Boeing 727 Memories

[NYRANGERS]

I had a blast as an engineer on the 727. I got along with the crews, and most of the time all three of us would go get a bite to eat or drink. F/A's rarely overnighted with us.

I didn't mind the duties, although I must admit I would have loved to fly the plane.

I only wish I was back pre-flighting at 5am in the cold rain with a newly acuired oil stain from #2.

"Start the trio for Leo"

NYR furloughed 510 days and counting.

 

[Huck]

Gotta admit, General Lee, you crack me up. After a bad day I probably would write the same things. Why the hell can't the f/o operate the anti-ice? I'm back there, closing the pack doors with one hand, setting climb thrust with the other, and he jacks his fat head around and says, "I said anti-ice open!" What, you mean right there above your bucket-head?

But the old girl is freaking bulletproof. An MEL is so rare we have to pull out the FOM to make sure we do it right. And humming along at .85, jet right on the tail, earplugs + ANC headsets, screaming at each other as we pass all the aluminum speedbumps, is a kick.

Get a copy of Hunter Thompson's "Fear and Loathing on the Campaign Trail '72." He got high on acid and rode the jumpseat of a UAL charter 727 on Nixon's campaign. He called the takeoff acceleration "riding God's own motorcycle."

My father first sat in this seat in 1968 at NWA. My uncle sat in it at UAL in the eighties. Its a family tradition, man.

 

[Extra300S]

Hey General!

Wow take it easy! Doesn't take much to get you going huh?

Never was a Zoomie, sorry! Wasn't smart enough for the CO. Springs.

All I can say is:

The 727 MAKES noise, Burns lot's of GAS, and picks up chicks!"

I was HONORED to fly it. Sorry about all the F/O's that probably hit you with the shoulder straps! Why so much anger?

Now if you want to talk about the Jetstream 31....hey that's a different story!

DID you forget where I said I also PLUMBED it?

Chill brother Chill...

 

[General Lee]

Randy,

Yeah, I'm sorry---it has been a bad day watching all of the Delta news. And, I really never did like that 727, primarily because of the harsh training. I thought the 737-800 and 757/767 type was a lot easier. I guess I got a lot of "bad" FO's in a row, and it left a bad taste in my mouth. I think it was the training that made it bad for me. Maybe it was one too many Capt's telling me to start two and three when we were only second in line for takeoff. I don't know. Anyways.... Sorry.

Bye Bye--General lee

 

[MD80DRVR]

Flew one of the last TWA revenue trips on the 727. At the end of the day we ferried "the pig" over to MCI. Will never forget doing high speed low approaches over in MCI and hearing SWA ask the tower, " Have those TWA guys lost their minds". What a blast!!
What a great airplane! I'm so happy I got to fly it.

 

[AlbieF15]

I'm with General Lee.

I cannot possibly fathom why some guys relish the FE job. I have done CFI work, flipped burgers, growth burley tobacco, raised cattle, done photography, and worked as a retail clerk...all prior to flying for the AF. Some of the work was gritty hard work, but some of it was a lot of fun. Being an FE reminds me a lot more of some of the "drudge" work I did before and during college...not the flying I have gotten to do since. I do not relish the "brain dead" time, as boredom is the one thing I hate most about this job. I think competition with the captain on landings looks like a blast...and maybe if I ever FLY this old jet I'll develop some affection for it...but until then its just a job.

Plumbing this piece of FOD isn't the only bad part--its jumping through your @ss at every preflight then having an FO slide his seat so far aft you cannot open the non-pilot desk of shame and ask you for a sani-wipe, a bottle of water, or some other nonsense just as your world is exploding in paperwork queep. (This usually immediately follows his dumping the weather and other paperwork on top of a weight and balance sheet you were just working up...) For you FOs out there...if an FE hasn't ALREADY gotten you a bottle of water and given you a sani-wipe so you can disinfect the seat from the last lazy piece of crap FO, its only because there must have been some mitagating factor that has gotten him behind. Usually, its a mx issue that you have to troubleshoot, but it can also be some other issue with the ramp, etc. And no...I really don't need your ideas or techniques that you picked up during your 7 month tenure on the panel prior to your upgrade.

