Asiana 777 crashed on landing at SFO

[UnableDirect]

Wrecked up like a duschion, like a stranger in the night.

wow. I never knew the real lyrics til now!!!!

 

[gutshotdraw]

Actually, the lyric is "Blinded by the light, revved up like a deuce, another roller in the night..."

Jussssssss sayin

 

[macdu]

I would love to see a archaeological forum thread topic study done that would measure at least two things.
1. How many entries before the thread goes off topic.

2. What that topic is, ie.......crash to music lyrics.

 

[gutshotdraw]

I would love to see a archaeological forum thread topic study done that would measure at least two things.
1. How many entries before the thread goes off topic.

2. What that topic is, ie.......crash to music lyrics.

It's what we do.

But this one went deeper than most.

 

[Andy]

Actually, the lyric is "Blinded by the light, revved up like a deuce, another roller in the night..."

Jussssssss sayin

Not roller, runner. Another runner in the night.

I would love to see a archaeological forum thread topic study done that would measure at least two things.
1. How many entries before the thread goes off topic.

2. What that topic is, ie.......crash to music lyrics.

For number 2, here are seven plane crash songs: http://listsof.wordpress.com/2011/12/07/7-songs-for-plane-crashes/

I'm disappointed that 'American Pie' didn't make the list. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_the_Music_Died

 

[100-1/2]

Since we are 'there'...
What exactly are the lyrics:
Corey Heart - I Wear My Sunglasses at Night?

Does anyone find it strange this aircraft is reported to
have hit the sea wall at 103KIAS but had enough velocity
to travel almost 2500' and appears to have become airborne
again by video shot by witnesses?

Would not flying into down drafts of significant wake turbulence
cause erroneous readings on FDR because of a significant change
in relative wind and velocity? but the forward travel of 160k GS
remain largely unchanged? once clear of the turbulence (after
impact) result in the lifting we see in the witness video of the crash?

100-1/2

 

[tankerhead]

Keep drinking and call in sick.

 

[G4dude]

My little corner of the aviation world offers a bit more operational flexibility than many airlines. Even though we have the largest fleet in the corporate/fractional world, for the most part our management doesn't legislate technique (so far, thankfully). That is a luxury many airline pilots do not have.

That means a lot more hand flying (the FUN part of this job) and the right to ignore the magic box, the x-ray vision HUD/EVS, and the other Captain Billy Whizbang gadgetry if it doesn't make sense at the time.

Our greatest challenge is being prepared for 7000 different airports from Aspen to Aruba to Angor Wat. That is also our greatest blessing because it helps prevent the inevitable complacency that can creep into some cockpits.

I do worry about some of the international products of ab initio programs and a single-minded focus on nothing but SOPs, airline operations, and slavish devotion to the magenta line.

Combine that style of training with a steep authority gradient of some foreign cultures and relative lack of "out there on your own in the sky" experience and it becomes apparent how something like this could happen.

Worse yet, there is no easy solution.

The prospect of the aviation world attempting to overcome the shortcomings of Asian culture is a fascinating thing to contemplate. I believe the only efficacious solution is for insurance companies to refuse to do business with carriers who don't toe the line, including having at least one Western pilot in the cockpit at all times. No politics, just hard business decisions making the operation safe.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

including having at least one Western pilot in the cockpit at all times. No politics, just hard business decisions making the operation safe.

Because we all know that western pilots don't crash airplanes!

 

[CaptSeth]

Because we all know that western pilots don't crash airplanes!

The footprint of this accident is familiar to anyone that has experienced the endemic CRM and technical skills issues found in certain Asian carriers, most notably in Korea. We all know when and why Western pilots and instructors were recruited to try and right the sinking KAL ship. This accident has all of the hallmarks of a system that has not yet been corrected.

And I'm not saying everything is just dandy everywhere else, the Colgan crash demonstrated that amply.

 

[glasspilot1]

Whenever there is an accident such as this all the airline training programs, training centers (and one "Academy") in the country will incorporate lessons learned into the next round of recurrent training.

To all of you headed to training in the next few years get ready for your sim instructor to say: "Ok, San Francisco ILS 28L inop, PAPI is notamed out. Autopilot and autothrottles inop. Cleared for visual, cleared to land!

Have fun!

 

[lowtimedriver]

CRM, or the lack of, is a major, major issue with the Korean pilots. How could four pilots just watch the airspeed deteriorate and not say or do anything?

 

[Dornier 335]

Not roller, runner. Another runner in the night.



For number 2, here are seven plane crash songs: http://listsof.wordpress.com/2011/12/07/7-songs-for-plane-crashes/

What about Ruby Vroom's - Is Chicago, is not Chicago? It starts like this:

A man
drives a plane
into the
Chrysler building


This was obviously composed pre 9/11... Never heard a song with stranger lyrics, but who really cares on a late Saturday night!

 

[Dornier 335]

Because we all know that western pilots don't crash airplanes!

Dumb Pilot,

your (ironic) comment actually goes pretty deep. I hold both an FAA and JAR/EASA ATP and the differences between flying here in the US and in Europe couldn't be greater. When I worked contract over in the UK, I was exposed to the typical British "we're better than the Yanks" bashing but was horrified about basic piloting skills. Without going too much into detail, it was much easier to fail your checkride, line check etc. by NOT using the proper radio telephony procedures than showing mediocre flying skills. Some high time F/Os I was flying with got quite nervous when I asked them to handfly on a clear day. On my last check I had a somewhat heated discussion with one of the training captains, and he pointed out that the accident rate is not any higher in Europe and that it would be lower in the US if pilots would be more "procedural" and wouldn't "cowboy" the airplane around.

Food for thought. Accidents do not necessarily reflect a certain safety (or lack of) culture. But his comment got me thinking.

 

[tomgoodman]

To all of you headed to training in the next few years get ready for your sim instructor to say: "Ok, San Francisco ILS 28L inop, PAPI is notamed out. Autopilot and autothrottles inop. Cleared for visual, cleared to land!

Have fun!

That kind of approach used to be a standard simulator training maneuver. In the DC-9, one of them was a long straight-in approach with no flaps or slats. (Not on the check ride, but just to show that you could do it if you had to.) It was fun!