want to do something we think is fun, and serves the community.

It's not for everyone, but for many of us it's great flying and alot of fun.

 

[RichardRambone]

I was a CAP cadet commander in High School and I loved my squadron in KC. I had some of the best times with other cadets there but mostly all of it was b/c we had a great squadron commander (senior member). After he left, the squadron fell apart and I bailed. CAP is a blast but yes there are lot of dorks, some cool people, some real leaders, and the occasional juvenile delenquient sent to us for discipline. I rarely if ever flew but we went on several "jerk made a hard landing, set off ELT" missions at 3 in the morning. Its a pay to play organization where yes there are a lot of people who want to play military but not join kind of dorks. I say go to a few meetings and get a feel for it. Again some great times were had in CAP.

 

[PC12Cowboy]

The unit is really good in norman , just go to the meeting and ask for tom eastman he was great in getting me involved in the squadron while I was TDY at Airman from California. Their 172 when
I was there was 15 dollars an hour dry and I used it to complete my long night X/c for commercial at 1/3 the cost that Airman wanted.
It is a good program and getting involved in the cadet side is very rewarding

 

[TR4A]

Well, sorta... Not to get too crazy about it, but there are things about CAP & its relationship with the USAF that are still hotly debated by the lawyers, even though the organization is over 60 years old.

I spent 12 years working with the CAP as a USAF Reserve Assistance Officer and Wing Reserve Coordinator in three wings. The vast majority of the CAP's funding comes from Congress through the AF's budget. FY2004 amount was $31.4 million. The CAP receives state funding also. Fy2004 was $2.8 million. When you are flying other missions for other agencies such as DEA and US Forest Service your flights are funded by them.

On July 1, 1946, President Truman established CAP as a federally chartered benevolent civilian corporation, and Congress passed Public Law 557 on May 26, 1948, which made CAP the auxiliary of the new U.S. Air Force.​

 

[JCJ]

I spent 12 years working with the CAP as a USAF Reserve Assistance Officer and Wing Reserve Coordinator in three wings. The vast majority of the CAP's funding comes from Congress through the AF's budget. FY2004 amount was $31.4 million. The CAP receives state funding also. Fy2004 was $2.8 million. When you are flying other missions for other agencies such as DEA and US Forest Service your flights are funded by them.

On July 1, 1946, President Truman established CAP as a federally chartered benevolent civilian corporation, and Congress passed Public Law 557 on May 26, 1948, which made CAP the auxiliary of the new U.S. Air Force.​

Agreed. The great majority of the budget is from the USAF, but there is also funding from some states and some private funding as well.

There have been some recent changes in funding

In the last year or two, some flights that used to be AFAM's now must be corporate missions. A legal determination was made that if the USAF was going to use their auxiliary (i.e. CAP) to do a mission, it had to be a mission that the USAF was itself allowed by statute to do.

So now some of the missions we do that are not permitted by statute to be done by the USAF, such as support to state & local EMA exclusive of a presidentially declared disaster or support to a local humanitarian agency, must be corporate missions. We can do them as "CAP the corporation", but not as "CAP the Air Force Auxiliary".

Also now days any support by CAP to any federal agency must be an AFAM and be routed through the USAF. Although DEA, FEMA, etc can use us they must task us through the AF, and not directly. Their payments still come from them to us, but now they have to filter through the AF reimbursement process.

(I'm presently a wing cv so most of this paperwork ends up going across my desk)

 

[KigAir]

Their 172 when
I was there was 15 dollars an hour dry and I used it to complete my long night X/c for commercial at 1/3 the cost that Airman wanted.

Do all CAP units rent their aircraft to members?

 

[JCJ]

Do all CAP units rent their aircraft to members?

