ASA Taking Furloughed Delta Pilots?

[FlyingSig]

What specific airline wasn't mentioned, DAL!

Here we go again...

Krusty, who set up your strike center in both CVG and MCO? Who designed the software to track struck work? (I'll give you a hint, it wasn't Comair pilots)

I go go round and round like has been done on this forum before, but I won't. There will always be those that have a chip on their shoulder and don't realize just how much effort was done on their behalf.

 

[Krusty]

I know it has, I got carried away, Do you even know where the strike center was? and how can you admit to setting up the strike center?

 

[Humblepilot]

True

Krusty,

I recognize there is a fair amount of tension between regional and mainline carriers. But who is the enemy here?

Everyone repeat after me....M...A..N..A..G..E..M..E..N..T.

They LOVE infighting. It works against both sides and they feed off of discontent.

I didn't mean to bring up old sores. I just hate seeing pilot groups directing anger against one another. I would rather see support and concern.

Humble

 

[Krusty]

nice reply, all do respect...

this is a dead issue also, but that whole thing, DAL refused us jumpseats, management or not, I've seen pilots look out for pilots, but that was a sad example.
DAL pilots could have made an arrangement to get us on if we needed a ride, aren't we all trying to stick together or what?

 

[jetexas]

If only we could figure out a way to whipsaw management against each other, *sigh*. Now that would be classic!!

 

[NYRANGERS]

nice reply, all do respect...

this is a dead issue also, but that whole thing, DAL refused us jumpseats, management or not, I've seen pilots look out for pilots, but that was a sad example.
DAL pilots could have made an arrangement to get us on if we needed a ride, aren't we all trying to stick together or what?

So your solution is retaliation against most junior pilots at Delta? Sorry most of the 918 pilots were unable to help. I think the directive from MANAGEMENT was that they would fire a pilot who did not uphold their directive.

In my opinion, the Delta pilots were in a tough position, it is too bad there wasn't more they could do.

I wish I could have helped all you guys out, I was in Delta new hire orientation. Where MANAGEMENT said "welcome to the last job you will ever need" "Hey guys and girl, WE got you furlough protection"

 

[Sinca3]

Decision?

So since when did pilots at ASA (DCI) have a say in who is hired and wether or not they keep their senority number??????
Welcome aboard new hires.....including DAL pilots!

 

[MetroSheriff]

Good one Surlpus1!

Yea, smell the coffee!

You young low time ASA guys are just drinking too much company Koolaid, and wouldn't want to upset a chance to kiss up to a couple premadonna Delta guys that wouldn't have given you the time of day one year ago.

I see it now, you happen to be a new Capt on the RJ and get a Delta Guy as an FO and you say, " Hey, this is great to fly with you, since you have all that great time and all, flyin' all that 737 and stuff. How am I doin'? Do you think Delta might hire me, or now that we have flown together, can you give me a recommendation?"

Krusty,

Do you ever get tired of carrying around that big ol' chip on your shoulder?

"Young low time ASA guys...." Bit of a generalization, don't you think?

Sorry you are such a bitter old man who is unhappy with the cards life dealt you. Try a little soul-searching and you may find your $hitty attitude has had a little something to do with it.

Take it out on someone else and grow up.

 

[surplus1]

Re: So?

So if I follow your logic, as a former United pilot I should resign my seniority to come fly with you?

If you want to work here, the answer is yes. Wouldn't I have to give up my number to work at UAL? What makes you think you're different because you worked at UAL? You're a pilot just like me, no more, no less.

Btw....did you enjoy the food when I was writing checks to the foodbank when you were on strike? I wrote two because I was still on probation and they weren't deducting from our paychecks. You didn't have any problem taking my money and now you want my seniority number....rightttttttttttttttttt.

Whoa, buddy. When you were on strike at UAL in '85 I gave too and you don't ever see me asking for special treatment because of it. If you gave because you wanted to .... then thank you. If you gave because you wanted something in return ... then you should have kept your money. We're not for sale.

Nobody's asking for your seniority number. You can keep it 'till he1l freezes over. If you want to work here, then you have to give it up. If you don't want to work here that's ok too. We'll manage without you just like you manage without us.

Remind yourself who your friends are. We were the ones standing behind you. Now that this fight is over, you want to ignore that.

And you remind yourself of the very same thing. Anything you do for us we will do for you and you don't have to do it first. Doing for your friends is not about pay backs, it's because you care. The fact that I gave during your strike of '85 doesn't entitle me to any special treatment at UAL and neither does the fact that you gave in '01 entitle you to special treament here. The fact that you're even bringing that up questions your sincerity.

BTW, where were you in '85?

And before you make the argument, you can't have a different policy based on where the furloughee comes from.
Good luck
Humble

With that I agree 100%. The policy should be the same for everyone. I'll even go further than that. If we are going to hire without seniority resignation, then Delta pilots should have preference for every one of those jobs!

 

[Director]

National Senority List

If ALPA had a national senority list this would not be an issue!!!!

 

[MetroSheriff]

Re: National Senority List

If ALPA had a national senority list this would not be an issue!!!!

And if pigs had wings....


Well they don't and ALPA doesn't. How about something a bit more constructive?

20000 hours of experience in the industry and this is the best you can do?

