Can anyone understand "problems" with NWA's seniority list?

[clippyrip]

It potentially puts Delta pilots in position to take the DC9 furloughs, if that happens.

You mean the we over expanded in Europe furloughs.

 

[Fly4hire]

Actually I believe the arbitrators said something to the effect that all career expectations were off post 9/11, therefore those hired after 9/11 do not have the same expectations as those in the game before hand.

Regardless of how the list is constructed, I think it doubtful the arbitrators will agree to put 2007 DAL hires ahead of 1998 NWA hires, just because of the equipment they are on.

No bump/flush together with dynamic or freezes keeps everyone where they are, so there is no aircraft position windfall and minimizes training costs and waterfalls.

Treating different portions of the list differently allows them to reconcile the asymmetries in seniority that occur at one end or the other in other scenarios.

 

[~~~^~~~]

You mean the we over expanded in Europe furloughs.

Thus far, the re-deployment of those airplanes on longer routes means that staffing will remain static. On block hour basis, the change should be neutral. Delta's current Advance Entitlement has ~220 new 767 ER positions reflecting this re-allocation.

 

[~~~^~~~]

No bump/flush together with dynamic or freezes keeps everyone where they are, so there is no aircraft position windfall and minimizes training costs and waterfalls.

Treating different portions of the list differently allows them to reconcile the asymmetries in seniority that occur at one end or the other in other scenarios.

Perhaps.... Nobody wants to take anything from someone who survived the pain of furlough, but, the result is still one heck of a windfall

Using your example of a 1998 hire PRE / POST merger:

• Three to four years of longevity / Ten years longevity
• Line holding DC9B / Line holding MD88 Capt, or International FO
• Current Pay / ~ 40% raise - more with a position change
• Nothing / Equity Pay Out

Delta 2007 hire:

• Line holder on widebody international / displacement on list until eventual displacement off equipment as fleets shift
• Status Quo / 5% raise
• Relatively Safe at 10% on list / Furlough fodder
• Nothing / Equity Pay Out

Just observing these results are not status quo. Your idea of fences help, but there are limitations on what can be achieved under no bump / flush unless you furlough out of seniority.

 

[General Lee]

But that would go against Einstein's argument. I love how he's talking about a 7 to 5 ratio now with pullouts. Wouldn't this be less than what DAL asked for, which is the only "fair and rational" way to do an award.

Let the backpeddling begin.

I hope we get what we asked for initially. The excessive whining on your side though may have swayed Bloch to give you a nibble. DOH and full dynamic lists just sound crazy. Just giving a prediction, which I actually hope does not come true. We'll see. Say hello to all of your crashpad mates for me!

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[~~~^~~~]

General: Once they can bid Delta bases, we'll be crash pad buddies. Maybe they can tell us where the ones with good high speed internet connections and community beer are. I've never owned a rebel flag, but maybe a little reminder of the Confederacy would help us find the crash pad from the bus stop. The red Stars and Bars would be easy to spot against the backdrop of frozen tundra and rusty cars.

:beer:

 

[General Lee]

You mean the we over expanded in Europe furloughs.

Do you really think they would get rid of those flights entirely? They will reduce service, but not chop entire routes. Look at CAL, they have a lot more 757s to smaller European cities traffic wise with the US (we hit most of the big ones and a few smaller ones) than we do---like Belfast, Bristol, Birmingham, Hamburg, Cologne, etc. Those cities just don't have the US traffic to keep them full daily I would bet, especially in the Winter.

Hey, you would know this. How are the LaCrosse and Flint flights doing lately?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

General: Once they can bid Delta bases, we'll be crash pad buddies. Maybe they can tell us where the ones with good high speed internet connections and community beer are. I've never owned a rebel flag, but maybe a little reminder of the Confederacy would help us find the crash pad from the bus stop in the snow.

:beer:

I just don't think I will have to commute. I have enough seniority to stay in ATL I bet.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

But how can that be. DALPA OBVIOUSLY won every argument and the NWA case is sooooooo weak? What about all the growth opportunities for the NWA guys. Oh, that's right, DAL will be REDUCING capacity. (Damn, can't believe the NWA guys didn't fall for that)

All ribing aside, I would be prepared for a bit more than 1-2%. My $ is ratio top part, DOH middle, hybrid bottom, General Lee fired.

Me fired? For being Delta's biggest advocate? I heard RA wants to possibly make me information minister, ala Baghdad Bob. "No, I don't hear or see those Orange Barney 737s coming to ATL anytime soon...."

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[GogglesPisano]

Unless the Company breaks the flow down,

I didn't think the flow-down would be applicable if they furloughed next year due to the fact that no one from a feeder has "flowed up" yet.