Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Best Positioned Fractional

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

FastJP4

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Posts
1,371
With the stock market taking a dump, the financial industry, housing industry, fuel costs through the roof etc. etc. etc. all looking bad with seemingly no end in sight - I am curious as to whom you think is the best positioned Fractional to ride this out. And more importantly - WHY you think that particular Fractional is better positioned.

This is NOT meant to be a pom-pom toting thread, or a slam on any fractional - just an educational thread if that is possible on this site.
 
I would guess NetJets would be best positioned since it is the biggest and owned by Berkshire Hathaway. It's been managed fairly well and has current labor peace, but most importantly it has the deepest pockets and can bleed the longest if that's what must happen.
 
Avantair flies Piaggio Avanti aircraft.

The aircraft flies just under 500 miles on around 80 gallons of Jet A in one hour.

It has a stand up cabin and is very quiet.

Movie stars, bankers and oil execs love it.

I work there now and even turned down a NetJet interview. I have certainly put my money where my mouth is so to speak.

This is my opinion and I endorse this post.
 
I would guess NetJets would be best positioned since it is the biggest and owned by Berkshire Hathaway. It's been managed fairly well and has current labor peace, but most importantly it has the deepest pockets and can bleed the longest if that's what must happen.


At first I thought NJ as well. But when things are tough in any business - sometimes the biggest is not always the best. More aircraft to pay for, more salaries & benny's to pay for and more overall overhead.

If live flights were down 10% across the board - the biggest will have the largest hit to cash flow. (I realize the frac model has monthly mngmt fee's and other sources of revenue, but you get my drift)

Berkshire is definately a good placed to be backed by - but Bombardier is also no small potato.

Dunno the answer. Curious for different and objective opinions.
 
good post.....the advantage that NJ has IS cash flow. All they really do is just deposit checks every week. Tha amount of currency they TRY to hide would blow your mind. Why else you think it cost $25,000 for a Ultra type rating fom FSI?
 
NJ is to Merrill Lynch as Flops is to ING

Merrill Lynch and Lehman Bros are the best positioned...all they do is rake in the dough....


....oh...wait.... :erm:
 
Actually, they are all pretty well positioned. That said Netjets, Citation Shares, Flex have been and will still be the best positioned. They all have the same but slightly differing business models, they all play with the most wealthy (not the almost wealthy that the some of the prop folks play with) folks worth more thn 50 Million each do not care about an extra 1-2K in fuel for the flight.

The market is on a roller coaster at the moment. This is a short term hiccup, as we have seen so many times. The folks who buy the fraction have the money to sit this out and just wait. The way the contracts are written the frac's are better off not flying at all. In-fact we joke that pilots should be paid a screw off bonus (the more we screw off and not fly the more money the company makes)

Also as the market turns down a bit and the TSA continues it's assult on the "regular" folks the industry is seeing a resurgance of "135" Marquis, vector type cards instead of a whole fractional share. This opens the door to keep the planes flying with a whole "new" clientel that when the money begins to flow more smoothly again will create more "new" owners.

Lastly the emergance of Managed aircraft into the mix is a great opportunity to tap into a market left alone....the one where the folks already own A/C but can now not worry about a flight department, hanger space, insurance and when they feel likeit make a return on the A/C by sub-leasing it back to the fractional company.

As I said the industry is pretty well positioned! I'm glad I'm not fighting this in the airlines any longer.

(The above post is very subjective and just the opinion of the author. Who if anyone knows him will attest is an idiot)
 
Actually, they are all pretty well positioned. That said Netjets, Citation Shares, Flex have been and will still be the best positioned. They all have the same but slightly differing business models, they all play with the most wealthy (not the almost wealthy that the some of the prop folks play with) folks worth more thn 50 Million each do not care about an extra 1-2K in fuel for the flight.

The market is on a roller coaster at the moment. This is a short term hiccup, as we have seen so many times. The folks who buy the fraction have the money to sit this out and just wait. The way the contracts are written the frac's are better off not flying at all. In-fact we joke that pilots should be paid a screw off bonus (the more we screw off and not fly the more money the company makes)

Also as the market turns down a bit and the TSA continues it's assult on the "regular" folks the industry is seeing a resurgance of "135" Marquis, vector type cards instead of a whole fractional share. This opens the door to keep the planes flying with a whole "new" clientel that when the money begins to flow more smoothly again will create more "new" owners.

Lastly the emergance of Managed aircraft into the mix is a great opportunity to tap into a market left alone....the one where the folks already own A/C but can now not worry about a flight department, hanger space, insurance and when they feel likeit make a return on the A/C by sub-leasing it back to the fractional company.

As I said the industry is pretty well positioned! I'm glad I'm not fighting this in the airlines any longer.

(The above post is very subjective and just the opinion of the author. Who if anyone knows him will attest is an idiot)
 
I have nothing to add to this post except to say it's been a while since I've seen someone post a thoughtfull question and recieve so many good responses. God it's good to be out of the airlines.
 

Latest resources

Back
Top