ASA/XJT update

[rjacobs]

when i got hired at ASA many moons ago, i remember similar rhetoric coming from Comair.. some of you guys really need to know where you work. We do NOT have the same leverage as Delta, etc pilots... we just dont... and never will. understanding that, and little dose of the real world would be great for some of you ..

i enjoy ASA, i stayed here for a reason. I dont expect 22 days off, duty/trip rigs of 7 hours and $3 an hour per diem..i dont know. Maybe my experience in corporate finance before i came here made me too rational. I learned long ago, that when your company makes money, you have a job.

I never said I, nor the union, are expecting anything crazy from this contract. I personally am not a 50% raise with 8 weeks vacation, no PBS, etc... guy. I do expect reasonable gains in all areas(of my contract) since I am not interested in a concessionary contract in any way. I will look at PBS as an overall part of the contract and decide for myself if what is being proposed works. I will work under what I am currently working under before I will work under a concessionary contract. So looking at your contract and "reasonable gains" would possibly be concessionary to our contract. So what we think of as "reasonable gains" would to a lot of the LASA guys be ridiculous demands, but in reality its not much better than what we have now.

We do have guys that are stuck on one aspect of the contract and refuse to even think beyond that, I will admit that. Its a good thing those guys dont represent the pilot group at the table and they are probably less than 1% of our total pilots. Most guys I fly with are interested in seeing the total package not just pay rates, or not just PBS, or not just vacation. The guys advocating so hard against one thing either wont vote at all or when the time comes will vote yes for what they have been rallying against and then will still be vocal against it. I cant find a single guy who voted yes to our pay cuts in 2008, but it passed.

Like I said, I honestly dont know what the hangup is(I have my suspicions), but for the company to try an end run around finishing negotiations and getting an SLI done so they can move people around is absolutely ridiculous in my book and I am glad MY union said no.

 

[Nevets]

when i got hired at ASA many moons ago, i remember similar rhetoric coming from Comair.. some of you guys really need to know where you work. We do NOT have the same leverage as Delta, etc pilots... we just dont... and never will. understanding that, and little dose of the real world would be great for some of you ..

i enjoy ASA, i stayed here for a reason. I dont expect 22 days off, duty/trip rigs of 7 hours and $3 an hour per diem..i dont know. Maybe my experience in corporate finance before i came here made me too rational. I learned long ago, that when your company makes money, you have a job.

I honestly think it just simply comes down to the XJT pilots not wanting to take any other concession in a new contract. I've got plan B. I suggest everyone have one. That is where the leverage comes from.

 

[www.]

This was one reason why our illustrious ex MEC chair was ousted. He was willing to roll over to whatever their demands where and when the rest of the union found out what was REALLY going on, they were pissed.

Company is trying the furlough and bring em over to ASA as an end run around actually FINISHING THE ********************ING MERGER and the union told them that. They said if you want to move people around FINISH NEGOTIATING and get an SLI done and be free to move people wherever you want.

This contract could be done in a week if the company decided they wanted to play ball. So dont go blaming us. I am not privy to what is being said at the table or what our "demands" are, but I have a hard time believing WE are the ones stalling negotiations. It aint you guys either, its the company. They can do what they want, but they choose to play the game same as we are playing the game.

If we furlough and shrink and what not, so what, I am not giving in to managements demands as an end run around FINISHING WHAT THEY STARTED. If they didn't want us merged, why buy us in the first place...

Someone is blowing smoke up your ---. There was a deal until your guys decided to change the demands. You guys have done this several time over the last 2 years. So now they will do it by the book and there is a possibility that a great deal of pilots will not come over to the ASA side as we continue to hire off the street.

 

[rjacobs]

Someone is blowing smoke up your ---. There was a deal until your guys decided to change the demands. You guys have done this several time over the last 2 years. So now they will do it by the book and there is a possibility that a great deal of pilots will not come over to the ASA side as we continue to hire off the street.

a deal on what? furloughing our guys and moving them over to the ASA side as new hires? OR a full contract?

Yea our MEC chair(that was removed) was willing to do ANYTHING the company asked(with pleasure I might also add) and that was why he was removed. So if you see us removing a management shill from our MEC and the new guy says no way as "changing our demands" than I guess yea, we changed our demands.

