Asiana 777 crashed on landing at SFO

[Flyer1015]

The problem with the conduct of these NTSB briefings is with Deborah Hersman's retirement in the next few months. She announced it before the Asiana crash and makes you wonder if she just wants the last bit of attention before she's gone since no one knew or cared who she was before this accident. Shouldn't the lead investigator be running the show?

She has been privately lobbying for Norman Mineta's Sec DOT job, and DC wasn't impressed with her. With her handling this crash and being very "transparent" she has probably gotten enough media and face time to make an impression on Washington. There's now a good chance she'll be the next Sec DOT.

 

[transpac]

She has been privately lobbying for Norman Mineta's Sec DOT job, and DC wasn't impressed with her. With her handling this crash and being very "transparent" she has probably gotten enough media and face time to make an impression on Washington. There's now a good chance she'll be the next Sec DOT.

Where are you getting this stuff? Anthony Foxx was just sworn in as DOT Secretary replacing Ray LaHood. Norman Mineta left DOT over seven years ago.

 

[Dornier 335]

Asiana flight crew halted passenger evacuation moments after 777 crash

Reminds me of SV163 somehow...

Asiana flight crew halted passenger evacuation moments after 777 crash


A decision by the Asiana Airlines pilots moments after the 6 July crash delayed the evacuation of the passenger cabin for about 90sec, says US National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) chairman Deborah Hersman.
The lead flight attendant entered the cockpit after it came to a stop off Runway 28 Left at San Francisco International airport and asked the flight crew what she should do.
"The flight crew told the flight attendant not to initiate an evacuation," Hersman says.
Instead, the lead flight attendant announced to the passengers to remain seated. In the economy class cabin, however, another flight attendant could see a fire on the No. 2 engine, tucked next to the fuselage around Row 10 of the passenger cabin. He sent another flight attendant to the front to explain to the flight crew that the passengers needed to evacuate, Hersman says.
Videos reviewed by the NTSB show that the passenger doors were not opened and the slides deployed until 90sec after the Boeing 777-200ER with 307 passengers and crew came to a stop.
The reasons for the delayed evacuation order will be scruintised as part fo the NTSB investigation, Hersman says. She noted that the US Federal Aviation Administration requires all aircraft to prove they can be fully evacuated within the time consumed by the 90sec delay caused by the flight crew's inaction.
At the same time, Hersman emphsised that the pilots lacked critical pieces of information in the moments immediately after the crash in which two people died.
"They don't have a good sense of what's going on behind them," Hersman says. "Hindsight is 20:20."
The delayed evacuation caused a scary moment inside the cabin. Two of the emergency escape slides deployed within the cabin after the crash. One of the slides trapped a flight attendant from escaping, even as flames began entering the cabin through window in the fuselage sidewall. Other crew members and firefighters battled the fire while the relief first officer used a utility knife to free the trapped flight attendnant.
The investigation is still focused several critical unanswered questions about the moments just before the crash.
The NTSB still doesn't know why there was apparent confusion in the flight deck about the status of the autothrottles. The 777 crashed after clipped the seawall at the Runway 28L threshold because the aircraft came down too low and was late too correct.
Hersman also says the pilot flying, Lee Gang Guk, reported to investigators during a 4h debriefing that he was "temporarily" blinded by a flash of light from the ground as the aircraft passed through 500ft. The apparent distraction added to the challenge of making simultaneous vertical and lateral corrections at the last minute, while all three flight crew members appeared to lose track of the 777's falling airspeed.

 

[Dan Roman]

Two observations about the "blinded by the light" excuse. If he was, in fact, hit by a laser at 500', than the voice recorder should indicate a callout that he had been blinded and clearly and emphatically informed the crew. Anything else would be a gross breakdown in CRM 101 and as big a mistake as letting the airspeed drop well below ref.
Also, Blinded by the Light is a Bruce Springsteen song. All I've seen is reference to Manfred Mann. He covered it a couple years after Bruce released it on Greetings from Asbury Park. In Bruce's version, it's a deuce, as in little deuce coupe, in Manfred Manns, it has to do with personal hygiene.

 

[tankerhead]

The Boss has also admitted in several interviews that the cover of his song sounds better than the original.

Just read that asiana feels its reputation was damaged by the "renaming" of their "pilots" by the TV station. Death is apparently preferable to dishonor.

 

[gutshotdraw]

Dan,

The ENTIRE EPISODE was a gross breakdown in CRM.

Respectfully,

 

[tankerhead]

In Bruce's version, it's a deuce, as in little deuce coupe, in Manfred Manns, it has to do with personal hygiene.

From Wikipedia:

The Earth Band's recording of the song features several changed lyrics. The most prominent change is in the chorus, where Springsteen's "cut loose like a deuce" is replaced with "revved up like a deuce."[2][3][4] This is commonly misheard as "wrapped up like a ****************************** (the V sound in "revved" is almost unpronounced, and the S sound in "deuce" comes across as "SH" due to a significant lisp)

 

[Andy]

Now, if somebody can explain "Muskrat Love"......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBYV_7a0FQs

Ah, you and Henry Kissinger don't understand the song (watch beginning of video).

Per Wiki: Muskrat Love" is a pop song by written by Willis Alan Ramsey and introduced (as "Muskrat Candlelight") on his sole album the 1972 release Willis Alan Ramsey; the song had its highest profile via a 1976 remake by Captain & Tennille. The song's lyric depicts a romantic liaison between two anthropomorphic muskrats named Susie and Sam.