Go find a non-ALPA carrier if you hate them so much. NSL will never happen. Why not work for more attainable goals?

 

[ACE]

What it all comes down to is double standards. I could not go to Delta and keep my seniority number at Comair just in case I was furloughed. I don't even think the ALPA bylaws allow this (double seniority numbers). I could be wrong, I threw out all my ALPA propaganda. I would not care if DAL pilots or any furloughed pilot came to Comair, as long as seniority numbers are resigned. As a matter of fact, some furloughed pilots are at Comair. However, I would be very skeptical if DAL pilots said they were given up their numbers. Because when there are recalls those resignations could be forgotten or lost. It depends on the what kind of slimey deal the DAL MEC makes with management.

 

[Director]

Re: Re: National Senority List

And if pigs had wings....


Well they don't and ALPA doesn't. How about something a bit more constructive?

20000 hours of experience in the industry and this is the best you can do?

Go find a non-ALPA carrier if you hate them so much. NSL will never happen. Why not work for more attainable goals?

How about a change!!! There are more of us than them. It time for a NEW organization.

So quit whining and do something

www.noalpa.com

 

[MetroSheriff]

Re: Re: Re: National Senority List

How about a change!!! There are more of us than them. It time for a NEW organization.

So quit whining and do something

www.noalpa.com

Ummm, I don't recall whining about anything.

 

[FlyingSig]

It depends on the what kind of slimey deal the DAL MEC makes with management.

Don't worry, DAL management will protect you. Here's what the VP of flight ops has to say about the subject:

Resignation Guidelines for Delta Pilots
4/2/02
General: Some companies have a policy that requires a pilot to resign from the pilot’s current employment as a condition of being hired at the new airline or another company. Many airlines and companies do not have such a policy. Delta will cooperate with other airlines and companies that have such a policy, with the expectation that the same consideration and professional courtesy be given to Delta in similar situations. However, it remains the responsibility of the pilot who accepts employment at another airline or company to take the required actions to comply with the resignation policy. The following are following are guidelines describing how to handle pilot resignations.
Guidelines:
All resignation letters from pilots should be submitted to Delta’s Director-FlightOperations.
Furloughed pilots are encouraged not to submit a resignation until employment has been secured and all hiring contingencies have been satisfied.
After Delta receives a resignation letter from a pilot, the pilot’s employment with Delta will be severed and the pilot will be removed from the Delta Air Lines pilot’s system seniority
list.
Note: Anyone at Delta who receives such a resignation letter must promptly forward the letter to the Director-Flight Operations. Failure to forward the letter will not preserve the pilot’s employment with Delta.

 

[MetroSheriff]

What it all comes down to is double standards. I could not go to Delta and keep my seniority number at Comair just in case I was furloughed. I don't even think the ALPA bylaws allow this (double seniority numbers). I could be wrong, I threw out all my ALPA propaganda. I would not care if DAL pilots or any furloughed pilot came to Comair, as long as seniority numbers are resigned. As a matter of fact, some furloughed pilots are at Comair. However, I would be very skeptical if DAL pilots said they were given up their numbers. Because when there are recalls those resignations could be forgotten or lost. It depends on the what kind of slimey deal the DAL MEC makes with management.

Hey ACE, take a break, huh? You are not required to be an idiot your whole life.

 

[DaveGriffin]

If only we could figure out a way to whipsaw management against each other, *sigh*. Now that would be classic!!

You have it (works great in good economic times) and ALPA crows about its success: pattern bargaining. "UAL plus" was a great example. Like any other successful tactic it doesn't always work so well when the environment changes. And the environment has definitely changed.

 

[Visceral]

On one hand, I can't figure out how it would be a good idea for any carrier to hire pilots that won't give up their seniority numbers. Since Delta doesn't seem likely to go under, all of the pilots will surely go back once they are offered a job again. If that is next week or not, nobody knows. But it seems a waste to train somebody for a job that is merely serving as a placekeeper for that person.

On the other hand, what makes that Delta pilot so different than any other pilot trying to get a job. They both will likely show a high degree of dedication and professionalism. And both would likely jump at the chance to get hired(or re-employed) by a major carrier like Delta, leaving the regional job empty.

I really don't know.....

 

[~~~^~~~]

what makes that Delta pilot so different than any other pilot trying to get a job. They both will likely show a high degree of dedication and professionalism. And both would likely jump at the chance to get hired(or re-employed) by a major carrier like Delta, leaving the regional job empty.

I really don't know.....

One difference is that they are not quitting Delta. They keep their date of hire, they keep their 401K and retirement plans without having to roll them over because Delta / Comair and ASA are the same employer in the eyes of the Internal Revenue Service. Reference the section on the "same desk rule."

In the ASA Contract opener we have asked that any WO Delta Connection pilot on furlough be given full DOH rights at ASA. It is hoped that this is a first step to protect ourselves from whipsaw. If a pilot is furloughed from Comair, they can come to ASA with their DOH.

If the Delta pilots and ALPA had done anything but try to belittle us and destroy our opportunities we would probably be doing even more to try to help them. As is, I think we did a lot because management did not want to incurr the expense of training pilots that we know we are going to lose when Delta rebounds.

 

[DaveGriffin]

I really don't know.....

Hey Darth;
Have you separated from the AF yet?