The only thing that keeps a smile on my face during the job is the fact better things await once enough guys move on. Good or bad, seniority is how things work in the airlines, and we all know lots of guys who've had it much worse than any of us. All of us in the back 5% at FedEx are greatful to have jobs with a great company, so we keep smiling and charging on, especially when our friends who 2 years ago were flying the 757 are now furloughed. However, when I see a row of 727s in the desert parked, I don't feel sad...I see a guy who now doesn't twist his back sitting sideways in an ergonomic nightmare who is hopefully off learning an FMS somewhere.

Rock on General Lee. Here's hoping maybe ONE day I can fly too, even if it is after I've done the walk around.

 

[VMA214]

My favorite expression about the 72:

"I've got 2500 hundred hours in the 72, two thousand of 'em are climbing"

I've actually got just shy of 3000 hours in the 72 in both the window seats and agree with the majority here that it is a great airplane and the last airliner truly made to be hand flown. It was built like a brick $hithouse!!

 

[mobs]

Do not know where you guys are flying,but I flew the 72 for 11 years before going to the 76 and then the A 330. As capt. I still did every third walk around(even in the rain)because I wanted to. If we had an empty leg the FE flew it. Always picked up the first round on a layover,ate the chicken,chased the oldest FA. Still do all the plotting for my leg over the pond and take the last room when we check in the hotel,that is the way I was taught. Mobs

 

[AlbieF15]

My post was likely a bit harsh....realizing I won't be upgrading for a long while is frustrating...

That aside...95% of the bros I've flown with have been great. And yes...I've had more than a few beers and quite a few dinners on some generous captains and even FOs.

Another bro of mine at Delta is likely going to be in these lastest cuts. Perhaps what I meant to say was "can I get anyone another water" and "who's ready for dinner?".

 

[steveg]

The Pigship,

Never have I hated and loved an airplane so much! I learned more in my 6 months with Piggy, than in any airplane before or since. FE school was a bitch. But sittin' in the back and switchin' and observing was a great way to be intro'd to the airlines. Lost the same engine twice in one day, for two different reasons! Dumped gas all over STL (the advertised dump rates are NOT correct!!!). But I learned how to handle an Emergency. Screwed up pretty much every list on it, but piggy was very forgiving. In short, although it wasn't all good, I wouldn't be half the pilot and team player I am today without her.

Steve

 

[de727ups]

The 727

The 727

You guys are soooo like it's the ex-727. I flew one today and gotta do it again on Monday.

It's no big deal....I don't know nothin' different. I flew Convair's before the back seat of a 72 and now I'm a lowly right seater on it. When I was in the back seat, it would piss me off when the pilots would walk right past the ice chest and sani wipes and then ask meeeeee to get them a water or wipey for them....as a front seater, I never do that. I've had a few F/E's scream at me for sliding my seat back too far, too fast, and nailing their knees...sorry guys...and I don't mind doing the engine heat.....

Personally....I'm looking at the right or left seat in a 757 for my next move. I'm pretty computer literate but must say, I'm a bit intimidated by the prospect of flying a computer rather than flying an airplane like I do now....

Any advice from those who have gone from real airplanes to the new, modern, flying machines....

 

[Huck]

Albie: love you man. I guess you're like me - you just found out you were closer to the MD11 in June '02 than you are now. Like you said, at least it ain't Home Depot. Give yourself a fuel imbalance every once and a while during cruise - it fights the boredom. p.s. Auburn in the sweet 16, baby!

Mobs - I got a good story for you. When I started IOE I was assigned an instructor that was the exact opposite of me - an ex-Marine F-18/Navy F-14 dude who was a former sniper. Great, I thought - a single seat nightmare.

