Aviation Week & Space Tech. article on TWA.

[Captain Overs]

......still doesn't matter.....

 

[aa73]

aa73--Good post. Thank you.

TWA had its bad period during the late 60's and early '70's. Lot's of young Captains and junior crews from the large expansion.

The thing about AA that was disconcerting to most of us was how long it took management to realize there was a problem with both safety and effeciency. After busting our butts to squeeze every dollar from our operation (only to have Icahn get $.55 of it) AA's proceedures seemed to have been developed to be as ineffecient as possible. Excessive powerbacks, running the apu instead of plugging in electrical and air (TWA rampers never seemed to be able to accomplish that without prodding, either.) and not doing single engine taxi's.

On the safety side, there didn't seem to be an awareness in management or training that there was a problem. Now, they are changing proceedures to eliminate "heads down time" on the ground and emphasizing "flying the airplane first" in the cockpit. They've got a nice little program they are running in recurrent that has a slide show of all the accidents and the cause over the past 15 years with no commentary--kind of sobering. But it's effective. Many AA pilots comment afterwards that they had no idea that things were that bad.

I'm sure things will turn around just like they did at all the other carriers that experienced such a string.TC

TC - Believe, me, I had a similar reaction when I watched the video during my last R9 - with the exception that I did know how bad it was here. I thought the video was a good idea in sobering everybody up.

AA's cockpit procedures are lacking in one big area - CRM. It is still very much a captain's airline, where the FO is only expected to fly on his/her legs and work the radios when not flying. AA FOs do not really participate in the decsion-making process as much as other airlines. Therefore, when said FO upgrades to captain, it is all very new.

Now compare this to a United or Delta FO, who's been trained since day 1 in making PAs, pulling paperwork, etc. They are much better prepared when upgrade comes.

These changes are slow in coming, especially since we are dealing with a lot of fragile egos over at AA. Don't ask me why the egos are fragile here - mine definitely isn't. Must be a culture thing, I don't know. But I do know that the culture is s-l-o-w-l-y changing, thanks in part to the TWA input as well as our flight dep't finally realizing that NO WE ARE NOT INVINCIBLE! (duh.)

There are still a lot of ridiculous procedures going on - Why does the captain have to seat the F/As on the taxi out, messing with the PA when he/she is supposed to conentrate on taxiing? Why is only the captain allowed to hit the sterile button through 10,000, even when he/she is the PF? Why does the captain make all the T/O briefs, even if it's the FOs leg? Why does the captain fly the a/c during a Cat 3 autoland when he/she is supposed to be looking outside for visual cues at 50ft? These are some of the things I'm talking about when mentioning a "captain's airline."

Anyways, I'm glad they are finally becoming receptive to improving the procedures. With the addition of FOQA coming up, I think this will be a great step up in our safety record.

Regards,
73

 

[Spooky 1]

visual cues?

TC - Believe, me, I had a similar reaction when I watched the video during my last R9 - with the exception that I did know how bad it was here. I thought the video was a good idea in sobering everybody up.

AA's cockpit procedures are lacking in one big area - CRM. It is still very much a captain's airline, where the FO is only expected to fly on his/her legs and work the radios when not flying. AA FOs do not really participate in the decsion-making process as much as other airlines. Therefore, when said FO upgrades to captain, it is all very new.

Now compare this to a United or Delta FO, who's been trained since day 1 in making PAs, pulling paperwork, etc. They are much better prepared when upgrade comes.

These changes are slow in coming, especially since we are dealing with a lot of fragile egos over at AA. Don't ask me why the egos are fragile here - mine definitely isn't. Must be a culture thing, I don't know. But I do know that the culture is s-l-o-w-l-y changing, thanks in part to the TWA input as well as our flight dep't finally realizing that NO WE ARE NOT INVINCIBLE! (duh.)

There are still a lot of ridiculous procedures going on - Why does the captain have to seat the F/As on the taxi out, messing with the PA when he/she is supposed to conentrate on taxiing? Why is only the captain allowed to hit the sterile button through 10,000, even when he/she is the PF? Why does the captain make all the T/O briefs, even if it's the FOs leg? Why does the captain fly the a/c during a Cat 3 autoland when he/she is supposed to be looking outside for visual cues at 50ft? These are some of the things I'm talking about when mentioning a "captain's airline."

Anyways, I'm glad they are finally becoming receptive to improving the procedures. With the addition of FOQA coming up, I think this will be a great step up in our safety record.

Regards,
73

Believe me I am not banging on AA but I think when CATlll procedures are in effect the pilots are not looking outside for visual cues but rather monitoring the FMA's RA's etc. for proper information. You do not have to see the runway to land on CATlllB that why its called an Alert Height. Having said all of that if you are a B737-800 guy/gal with a HUD, then maybe it's different. I think that may be limited to CATlllA, where one would have to control the roll out.

 

[rudderdog]

I sure hope they get rid of the First Officer requirement to say, "F/A's prepare for arrival and crosscheck" just as the aircraft is coming to a stop when you are closer than ever to ground equipment, jetways and people. I always thought this was a huge distraction as I was use to concentrating on clearing the area and briefly crosschecking the flaps, radar and brake pressure during this critical time as well as being ready to back up the Captain on the brakes. It is an absolutely unnessary procedure. What's wrong with just using the freakin seat belt sign? Ding!!! Hello.....We're here.....Flight Attendants, do your thang.

Everyone else does it.

 

[aa73]

Believe me I am not banging on AA but I think when CATlll procedures are in effect the pilots are not looking outside for visual cues but rather monitoring the FMA's RA's etc. for proper information. You do not have to see the runway to land on CATlllB that why its called an Alert Height. Having said all of that if you are a B737-800 guy/gal with a HUD, then maybe it's different. I think that may be limited to CATlllA, where one would have to control the roll out.

Spooky,

The MD80 is only Cat3A... and when approaching 50 ft someone is most definitely looking outside. In AAs case it is the captain. The F/O stays inside the whole time. If the captain hasn't said "Landing" by the time the "Fifty" callout happens it is a go-around. The F/O is busy watching the centerline indication as if his life depends on it.

Since the F/O stays inside the whole time, I believe it makes more sense for the F/O to "fly" the whole approach - and in fact we used to do it that way. Then at 50 ft the captain took over if he saw the runway. They changed it about two years ago.

Now the captain flies the whole thing while at the same time looking outside when approaching 50 ft. Too much work IMHO.

73

 

[aa73]

P.S. The rollout is also done on autopilot, all we have to do is throw out the buckets. We usually disengage the A/P around 60kts.

 

[aa73]

I sure hope they get rid of the First Officer requirement to say, "F/A's prepare for arrival and crosscheck" just as the aircraft is coming to a stop when you are closer than ever to ground equipment, jetways and people. I always thought this was a huge distraction as I was use to concentrating on clearing the area and briefly crosschecking the flaps, radar and brake pressure during this critical time as well as being ready to back up the Captain on the brakes. It is an absolutely unnessary procedure. What's wrong with just using the freakin seat belt sign? Ding!!! Hello.....We're here.....Flight Attendants, do your thang.

Everyone else does it.

Rudderdog,

Well they are making progress. Now we are only supposed to make that absurd announcement AFTER the a/c comes to a stop.

I agree, at every other airline the F/As make this PA. Sigh.... leave it to AA to do it differently.

73