CALEX negotiations take turn for worse

[MedFlyer]

I think the XJT guys have a good shot at getting Comair+X%. You've got a good amount of leverage since you account for 99% of CAL's feed. XJT is doing ok and CAL is weathering the storm decently, so there's no reason that XJT can't raise the bar.

ASA, on the otherhand, doesn't have half the leverage. ASA's only presence is ATL and DFW. In ATL, ASA is slowly getting overlapped mitigating much of the strike threat. If you subtract out the routes that CMR has taken over and the routes that ASA shares with DAL mainline, you'll see that ASA doesn't have that tight of a hold on ATL. An ASA strike would cripple DFW, but in all reality that does't matter. DFW doesn't make money for DL and losing it wouldn't be that big of a blow to the system.

Factor that in with DL's declining financials and pressure from DALPA and you've got yourself one tough road ahead for ASA.

 

[B1900DFO]

BigshotXJetdriver,

It's sad but that seems to be the general state of the industry these days. So many pilots are either out of work or hate their jobs and are actively looking for another career. It's about time somebody called BS and fought for a liveable wage that you can actually buy a home and live a decent life with. Who knows maybe you guys will have 50 seat captains making more than Mesa is going to pay their 737 guys. That would be real interesting.

 

[N813CA]

Hey as a pilot at Comair, make us proud. We have been waiting a long time now for a group to push this forward. We did it earlier. Lets keep it going. I can guarantee you will have the Comair pilots support.

 

[Ben Franklin]

When you dont get COmair plus 30 percent, I will just stand back and laugh..

And I will kick you in the nuts.


Sincerely,

B. Franklin

 

[Ben Franklin]

squah in the nuts.


Sincerely,


B. Franklin

 

[Stingman]

All of the above posts are exactly what I was referring to about the tough talk. You talk a good talk, now let's see you walk (of course only if that's what it takes to get a great contract). I hope you do accomplish the goal of considerably raising the bar, but we've all heard this before time and again.

 

[Dewey Oxberger]

We will do our best to raise the bar, you can be assured. Now if ASA can just drag their negotiations out long enough for us to finish, that should help their cause as well. My hat is off to you Comair guys for standing up to Delta and refusing concessions. Had you decided to whore yourselves out then you too could have gotten some shiny new jets last week. I'm just surprised that ASA got any at all. Not exactly proficient whipsaw strategy by Mother Delta, is it?

 

[Dewey Oxberger]

Why are we guaranteed to succeed where others have failed? First, whe are incredibly angry and unified. None of us expected to be FOs on an RJ for 5 years and we are so PO'd by management's games that many are ready to burn the house down. Still, that means nothing without the second reason, LEVERAGE. If we walk, CAL no longer serves Milwaukee, Charlotte, Louisville, Memphis, St. Louis, Palm Springs, Toronto, Montreal, and many smaller cities. XJT mgt. will not settle until told to by CAL. We are merely a shell corporation, and a strike by us would likely put CAL in Ch.11 in a matter of days. So when Gordo and Co. feel CAL's public image (best place to work, so our mgt. keeps telling us) is being tarnished too much by our soon to be unleashed PR blitz, only then will XJT come back to the table and pay the piper.

 

[Ben Franklin]

by our soon to be unleashed PR blitz,

Ok, I go to the company/union websites and stuff. Where do you get your information from? What PR blitz? ALPA hasn't done much, what makes you think that they are going to do anything at all?

OH, and I did read the article that went out in the IAH paper today. Is that a "blitz"? Maybe you can tell us who your inside source is so that we can all share in the information instead of 3 people knowing everything about our futures.


Sincerely,


B. Franklin

 

[Dewey Oxberger]

I believe the preparations were begun at the MEC meeting this week. It takes time to get the bilboards changed in Terminal B. Mgt. stabbed us in the back last week and i believe there will be no more Mr. nice guy from us!

 

[BigShotXJTdrvr]

Why are we guaranteed to succeed where others have failed? First, whe are incredibly angry and unified. None of us expected to be FOs on an RJ for 5 years and we are so PO'd by management's games that many are ready to burn the house down. Still, that means nothing without the second reason, LEVERAGE. If we walk, CAL no longer serves Milwaukee, Charlotte, Louisville, Memphis, St. Louis, Palm Springs, Toronto, Montreal, and many smaller cities. XJT mgt. will not settle until told to by CAL. We are merely a shell corporation, and a strike by us would likely put CAL in Ch.11 in a matter of days. So when Gordo and Co. feel CAL's public image (best place to work, so our mgt. keeps telling us) is being tarnished too much by our soon to be unleashed PR blitz, only then will XJT come back to the table and pay the piper.

Dewey, I agree we have a lot leverage at the moment, but CAL can put a 737 into most of those cities to maintain some kind of market share. They would take a bloodbath in losses to do it in most cases, but they can still fly where ever they want, and it wouldn't be struck work. They sold all the tickets. They're their routes. They can e-sub if they want to, and they will in the most lucrative markets. But their operation would look a lot like it did in the late 80's early 90's, and we all know how well that was working. Came close to bankruptcy #3. I think CAL must be trying to set some kind of record for Ch. 11 filings.

