CAL RFP's 70 Seaters (turboprops)

[Kaman]

Hey Cowboy,
Not sure if I know exactly who you are, but you obviously know me from CJC past. I am neither bashing nor cheering RJ carriers or turboprop carriers respectively. I am simply stating what current market forces and costs are driving the industry to.
On a personal level I do resent your making this personal by discussing my own career woes in a public forum. I have no idea why you would have done that unless you have an axde to grind with Colgan. I suggest that you take that somewhere else, because I certainly made no personal attacks or hurled any insults at a particular pilot group or airline.

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead

 

[Prop2Jet]

I am an advocate of Colgan! I think it would be great to c them get new or bigger airplanes. The market demands such a turboprop operation. It just makes sense. Ahhh the rise of turboprop again! Funny how this whole thing worked out....

 

[ScumBum]

Cape Air

I would think Cape Air is especially well suited to bid and receive the Newark flying. I think there was always the intent to start flying the ATRs in Guam for CO and then add service back here.

A while back I had heard they were approached by CO for Newark TP flying but hadn't heard anything in the past year.

They provide great service and although I don't work for them have heard lots of good stuff from those that do. Good company.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

I think it will be tough for any airline with the exception of possibly QX to field a fleet of 24 70 seat turboprops. I doubt Candair can get them out the door quickly enough without adversely impacting CRJ deliveries. ATR's could be a different story but they are more expensive to operate.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Dave - What you talkin' about?

The ATR goes slower, but burns 1/3 less gas than the zoomin Q400's. The Dash is built on a completely separate line than the RJ's. It's the Brit. / Irish side of Canadair - the De Havilland folks. I would bid either one if the schedules were decent. (No, not after your flying, I'm just saying if one showed up on the ramp it would be more fun than an RJ)

If the ATR's were built anywhere but France and had any product support - those plastic winged yellow, red and white bugged beasts would be ubiquitous.

At ASA we have to tell the French how the electrical system works. Turns out that Avions Transport de Regional is to Aerospatial as ASA is to a decent airline. As soon as the engineers can, the go get the better jobs - leaving no one that knows anything about the product.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Dave - What you talkin' about?

The ATR goes slower, but burns 1/3 less gas than the zoomin Q400's. The Dash is built on a completely separate line than the RJ's. It's the Brit. / Irish side of Canadair - the De Havilland folks. I would bid either one if the schedules were decent. (No, not after your flying, I'm just saying if one showed up on the ramp it would be more fun than an RJ)

Isn't the CASM for the Q-400 much lower due to the difference in speed? The breakeven load factor for QX is somewhere around 27 pax for those aircraft. I'd guess MX costs might be much higher on the ATR but I could be wrong. Frankly I don't care who gets that flying. If I wanted to live in EWR or HOU I'd apply with CO. You won't see me volunteering for anything more than 2 hours away from a west coast beach. Hope you guys get a shot at the flying.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

If the ATR's were built anywhere but France and had any product support - those plastic winged yellow, red and white bugged beasts would be ubiquitous.

At ASA we have to tell the French how the electrical system works. Turns out that Avions Transport de Regional is to Aerospatial as ASA is to a decent airline. As soon as the engineers can, the go get the better jobs - leaving no one that knows anything about the product.

Perhaps they should stick to what they know best? Wines and cheeses?

 

[~~~^~~~]

Flip, I dunno. Had lunch at the Sweetwater Brewery. That 420 is some supremely excellent stuff.

The maintenance on the ATR is nothing (if you don't have to order a part from France) - ASA was getting 15,500 hours between hot sections. The airplane is very simple to operate, it just does not fly like an airplane. Think of a dump truck with no power steering and a severely AFT CG and you will be close. Same engines as an E120 - twice the airplane - makes for cheap operations.

I hope we all, each and every one of us, gets to keep our flying and stops this cross bidding race for the bottom crap. I'm beating the drum to wrap up some decent scope language at ASA and tie up Skywest so at least we have a home in this family.