If you are a member and are checked out in the aircraft, you can use the aircraft for personal proficiency flying at a pretty reasonable rate (usually $20 to $30/hr dry). It's not exactly the same as "renting" - there are a few more restrictions, but it is a good way to stay current and build time. We expect people who join to contribute to the overall program (not just to fly), but we also want our members to fly as much as they can to maintain their proficiency

 

[phantomdriver]

Can cap members go on military bases?

 

[Flyguy6]

I absolutely despise people that join CAP just to uild time. If thats your motivation, then please find some other way to do it. I joined CAP because I want to do something positive in my community. I enjoy doing search and rescue missions and I enjoyed mentoring to young people and teacing them leadership skills. I am in the "real" military also and yes ther eare similarities, and I am one of those people that enforces uniform standards and conduct mainly because if youar are going to be part of an organiation whether it be military , business whatever, you should abide by its rules. You represent more than yourself, so you cant just do what you want to do. thats like being a pilot and deciing Idont want toabide by the Class B airspace rule and fly into it just because Ican.

I require all my members to wear the military style uniform if they work around cadets. cadets have to wear it so if youwork with cdets, I think you should set the example. I cant critisize a cadet if I am not right myself. Like the other poster siad CAP isnt for everyone. SO, if you like working with and helping people then please joine. If you just want to build time. join a flying club.

The cadet prgram is nothing like the Boy Scouts. you can get your advanced licenses but you have to find a CAP CFI who would be willing to do it for free, which is very hard.

 

[phantomdriver]

flyguy6 you sound like a very unhappy camper. I was in the air force so please dont make that a factor that you were in the military because I really dont care i really care if people know if I was or was not in that military.

 

[Flyguy6]

I amsorry if I seem unhappy. It might b beacuse I am 8,000 miles away from my home fighting a war i didnt neccessarily ask for. And unlike the air force, I dont live in a nice air conditoned trailer and walk around camp in civvies. So please excuse me.

I just get a little irritated when people pass judgement or make statements they dont know anything about. I dont do that. It is very illogical too me. Thats all. Sorry to offend. I will stick my questions to avation related matters.

 

[JCJ]

Can cap members go on military bases?

CAP membership of it's own accord does not confer access to military bases. We are a civilian organization. If CAP members have a legitimite reason to be on a military base, and the Base Commander or designee approves, they are given access (just as any other civilian).

With that said, the USAF bases are strongly encouraged to support CAP and many CAP units and activities are located on USAF bases. A few are located on bases of other services.

 

[JCJ]

I absolutely despise people that join CAP just to uild time. If thats your motivation, then please find some other way to do it. I joined CAP because I want to do something positive in my community. I enjoy doing search and rescue missions and I enjoyed mentoring to young people and teacing them leadership skills. I am in the "real" military also and yes ther eare similarities, and I am one of those people that enforces uniform standards and conduct mainly because if youar are going to be part of an organiation whether it be military , business whatever, you should abide by its rules. You represent more than yourself, so you cant just do what you want to do. thats like being a pilot and deciing Idont want toabide by the Class B airspace rule and fly into it just because Ican.

I require all my members to wear the military style uniform if they work around cadets. cadets have to wear it so if youwork with cdets, I think you should set the example. I cant critisize a cadet if I am not right myself. Like the other poster siad CAP isnt for everyone. SO, if you like working with and helping people then please joine. If you just want to build time. join a flying club.

The cadet prgram is nothing like the Boy Scouts. you can get your advanced licenses but you have to find a CAP CFI who would be willing to do it for free, which is very hard.

I don't have a problem with folks to join, contribute to the program, and by the way take advantage of the opportunity to build some time at a good rate. But like Flyguy6, I think if you are just looking to build time, join a flying club.

It takes a lot of effort by our volunteers to keep our organization running, and if you join we will expect you to be a part of the entire team, not just show up to fly.

 

[MarineGrunt]

I amsorry if I seem unhappy. It might b beacuse I am 8,000 miles away from my home fighting a war i didnt neccessarily ask for.

Suck it up, baby. You chose to serve. You don't pick your wars.