 

[vmc-hound]

Why are we guaranteed to succeed where others have failed? First, whe are incredibly angry and unified. None of us expected to be FOs on an RJ for 5 years and we are so PO'd by management's games that many are ready to burn the house down. Still, that means nothing without the second reason, LEVERAGE. If we walk, CAL no longer serves Milwaukee, Charlotte, Louisville, Memphis, St. Louis, Palm Springs, Toronto, Montreal, and many smaller cities. XJT mgt. will not settle until told to by CAL. We are merely a shell corporation, and a strike by us would likely put CAL in Ch.11 in a matter of days. So when Gordo and Co. feel CAL's public image (best place to work, so our mgt. keeps telling us) is being tarnished too much by our soon to be unleashed PR blitz, only then will XJT come back to the table and pay the piper.

amen brother....don't know about the shell corp though!!!

 

[vmc-hound]

one word for all.....REPO....

in theory and only theory ...Cal could repo all airplanes, training center gates etc and contract skywest to fly all the routes without skipping too much of a beat!!!that is the extreme but very possible...

 

[mckpickle]

First off you guys are assuming that that would not be struck work. Ask Mesaba. If CAL were to put anything other than what they already run before the strike it would be struck work and not be flown. Our MEC will see to that.

Second your assuming that CAL actually has the pilots to fly said routes. Even with the recalls they will be so short staffed they couldn't hope to cover the flying.

CAL can take back the a/c and training center but only after 90 days as per the CPA.

Lastly the pilots who are trained to fly the ERJ at CAL are at the bottom of the senoirity list. Not the super scabs hired in 83-85. Do you think the super scabs would fly an RJ? Heck their lucky they can fit their girth into a 737.

If this thing gets ugly CAL will not let XJT go on strike. We generate over 1 billion in revenue. They can not afford to loose that.

 

[DesertFalcon]

The beatings will continue til moral improves!

GREAT SIGNATURE LINE..... Unfortunately true with many organizations.

DesertFalcon

 

[Sam Fisher]

one word for all.....REPO....

in theory and only theory ...Cal could repo all airplanes, training center gates etc and contract skywest to fly all the routes without skipping too much of a beat!!!that is the extreme but very possible...

While you did admit that it was just theory, it was more like a fantasy for CAL management. That logistical nightmare that would occur while CAL attempted to do this would be insurmountable. The Training Center, by the way, is not "repo-able" by CAL, only the airplanes and gate space. Of course, if XJT were to lease out the Training Center, they could. Nonetheless, I really would enjoy watching CAL management even attempt to staff 250ish jets overnight. From "Coming To America," That would be something...

Sam

 

[mckpickle]

Sam

Actually as per the CPA CAL has access to the training center. Its right in the CPA. As I said above however, the a/c can be taken away but only after 90 days of labor unrest.

 

[145EXR]

they can have all the access they want to the training center, but all of our instructors/apds/checkairmen are unionized!

 

[Sam Fisher]

Sam

Actually as per the CPA CAL has access to the training center. Its right in the CPA. As I said above however, the a/c can be taken away but only after 90 days of labor unrest.

Mcpinky

You've seen the CPA? How did you gain access to it? CAL ALPA hasn't even seen the CPA!

Seriously though, CAL cannot "take back" the Training Center. It is still XJT's. If you read the following, quoted from the 10K, it says that CAL can only "take back" the aircraft, but XJT must provide the Training Center to CAL to train the scabs. To put all the rumors to bed, I've pasted the entire portion of this section of the 10K.

Sam

Labor Disruption. Upon the occurrence of a union-authorized labor strike, the capacity purchase agreement provides that:

•we will no longer have the right to be Continentals exclusive provider of regional jets in or out of its hub airports in New York/Newark, Houston and Cleveland, regardless of the length of the strike;

•we will be compensated only for the flights we complete, and will not be compensated for any controllable or uncontrollable cancellations regardless of our historical cancellation rates;

•on each of the 2nd, 15th, 30th, 45th, 60th and 75th days of the strike, Continental will be entitled to terminate our subleases for, and take immediate possession of, up to 20 of our aircraft that are covered by the capacity purchase agreement, to a maximum of 120 aircraft if the strike extends to the 75th day;

•we will be required to provide to Continental or its designee, for the duration of the strike and 180 days thereafter and at market rates, first-priority access to all of our flight simulators, hangars, training and other facilities and inventory to the extent necessary to enable Continental or its designee to operate any aircraft of which Continental takes possession as a result of the strike; and

•if the strike continues for 90 days or more, Continental is entitled to terminate the capacity purchase agreement for cause, cancel our subleases and take immediate possession of all of the aircraft covered by the capacity purchase agreement.

 

[mckpickle]

That is the CPA. Thanks for posting it. Sorry I was wrong on the 90 day thing. But as you can see they have ACCESS to the training center(ie sims). They cannot take it but they can use it.

One he1l of a document though isn't it. Oh well if they don't wanna pay guess the bank will own the training center.