Perhaps you prefer Hamster Love: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSt2RoZ8Ek4

That song's about eating Hamster.

Or the even less popular Muskrat Gloves: http://www.madmusic.com/song_details.aspx?SongID=7320

Poorly sung song about Muskrats dying from being poisoned and turned into gloves.


Hope that helps, Mr Kissinger.

 

[livin'thesim]

See my vest, see my vest,
Made from real gorilla chest.
Feel this sweater, there's no better
Than authentic Irish Setter...

 

[Tweaker]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBYV_7a0FQs

The song's lyric depicts a romantic liaison between two anthropomorphic muskrats named Susie and Sam.

And Furries have made their 1st appearance on FI.com!

And we wept.

 

[Sparse]

Yah, for most of us who have a little pride in basic "seat of the pants" manual flying airmanship. When I was flying both left and right seat in the 767 I enjoyed the automated stuff, but I also loved clicking off everything and hand flying it to landing also!

The problem many of these carriers will now have to confront is the abandonment of the basics of flying skills and the dependance on the automation of these new birds.

The first autopilot I have operated was (a very primitive one, on todays standards) on a DC-9-32 at Delta airlines. That was after 5 years of private flying, one year of Air Force pilot training and 5 years of Air Force flying. Through my career I used some very advanced A/Ps (767,777). I never missed an opportunity to practice my skills on either of these aircraft. Automation has certainly shortchanged the modern aviator.

 

[Andy]

And Furries have made their 1st appearance on FI.com!

And we wept.

LOL! ... continuing with the music threadjacking, your sentence, 'And we wept' has now taken this thread down the freakish road of Christian heavy metal.

I introduce you to the band Demon Hunter and their song, 'As We Wept.'

http://www.last.fm/music/Demon+Hunter/Demon+Hunter/As+We+Wept

Since it is impossible to make out the lyrics, here they are:

http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric....Demon-Hunter/18A937A51370431948256C700008AB7E

Background on Demon Hunter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Hunter


Kudos to livin'thesim for posting some lyrics from a song from 'The Simpsons' sung by Mr. Burns. Or as Montgomery Burns would say, 'Eggzellent, livin'thesim.'

 

[Tweaker]

Oy, that's terribad.

 

[Traderd]

LOL! ... continuing with the music threadjacking, your sentence, 'And we wept' has now taken this thread down the freakish road of Christian heavy metal.

I introduce you to the band Demon Hunter and their song, 'As We Wept.'

http://www.last.fm/music/Demon+Hunter/Demon+Hunter/As+We+Wept

Since it is impossible to make out the lyrics, here they are:

http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric....Demon-Hunter/18A937A51370431948256C700008AB7E

Background on Demon Hunter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demon_Hunter


Kudos to livin'thesim for posting some lyrics from a song from 'The Simpsons' sung by Mr. Burns. Or as Montgomery Burns would say, 'Eggzellent, livin'thesim.'

In keeping with the thread creep, here's a relevant article;

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/11/tech/web/spotify-misquoted-lyrics/index.html?hpt=hp_bn5

"...Excuse me while I kiss this guy..." "..Hold me closer Tony Danza..."; funny stuff.

Always thought the Doobie Brothers were the kings of unintelligible lyrics myself, although after listening to "As We Wept" I think there is a new king on the block. Well. Ozzie is still exceptionally difficult to understand at times.

 

[Andy]

Oy, that's terribad.

Nice! With that post, most would expect me to take this thread to Israel in search of a song. Nope; we're going to Bollywood in the exciting subcontinent of India. And the soundtrack of the movie Oye! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oye!_(film)

I chose the Oy Oy Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxiBXT1mJMY

But rather than just a link to a cheaply made video, I have also posted the version that you would see on Indian MTv, produced by Virtual Soul Pictures: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrwUTF4LklM

Oy Oy! Enjoy joy!

 

[dicko]

Two observations about the "blinded by the light" excuse. If he was, in fact, hit by a laser at 500', than the voice recorder should indicate a callout that he had been blinded and clearly and emphatically informed the crew. Anything else would be a gross breakdown in CRM 101 and as big a mistake as letting the airspeed drop well below ref.
Also, Blinded by the Light is a Bruce Springsteen song. All I've seen is reference to Manfred Mann. He covered it a couple years after Bruce released it on Greetings from Asbury Park. In Bruce's version, it's a deuce, as in little deuce coupe, in Manfred Manns, it has to do with personal hygiene.

There is a massive United hangar that faces 28R. The flight landed in the late morning. The sun was in the East. The hangar does reflect the light. I'm stating the blindingly obvious ...... Pun intended.

None of this is an excuse for crashing an airplane. Touch wood.

 

[Andy]

Touch wood.

Hmmm. The Sporting Wood song is probably appropriate. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rEa_REBMs8

 

[Dornier 335]

Yah, for most of us who have a little pride in basic "seat of the pants" manual flying airmanship. When I was flying both left and right seat in the 767 I enjoyed the automated stuff, but I also loved clicking off everything and hand flying it to landing also!

The problem many of these carriers will now have to confront is the abandonment of the basics of flying skills and the dependance on the automation of these new birds.

This YouTube video should be made "sticky".

 

[Flyer1015]

This YouTube video should be made "sticky".

The NTSB criticized his AAMP material for suggesting aggressive rudder control at high AOA, and for basically adopting F4 maneuvering procedures into Part 121 transport airliners.

 

[waveflyer]

Ok, so don't do that-
But the idea in the video is still be a farking pilot