In the week we flew together, not only was he a great instructor, but I couldn't buy a meal or a drink, and he did all the nasty walkarounds for me. A true gentleman, and now a good friend. The help you give your crew will (hopefully) be returned 10 fold. "If you would lead, you must first serve...."

 

[boeingav8r]

Why Not Be Happy To Be There?

Seems like most of the people bitching in this thread are the pilots who sit in the FE seat. I personally come from very humble upbringing. My father taught me alot about aviation and how airlines work. He is a 30,000 hour airline captain and I can remember him telling me when I started my first gound school with an airline to keep a positive, humble attitude and just "be happy to be there". "Cooperate and Graduate" he would say. Seems like in every initial ground school, you have the outspoken guy with all the "what if" scenereos. Don't bother trying to tell him anything, because he is the class know-it-all. These guys seem to be the same one's who bitch about being a flight engineer and how unfair it is that they're at the panel because they were hired as pilots. Few things in this world are permanent. The only Constant is Change. We all know how fast things change in this industry. These pilots who are bitching about sitting sideways in the 727 need to remember that sometimes you have to do things you don't like for awhile. We all know that the airlines use the seniority system, and even though things are slow right now, you WILL upgrade. At my airline, almost every engineer got the opportunity to upgrade to fo. It's funny because a few of the one's who constantly complained while they were fe's were the same ones who didn't pass their upgrade training. Imagine that...like I said above, attitude is everything.

I think that for the most part, pilots make poor flight engineers. When I was a 727 fo, some of my engineers were pilots and some were PFE's. PFE's for the most part do not care about piloting. Oftentimes they are ex military. They pride themselves on doing a good job at the panel. They usually know more about systems than the captains do. I've never had a PFE give me a dirty look if I ask for a bottle of water during cruise. (I'd get it myself, had it not been because the water supply is within direct reach of the FE desk). Alot of pilots, on the other hand, are poor engineers because they are just going through the motions. They are oftentimes bitter towards the pilots, especially the fo's because they want to be in the pilot seat. Some of them think they are "too good" to being doing what they consider mundane engineer duties.

I know of many furloughed pilots who would gladly take the place of a whiny flight engineer. If things are sooooo bad sitting sideways, why not just quit and give a more appreciative pilot a chance to perform fe duties and provide for his family. That reminds me of one of my favorite airline jokes:

What's the difference between a flight engineer and a 727 engine? The 727 engine stops whining after landing.

 

[acarpe3448]

I dont have a single bad thing to say about the 727. While I only did 8 months on the panel, it was incredable. I remember sitting back there with the biggest smile on my face ever!! I sat there thinking about flying this great ship, working for the best airline in the world, and having 100% Total Job Satisfaction until Contract 2000 changed the reserve system (I loved those two call up windows). Some of the memories I have:

OHIO - O2, Hyd Brake Pressure, Interconnect, Oil Qty
PGA - 5
Autopack Trip when the Capt Forgot and pulled back on Climbout
Shutting down the APU and then realizing #3 was not started
Making Company calls over the PA
Balancing Fuel-keep your eye on it!
"Protect Essential"
The DFW Switch - I remember the first time I got in an aircraft where someone had messed with the DFW switch. I thaught I would never get the temperature right! I burned them up in the back.
*Seems like the wildest overnights I had was always with the 727 crews.
The hardest ground school I have ever been through
Like drinking from a fire hose
Limitations test on first day of ground school
**The thing I remeber the most about the 727 was having the best 727 ground school instructor in the world. This guy knew every nut and bolt on the plane. He retired Delta right after our class. I consider myself Blessed to have learned from him.

 

[pylut]

One of my best flying jobs was right seat in the 727. I do remember being told this by a captain when I checked out as f/e.

There are 4 seats that face sideways on the 727 and 3 of them are toilets.

The 727 rocked
aa sucks