Chautauqua TA vote

[Ivan Yankenoff]

Why I'm voting No!!!!!!!!

One payscale for all aircraft types for FO's.
Year 2 rates did increase a good share but are still 27% and 39% below Comair.

Year 3 and 4 FO rates only increased a little over 1% from the expired contract from over two years ago.

Only four years of rates listed for FO's. Was there any FO's negotiating?

You may ask why I'm picking out the FO rates when no one stays an FO long at this company and my answer is what happens if there is another attack, recession, depression? Do you think the company is going to give you higher pay rates at the end of your fourth year out of the goodness of their hearts?

Pay rates for Captain 60-78 averages about 15% below Comair and Horizon and this increases to 19% lower at the end of Comairs contract. Even in this environment there is no reason that Chautauqua can't be within 5%. A 10 year Captain is looking at a $6300/year difference at min. guarantee. That will make a very nice car payment.

Pay rates for Captain 50-59 averages about 7% below Comair and increases to 11% difference at the end of Comairs contract. Again there is no reason that the difference can't be so drastic.

Captain 79-99 pay rates. One word terrible. So they maybe higher than skywest or whoever but there is no way to rationalize someone flying a 90+ passenger aircraft with 15 years longevity and he/she isn't making 120.00/hour. FO's at ATA, Southwest, Midwest and AirTran make more than these Captain's rates, pitiful.

Per Diem $1.45, give me a break.

PBS, doesn't benifit 80% of the work group. Most people will see their schedules get worse. This also opens many holes for the company to screw you unless the union deals with this directly.

PDO's, many companies accrue sick leave at the rates this company accrues sick and vacation together. 16 days off after 5 years and this includes any sick time you may have. I know there is limited banking of these but this still sucks. This above all others must be changed.

Retirement/401(k) still substandard.

 

[Cracker]

Why don't you post these concerns on the CHQ Union Website?

 

[StarChecker]

Please help me understand how people can compare contract negotiations pre- and post- 9/11. I really don't understand how that can reasonably be done. Comparing what we have to what Comair got 2 years ago is unrealistic. If even half the things happen at CHQ that we're hearing are going to happen, we'll be far better off in terms of growth and upgrade.

 

[captjim]

Please help me understand how people can compare contract negotiations pre- and post- 9/11. I really don't understand how that can reasonably be done. Comparing what we have to what Comair got 2 years ago is unrealistic. If even half the things happen at CHQ that we're hearing are going to happen, we'll be far better off in terms of growth and upgrade.

I'm gonna get flaimed for this, but screw it. If you guys are gonna take Comair's, and ASA's flying atleast you can grow a pair and get paid for it. You guys sign off on this POS and you'll be in the same catagory as Mesa. Nuff said.

 

[embraerjetpilot]

You know, before Comair got their contract, we had one of the best contracts in the industry...hello can we say no junior manning... we still do in several ways... granted we needed some changes, some loopholes covered, and a scope claus..

Granted we dont have the highest pay...but quality of life is everything...

are there some things in this contract that i think arent perfect, yes... but for the most part I think our EC did an excellent job looking out for our interests, and if this is what they say is the best thing for us, then my vote is yes..

its called reality man...

 

[captjim]

capjim... where are you? its called reality man...

My location is dead in the middle of negotiations!

 

[C210drvr]

One question IVAN, Did you go to the road show?

 

[T-Gates]

Yeah but it looks like another TA where the F/O's take it in the shorts with pay.... That pisses me off....

Yes, we will all be captains eventually but why should the 1st and 2nd year F/O's get the shaft?

--T

 

[Ivan Yankenoff]

Please help me understand how people can compare contract negotiations pre- and post- 9/11. I really don't understand how that can reasonably be done. Comparing what we have to what Comair got 2 years ago is unrealistic. If even half the things happen at CHQ that we're hearing are going to happen, we'll be far better off in terms of growth and upgrade.