 

[beechcowboy]

Hey Cowboy,
Not sure if I know exactly who you are, but you obviously know me from CJC past. I am neither bashing nor cheering RJ carriers or turboprop carriers respectively. I am simply stating what current market forces and costs are driving the industry to.
On a personal level I do resent your making this personal by discussing my own career woes in a public forum. I have no idea why you would have done that unless you have an axde to grind with Colgan. I suggest that you take that somewhere else, because I certainly made no personal attacks or hurled any insults at a particular pilot group or airline.

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead

I know 2 pilots who have an axe to grind with Colgan; unfortunately they are not with us any longer. Here's to you Colgan mx, with your outdated, unrevised mx manuals and your malfunctioning elevator trim! Drink one for our departed friends who paid the price for your mistakes. Colgan with 70 seats = more mx problems and more NTSB paperwork. Based on how they run their biz, treat their employees, and the quality of their training, I hope they never see more a/c. Low cost does not equal better in their case.

Southwest runs a low cost airline b/c they run efficiently w/ timely hedges, Colgan runs a low cost airline b/c they cut corners and pay low wages. As to your personal background, I just find it hippocritical that you can be such an advocate for Colgan "the super t-prop" operator, when you were once so negative on them and bailed.... only to come back. Nuff said. You could never convince me that Colgan deserves to win any more flying, much less for CAL.

 

[Icelandair]

The Q400 is quiter than most jets. It's one of the reasons why QX has done so well

Depends where you sit. If you sit right next to the engines they are quite loud, but if you sit in the back row they are surprisingly quiet.

 

[bender]

and your malfunctioning elevator trim! Drink one for our departed friends who paid the price for your mistakes.

Tragic mx mistake but could it not have been prevented by a simple trim test?

 

[Kaman]

Bravo Lima,
First of all I am not a Colgan cheerleader by any means, and "deserving" a contract has nothing to do with running a business or managing an airline. I don't think that I was any more or less annoyed with Colgan work rules or the lack thereof than anyone else. I left for reasons other than "b****ing" about Colgan every frickin day in IAD. Again, I am royally pissed at your taking my original post out of context as some kind of an attack on RJ airlines becase I have some personal axe to grind. I most certainly don't and what I said is true.
Given the circumstances that you left, I find it amazing that you can call me a Hypocrite (Don't they teach you to spell at VT? or did you hang out with another top-performer JP too much in Hannover? Yes, I know exactly who your sorry-ass is...) You are no less arogant on-line than you were in person. I was a straight-shooter with you and you screwed me on the way out the door...Worrying more about your sorry paycheck than having the integrity to give a two-week notice...You are a LOW-LIFE Coward in every sense of the word...You best hope I don't see you walking a terminal. Because I guarantee I'll knock you on your A**.

 

[ackattacker]

Tragic mx mistake but could it not have been prevented by a simple trim test?

Engage brain before opening mouth. You have no idea what you're talking about, STFU.

 

[pinoyatc]

Cape Air
I would think Cape Air is especially well suited to bid and receive the Newark flying. I think there was always the intent to start flying the ATRs in Guam for CO and then add service back here.

A while back I had heard they were approached by CO for Newark TP flying but hadn't heard anything in the past year.

I heard that we are thinking about it using new ATR 72, starting in three years. There is also a rumor that we are going to shut down Rota, and bring one of the Guam ATRs state-side. However, we need to start working on a 121 domestic certificate if we are going to do any ATR flying here.

 

[ackattacker]

I heard that we are thinking about it using new ATR 72, starting in three years. There is also a rumor that we are going to shut down Rota, and bring one of the Guam ATRs state-side. However, we need to start working on a 121 domestic certificate if we are going to do any ATR flying here.

I wouldn't put much stock in the Rota rumor, unless you heard it straight from LG or DW. Continental is not going to abandon that market and they're not going to put a 737 into there.

 

[ackattacker]

Looks like I was wrong. It's official, Cape Air to drop service to Rota in October.

 

[dardar]

doesn't EWR have some rule that prohibits any new turbo-prop flying?

eh, if they do, i'm sure it'll change with oil prices.

 

[flyer172r]

Depends where you sit. If you sit right next to the engines they are quite loud, but if you sit in the back row they are surprisingly quiet.

You can say that about any airplane.