I dont see a single one of our guys being furloughed unless something drastic happens. And who cares if you guys are hiring guys onto the bottom of your list, they will STILL be below any guy at XJT that doesnt get furloughed when the lists are merged.

If mgmt wants to move guys around without getting an SLI than I say let them take our guys, but they have to go over there with DOH seniority and longevity for bidding and pay, NOT as new hires on year one pay at the very bottom of the list. They can right size the companies all they want, but they are going to get ZERO advantage for doing so.

 

[enuffalready]

I honestly think it just simply comes down to the XJT pilots not wanting to take any other concession in a new contract. I've got plan B. I suggest everyone have one. That is where the leverage comes from.

i agree... you are smart to have plan b in this industry no matter where you work. Guess we will see what happens.

 

[enuffalready]

a deal on what? furloughing our guys and moving them over to the ASA side as new hires? OR a full contract?

Yea our MEC chair(that was removed) was willing to do ANYTHING the company asked(with pleasure I might also add) and that was why he was removed. So if you see us removing a management shill from our MEC and the new guy says no way as "changing our demands" than I guess yea, we changed our demands.

I dont see a single one of our guys being furloughed unless something drastic happens. And who cares if you guys are hiring guys onto the bottom of your list, they will STILL be below any guy at XJT that doesnt get furloughed when the lists are merged.

If mgmt wants to move guys around without getting an SLI than I say let them take our guys, but they have to go over there with DOH seniority and longevity for bidding and pay, NOT as new hires on year one pay at the very bottom of the list. They can right size the companies all they want, but they are going to get ZERO advantage for doing so.

i remember quite of few guys hired a while ago that got here( ASA) only to learn they were going to the ERJ. Nobody at ASA had a problem with it because we thought it gave the company some flexibilty and it didnt really cost us anything in negotiations. At the time we were hearing furloughs at ASA... and guess what, we still didnt hold some new hire hostage, especially when using them as leverage doesnt gain either side and just comes out as unreasonable. but hey, you guys do what you need to do.

 

[Uncle Bunkle]

ASA rocks. I want an AceyPalooza ticket! Go Atlanta! woo!!!!!!
Who needs a contract when I'm getting a free turkey?
Gimme a ride in a Mini Indy car, don't worry about Painmaker!
Roll my day off, then don't restore it, it's ok.
Thank you, may I have another?
I love surveys that don't apply to flight crews, but to the people in the cubicles...
We're getting iPads tomorrow! AeroData in da house!
Take away my Business travel insurance, I won't notice!
Oooh look, a shiny pin!
Surely, a jet. Are you Sure? Raise your hands if you're Sure!

 

[LHRCrewDog]

Well stated, Nevjets, Plan B is a must.

JoeM, I just cannot see the common sense in us taking concessions with Eagle and Republic offering $5000 signing bonuses (2 year contract) to find qualified candidates. Times are changing and our 50 seaters are gone, regardless. We are not overpaid on the ERJ side. I have no idea who this supposed pilot is that broke $300K. In the 6+ years as a captain, and working pretty hard, I have never seen 90K+.

Any concessionary contract, for the LXJT side, will find very little, if any, support.

 

[duc driver]

Based on PCL/Mesaba/Colgan seniority integration award formula, the senior most XJT pilot would be placed about 380 on the list with relative after that.

Company asked XJT MEC to transfer XJT pilots to ASA side and/or voluntary furloughs...XJT MEC said no to both requests...

Fasten your seat belts....

If this is true why are you the only one bringing it up.

 

[enuffalready]

Well stated, Nevjets, Plan B is a must.

JoeM, I just cannot see the common sense in us taking concessions with Eagle and Republic offering $5000 signing bonuses (2 year contract) to find qualified candidates. Times are changing and our 50 seaters are gone, regardless. We are not overpaid on the ERJ side. I have no idea who this supposed pilot is that broke $300K. In the 6+ years as a captain, and working pretty hard, I have never seen 90K+.

Any concessionary contract, for the LXJT side, will find very little, if any, support.

i dont think anyone is asking you to fly the erj for 60k. I can bet you had the legacy XJT taken the PBS that ASA already has and an overwhelming majority of pilots are happy with, this deal would have been done a year or more ago.

and there is NO WAY a regional pilot made 300k. thats total crap