Why not? Doesn't CHQ spend 25% less per plane than Comair? Where does all that savings go because it definitly doesn't go for salaries and benifits. Don't give me this pre and post 9-11 bs.

All these if's, rumors and wishes. You know you can wish in one hand and sh*t in the other and they both will do you the same. I've been told enough lies from managements over the years to get me to sign off on this, that and the other thing that I'm conditioned to not take any worth in anything they say, especially when my compliance and approval is required. When you evaluate a TA you need to look at as if the company will remain as it is now forever or worse. Don't vote because of the rumors and if's that management leaks out. A good TA will stand on it's own merit, not hints of maybe if you vote for this and you are good this may happen. Vote for the proposal, not the rumors, because it is just that a proposal. If it is voted down changes will happen for the better. Managements goal is to get 51% to vote for it. If they get more than that then they overbid.

 

[I.P. Freley]

>>>Don't give me this pre and post 9-11 bs.<<<

Hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

Yeah, you're right, anyone who dares claim that what some were able to get pre-9/11, pre-recession, pre-mass layoffs is likely unobtainable now is slinging "bs".



Wake up, dude.

 

[Ivan Yankenoff]

One question IVAN, Did you go to the road show?

No, but what does that matter? I can read(not write) above a sixth grade level. When I get to the words that are too long, I have brother in law(labor lawyer)sound then out for me.

This is the third TA(different carriers) I have been able to vote on and the first I will vote against. I prefer not to go to the roadshow as to not to get involved in the unions sales pitch and rumors.

 

[blott]

Ivan,

Since you did not go to the road show, you missed out on alot of important info. Have you expressed your views on the ibt website, or read anything on there? There are reasons everything in the TA is like it is-the road show will fill you in on it. Call one of the EC guys, and tell them you're feelings, and listen to what they have to say.

Your ec guys are not in bed with management, and they didn't put out a BS TA (like alot of the other union guys did that you read here). They will NOT try to snowball you.

If you have done the above things, then vote no.

If not, stop running your suck-its an insult to our EC guys. Educate yourself as to why the TA is like it is, or ask somone who can explain it to you.

This is not a flame twards you. I felt the same way at first 'till I talked to the EC guys.

B

 

[blott]

captjim,

Same class as MESA, are you for real? Grow some balls?, our pilot group has the big hairy ones.

If I ever hear you say we laid down like MESA I will stomp the sh_t out of you...I consider that a personal attack.

B

 

[Ivan Yankenoff]

Since you did not go to the road show, you missed out on alot of important info

What, they can read better than me? If it's not in the contract then I don't want to hear about it. The negotiating team has a job of trying to sell their product. I choose to read the promotional material myself and make my own decision based on the written legally binding material. Plus I just hate it when they try to talk me into the undercoating.

If not, stop running your suck-its an insult to our EC guys

If they are insulted then they have some thin skin and probably shouldn't be working on a union committee, I know, I was the chairman of a committee at my last carrier until I was furloughed.

By my best guess this contract cost the company about 28% less than the Comair contract. Even post 9-11 that is a slap in the face. I would accept maybe 10-12% because of the so-called 9-11 factor. I just believe we gave in because of the furloughees pressure and many many carrots being dangled by management. Should have went into the 30 day cooling off period and the 11th hour to see if they were real.

Please furloughees don't jump down my throat. I've been there four times plus on strike once so I know all about the gov't cheese.

All this talk about how great the no JA clause. I'd give that up for a real per diem rate. I can ignore my phone with the best of them. Commuter clause? What did this cost us, a real sick leave and vacation? Hmm, seems to me that if I can't make it to work I can use some of that family medical leave act. There is always someone in every family who is sick, injured or insane and may need attention. Christ, I think my inlaws are all three at once sometimes.

 

[TWAER]

I didn't know it was Comair or ASA's flying. I was under the impression it was DELTA"S FLYING.